Greg Cosell: With Cassel at QB, Pats have below-average offense

[vandergraafgenerator]

Re: Greg Cosell:With Cassel at QB, Pats have below-average offense

Happy to spell it out for you-

Cassell, no pocket presence, immobile, not sharp, wilts under pressure, average arm combined with a crappy Oline this is disaster


KO- quick, can move around, good pocket presence, rocket arm, exciting



shouldn't the rest of this year be spent developing KO and give the fans some excitement and something to cheer for

I would say leave it be for a while but if we go to 3 and 6 ,it's time to start KO just in case Brady doesn't make it for next season.

 

[marcus]

Re: Greg Cosell:With Cassel at QB, Pats have below-average offense

Why is everyone a homer? Because we believe BB, and the rest of the staff know more than you about who can lead this team. I've never stated that Cassel is great, but I do think he will get better with experience. If BB, who sees more in practice than either of us, decides to give KO a shot, than I'll trust his judgement. That doesnt mean i'm drinking koolaid, or homer juice, it just means I TRUST, AND HAVE FAITH IN THE COACH!

The reason many are going to argue with you, is because all you have to offer to this is, "kevin is better than Cassel", and so you must know more than our coach. I think not.

Many of us on this board, simply choose to believe that Bill knows whats best for this team. You're not one of them. If Bill suddenly decides to go with KO, you, and briz, and the other twits will be posting for days about how you know everything.

I think you are stating the obvious. Of course BB knows and sees more than we do. WE are not teh coach and do not have the knowledge or experience he does. This forum is about offereing "armchair opinions" based on what is observed during games

HOWEVER, even with all that experience, BB and Pioli have been wrong and they have been wrong many times. It seems like it would be not a whole lot of fun to follow BB and Pioli like sheep without ever questioning.
BB was way off base about Chad Jackson, the entire 2007 draft except maybe Meriweather, the Super Bowl game for not having Gostowski kick the field goaland certainly he was absolutely wrong for not having a more experienced backup quarterback on this team and allowing for a whole season to flush down the drain because of TBs injury.

So this line about "We trust BB and Pioli to do what is right" is kind of like being in some blind worshipping cult.

Many on this board do NOT buy into the BB knows whats best 100% of the time. It just is not a credible argument.
I personally agree 100% with Chris Carter.
BB and Pioli completely blew it and this season by not preparing properly for the risk of injury to TB. This erro is going to cost the Patriots a full season when many of their players are in their prime.

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

Re: Greg Cosell:With Cassel at QB, Pats have below-average offense

I personally agree 100% with Chris Carter.
BB and Pioli completely blew it and this season by not preparing properly for the risk of injury to TB. This erro is going to cost the Patriots a full season when many of their players are in their prime.

Properly prepare? but at what cost? Maybe the qb's out there just werent worth the price, whether it be draft picks, or a big cap hit. The odds were pretty good that Brady would be ok. I'd call it a risk that they took, not that they blew it. Its also still early to say that the risk they took has cost them a full season.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Re: Greg Cosell:With Cassel at QB, Pats have below-average offense

Many on this board do NOT buy into the BB knows whats best 100% of the time. It just is not a credible argument.
I personally agree 100% with Chris Carter.
BB and Pioli completely blew it and this season by not preparing properly for the risk of injury to TB. This erro is going to cost the Patriots a full season when many of their players are in their prime.

But you're assuming that with another QB, the Pats would automatically be SB contenders. Given the way the D has been playing, that's not at all a given.

Besides, in a perverse sort of way, it's almost a no-lose situation--either Cassel leads the team to the playoffs, in which case BB looks like something of a genius, or the Pats get relatively high draft picks in a draft where they could really use them.

 

[JSn]

Re: Greg Cosell:With Cassel at QB, Pats have below-average offense

But you're assuming that with another QB, the Pats would automatically be SB contenders. Given the way the D has been playing, that's not at all a given.

Besides, in a perverse sort of way, it's almost a no-lose situation--either Cassel leads the team to the playoffs, in which case BB looks like something of a genius, or the Pats get relatively high draft picks in a draft where they could really use them.

Even if we lose tonight, we're tied with a team that's supposed stacked with talent and an all-pro QB.

Call our wins shallow, but the Jets lost to OAKLAND.

 

[Clonamery]

Re: Greg Cosell:With Cassel at QB, Pats have below-average offense

I personally agree 100% with Chris Carter.

Says it all baby!

 

[Pats726]

This is just another practice squad thread...

