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Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by NovaScotiaPatsFan, Oct 20, 2010.

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  1. NovaScotiaPatsFan

    NovaScotiaPatsFan In the Starting Line-Up

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    In the wake of the Merriweather hit and the others around the league I've heard a lot of people (accuratly) describe the current helmets as "weapons"

    so i'm wondering, do the helmets need to be that hard on the outside to do their job of protecting the head? I know very little about this sort of thing so I'm wondering if some of my more learned peers can discuss it.
     
  2. Big-T

    Big-T Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    They're made of plastic, it's going to hurt use leather or rugby style headgear if the league has to wear helmets because the plastic ones encourage helmet to helmet hits and imo, are a main factor in causing concussions.
     
  3. sbpatfan

    sbpatfan Banned

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    People are going to get cracked in the head no matter what they use.
     
  4. Synovia

    Synovia In the Starting Line-Up

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    They're polycarbonate. (Which is a type of plastic.. I'm just afraid someone is going to come in with "only plastic"). The stuff they make bulletproof glass (and nalgene bottles) out of. Hit someone hard with a Nalgene bottle.


    I'd almost like to see the boxing glove effect-cover the helmet in some sort of cushion. It'd look ridiculous, but it would distribute the force a bit, and make the helmet a significantly less effective weapon.
     
  5. Haley

    Haley In the Starting Line-Up

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    No Jersey Selected

    It would be nice if they could make them lighter, for more than this reason, I'd imagine.
     
  6. WhiteWesWelker88

    WhiteWesWelker88 Banned

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    [​IMG]






    this helmet would cut down on the issue:D




    It surely would cut down on the illegal hits that the league is trying to modify,
     
  7. Synovia

    Synovia In the Starting Line-Up

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    You do realize that when they used those helmets, people dieing during games wasn't unheard of, right?
     
  8. SEPatsFan

    SEPatsFan Practice Squad Player

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    I read somewhere that this had been studied, and the result was a greater chance of serious neck injuries. The hard/smooth helmet shell generally slides and deflects when it hits something else. A soft shell does not do that, and brings an entirely different set of risks to the table.

    SSDD
     
  9. Synovia

    Synovia In the Starting Line-Up

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    Just can't win I guess.


    Although they do have some great AntiConcussive helmets out there.. most players won't wear them though, because they're bigger than the ones that they grew up with (and some players say they restrict vision).

    Brady and Manning both wear them, IIRC.
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2010
  10. PlainOldEd

    PlainOldEd Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    If this is true the NFL should mandate that all players wear them. Period.
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2010
  11. Batman

    Batman Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    Helmet design has changed so much over the last 10 years now, since 02 we have seen 6 new major helmets.

    Riddell we have the revo and revo speed both larger in size than older helmets to spread area of impact both have new ways to fasten a facemask with large bottom holds and traditional top holds. Both have full adjustable interior inflation and inflatable cheek pads. The revo speed has more like motorcycle padding inside for extra comfort and better protection. Most of our linemen wear one of these 2 helmets.

    Xenith have entered the market and have a traditional shape and size however very different internal parts the part that fits the skull is attached to few round shock absorbers to reduce the amount of contact between the head and helmet but enough to keep it tight to one's head.

    Schutt have made 3 new helmets the Air XP, DNA and the ION4d, they all have the same internals a blue bubbled plastic part then and inflatable bladder The Air XP is most like a traditional helmet in design although had a more tapered shape to the rear rather than round this is to direct the force of hit to the head away from the front top side of the helmet. The DNA has a larger overall size to increase the spread of impact this is far more tapered in shape to the back and rear to have the same effect at the Air XP. The ION4d is the newest one they have made has a new shape and also the facemask is intergraded to the helmet the top is rounded but had a raised toothed area this is to more evenly spread force that is made from contact to the forehead area where a concussion is more likely to occur from.