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Re: Greg Cosell:With Cassel at QB, Pats have below-average offense

I personally agree 100% with Chris Carter.
BB and Pioli completely blew it and this season by not preparing properly for the risk of injury to TB. This erro is going to cost the Patriots a full season when many of their players are in their prime.

Ludicrous.
BB maybe should have traded picks for vet Huard? He got routed. For vet Brad Johnson? Pathetic. I know, Garcia won Sunday so in the 1 in 8 chance that Brady would suddenly miss games THIS season, BB should have traded what it took to sign fan fav Garcia. And what guarantee would there be that Garcia (or whomever) would adapt well to our quite different system and lead us to SB victory? Tom HOF Brady didn't these last 3 seasons with this team.

This team sorely needs more YOUNG, fast, agressive football talent while remaining within the salary cap so that every game vets that contribute can still be afforded. Spending big cap money and draft pick(s) on somebody else's "not good enough to start" backup works counter to the competitive viability of this franchise.

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: Greg Cosell:With Cassel at QB, Pats have below-average offense

Ludicrous.
BB maybe should have traded picks for vet Huard? He got routed. For vet Brad Johnson? Pathetic. I know, Garcia won Sunday so in the 1 in 8 chance that Brady would suddenly miss games THIS season, BB should have traded what it took to sign fan fav Garcia. And what guarantee would there be that Garcia (or whomever) would adapt well to our quite different system and lead us to SB victory? Tom HOF Brady didn't these last 3 seasons with this team.

This team sorely needs more YOUNG, fast, agressive football talent while remaining within the salary cap so that every game vets that contribute can still be afforded. Spending big cap money and draft pick(s) on somebody else's "not good enough to start" backup works counter to the competitive viability of this franchise.

Garcia was the opening day starter for the Bucs, so the player to look at from Tampa is actually Brian Griese. Mr. Griese had 4 tds, 6 ints and a 64.6 rating while on the job this year.

 

[JSn]

Re: Greg Cosell:With Cassel at QB, Pats have below-average offense

Garcia was the opening day starter for the Bucs, so the player to look at from Tampa is actually Brian Griese. Mr. Griese had 4 tds, 6 ints and a 64.6 rating while on the job this year.

I wish there was a thread that was tracking back-up and first-time starter success this year, but I don't know where to collect all that info.

Still, I have a feeling Cassel is in the upper echelon of that crop, especially since he should be credited 3-2, not 2-2.

 

[crowell33]

This is just another practice squad thread...

Are you saying Cassel should be on the practice squad? I disagree. Most people feel that Cassel should be a second or third stringer behind O'Connel and maybe Guit, but to say Cassel should be on the practice squad is just unfair.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Most people feel that Cassel should be a second or third stringer behind O'Connel and maybe Guit

Makes me thankfull that "most people" are not coaching this team and that Bill Belichick is making the decisions.

"Most people" believe in ghosts, UFOs as butt probing space aliens, the list goes on...

 

[Nunchucks]

I think that when people critisize Belichick for not properly preparing for a season if Brady goes down, they mean that Belichick screwed up by not already having a vet QB with experience on the roster in training camp. Belichick screwed up in believing that Cassel would be good enough.

Cassel can come in and play a game or two, but the Patriots did not have a legitimate backup QB. They could have gotten a whole host of has beens and neverwas guys back at the start of TC and any of those guys would have been more prepared to face nfl defenses than Matt Cassel. That is where Belichick made the mistake.

Now that the season had started though, Belichick is probably right to stick with Cassel, even though he sucks....he sucks while knowing the system

 

[Deus Irae]

I think that when people critisize Belichick for not properly preparing for a season if Brady goes down, they mean that Belichick screwed up by not already having a vet QB with experience on the roster in training camp. Belichick screwed up in believing that Cassel would be good enough.

Cassel can come in and play a game or two, but the Patriots did not have a legitimate backup QB. They could have gotten a whole host of has beens and neverwas guys back at the start of TC and any of those guys would have been more prepared to face nfl defenses than Matt Cassel. That is where Belichick made the mistake.

Now that the season had started though, Belichick is probably right to stick with Cassel, even though he sucks....he sucks while knowing the system

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

I think that when people critisize Belichick for not properly preparing for a season if Brady goes down, they mean that Belichick screwed up by not already having a vet QB with experience on the roster in training camp.
Cassel can come in and play a game or two, but the Patriots did not have a legitimate backup QB. They could have gotten a whole host of has beens and neverwas guys back at the start of TC and any of those guys would have been more prepared to face nfl defenses than Matt Cassel. That is where Belichick made the mistake.

No.
BB maybe should have traded picks for vet Huard? He got routed. For vet Brad Johnson? Pathetic. I know, Garcia won Sunday so in the 1 in 8 chance that Brady would suddenly miss games THIS season, BB should have traded what it took to sign fan fav Garcia. And what guarantee would there be that whatever has been or never was would adapt well to our quite different system and lead us to SB victory? Tom HOF Brady didn't these last 3 seasons with this team.

(and yes Garcia is the starter not the TB backup)

This team sorely needs more YOUNG, fast, agressive football talent while remaining within the salary cap so that every game vets that contribute can still be afforded. Spending big cap money and draft pick(s) on somebody else's "not good enough to start" backup works counter to the competitive viability of this franchise.

Bears repeating

 

[Pats726]

Are you saying Cassel should be on the practice squad? I disagree. Most people feel that Cassel should be a second or third stringer behind O'Connel and maybe Guit, but to say Cassel should be on the practice squad is just unfair.

Not sure how "This is just another practice squad thread." translates into ANYTHING about Cassel being on the practice squad???
There is a place for threads like these...and that is just another reason for that...

 

[fumbrunner]

I think that when people critisize Belichick for not properly preparing for a season if Brady goes down, they mean that Belichick screwed up by not already having a vet QB with experience on the roster in training camp. Belichick screwed up in believing that Cassel would be good enough.

Cassel can come in and play a game or two, but the Patriots did not have a legitimate backup QB. They could have gotten a whole host of has beens and neverwas guys back at the start of TC and any of those guys would have been more prepared to face nfl defenses than Matt Cassel. That is where Belichick made the mistake.

Now that the season had started though, Belichick is probably right to stick with Cassel, even though he sucks....he sucks while knowing the system

To BB's defense, you have invested a significant amount of time on Cassel. It's tough to determine how much of a success he would be until he actually played and obviously no one saw Brady's injury coming. Having said that, it would have been great to have a vet QB (Hello Kerry Collins) but given Brady's steak of starting games, and give the amount of time invested in Cassel, that was not going to happen. I'm sure BB would never admit in public that there should have been a vet back up here, but hindsight is 20/20.

And he is going to be loyal (to a fault) to a player that has been in the system for a long time. Tedi Bruschi (as much as I love his play in his prime) is a good example.

 

[Nunchucks]

No.
BB maybe should have traded picks for vet Huard? He got routed. For vet Brad Johnson? Pathetic. I know, Garcia won Sunday so in the 1 in 8 chance that Brady would suddenly miss games THIS season, BB should have traded what it took to sign fan fav Garcia. And what guarantee would there be that whatever has been or never was would adapt well to our quite different system and lead us to SB victory? Tom HOF Brady didn't these last 3 seasons with this team.

(and yes Garcia is the starter not the TB backup)

This team sorely needs more YOUNG, fast, agressive football talent while remaining within the salary cap so that every game vets that contribute can still be afforded. Spending big cap money and draft pick(s) on somebody else's "not good enough to start" backup works counter to the competitive viability of this franchise.

Bears repeating

How about you understand the word "at the start of training camp" He should have gotten somebody like Sage Rosenfeld, Tim Rattay, or that guy who playd for te Browns and Bills..I forget his name, but he is servicable. The mistake by Belichick was not having a guy already on the roster in April-June.

 

[Nunchucks]

To BB's defense, you have invested a significant amount of time on Cassel. It's tough to determine how much of a success he would be until he actually played and obviously no one saw Brady's injury coming. Having said that, it would have been great to have a vet QB (Hello Kerry Collins) but given Brady's steak of starting games, and give the amount of time invested in Cassel, that was not going to happen. I'm sure BB would never admit in public that there should have been a vet back up here, but hindsight is 20/20.

And he is going to be loyal (to a fault) to a player that has been in the system for a long time. Tedi Bruschi (as much as I love his play in his prime) is a good example.

I agree that there are a lot of reasons why he decided to go with Cassel and probably in 90% of the situations tht would have been the correct choice. Sadly, we are seeing the 10% where the choice was wrong.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

How about you understand the word "at the start of training camp" He should have gotten somebody like Sage Rosenfeld, Tim Rattay, or that guy who playd for te Browns and Bills..I forget his name, but he is servicable. The mistake by Belichick was not having a guy already on the roster in April-June.

What did "at the start of training camp" have to do with what I said?
Hello????

Gotta luv your absolutely horrific example of Rosenkrantz as our backup, a doofus who single handedly LOST a game that was won by his team, the absolute antithethis of BB's successful winning game management approach.