    All of these helmets are lighter than older helmets such as the schutt air advantage or the riddell VSR4 both of those use polystyrene and rubber bladder as internal support not a lot of protection from them. I use a schutt air xp myself I wanted a ion4d or a revo speed but struggle to get one to fit my head so went with the easy choice. So the helmet manufacturer are doing a lot to try and help with this but they all advise that football is violent and dangerous and even when used correctly injury or death can occur.
     
  12. lamafist

    lamafist Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    Adding on to this key bit of info, I've also been told the problem with the hard shell helmet isn't the fairly small amount of added momentum imparted by a shorter, sharper impact so much as its incredible effectiveness at protecting a player prepared for impact.

    All concussions are caused not by the initial blow directly, but by the sudden change of vector by the player's head that causes the brain to bang up against the inside of the skull. The reason why the receiver or QB usually gets the worst of a helmet to helmet his is that the defender comes in positioned with his head lowered and neck pulled in so that the helmet takes the brunt of the impact, while the recipient of the hit gets his head violently whiplashed.

    The advantage of the softer helmets in terms of concussions was not the padded impact, but the fact that they were ineffective enough that it was still in the defender's best interest to avoid helmet-to-helmet contact.

    Interestingly, someone mentioned boxing-glove padding as an inspiration for a head-sparing helmet. The point of boxing gloves isn't really to protect the head -- it's to protect the hands from shattering on the skull. There are still plenty of concussions in boxing -- they're called "knockouts." Like in football, a fighter can take a fair amount of contact to the head if he's adequately braced for it. It's when a fighter gets caught out of proper defensive posture that he gets dropped.
     
  13. Calciumee

    Calciumee PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Have to agree!

    When I played, I took a helmet-to-helmet hit during training, from an O-Lineman!

    F***ing painful! Horrible feeling!
     
  14. jmt57

    jmt57 Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    How about the Maher mouthguard? I know the Pats use them as a deterrent to concussions; what about the rest of the league? Not a perfect and final solution, but perhaps that could help some if it is not already in use now.
     
  15. JediMind

    JediMind Practice Squad Player

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    Mark Kelso use to wear an additional top on his helmet to reduce concussions. It looked silly but it must have offered extra protection.
     
  16. convertedpatsfan

    convertedpatsfan PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    This. I read that some high school teams are now doing this, so there's no reason that NFL teams couldn't also do it. I would make it mandatory though, along with the Maher mouthguard. Once a player gets a concussion, they have a high likelihood of having another unless they take a lot of time off, which most players/coaches don't want.

    As an owner, I would make it mandatory for my team if the league didn't. If I just spent $65 million on a wide receiver, I'd want to make sure he had a $2,000 helmet and a $500 mouthguard to reduce the risk of him missing 2 to 4 weeks from a concussion.
     
  17. Marko

    Marko On the Game Day Roster

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    There's a company named Xenith out of Lowell that makes these for the Pop Warner level to the pros. Boston seems to be the epicenter of the study of long term concussive effects.
     
  18. Bill B.

    Bill B. Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    What about the helmet that Willie Lanier used to wear. It was padded to prevent injuring opponents because Lanier used to tackle with his head all the time. Sure it was ugly, but it might be more effective than current helmets.
     

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  19. Patriot Missile

    Patriot Missile Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    I think they should design new helmets with butterflies and lady bugs on them.
     
  20. Metaphors

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    This is the part that people just don't get. There are numerous ways to induce this sudden acceleration that have nothing to do with helmet-to-helmet contact...the most common of which is for a player to be taken to the ground without being able to brace for impact. Helmets have some shock-absorbing affects, but that isn't their primary function. Mouthguards can absorb impact energy, but only from shock to the chin (which happens to be a fairly common impact point).

    Bottom line...concussions will rise as players get bigger and faster. Force equals mass times acceleration. Larger mass, greater acceleration, stronger forces, more concussions. The real issue is trying to remove elements of the game that are not only unsafe, but are less effective than technically sound alternatives. For example, leaving your feet to deliver a hit is never the best option. Removing launching from the game would result in fewer injuries (not concussions, but neck/back/shoulder) and better football results.
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2010
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