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Great draft for LB and Secondary, but what are we doing at DT?

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by VrabelJr, Apr 28, 2012.

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  1. VrabelJr

    VrabelJr Rookie

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    These are our current defensive linemen (this includes NT, DT, and 3-4 DE):

    Vince Wilfork - Stud starter
    Kyle Love - Ideally a depth guy with not too high of a ceiling
    Brandon Deaderick - Not a starter on most teams but intriguing ceiling
    Jonathan Fanene - Previously a depth guy at various DT and LDE positions in 4-3. Can he play the 5-tech as a DE?
    Ron Brace -
    Myron Pryor - Was the starter next to Vince as the penetrating DT/DE
    Marcus Harrison - Wild card, camp fodder?
    Alex Silvestro - Practice squad stashaway

    Now lets group them based on positions they can play (I have removed Wilfork from these because he can play every position on our front as well Alex Silvestro due to high PS likelihood):

    Nose Guard/Tackle
    Ron Brace
    Kyle Love

    3-technique DT
    Myron Pryor
    Kyle Love
    Marcus Harrison

    5-technique DE
    Jonathan Fanene
    Brandon Deaderick

    3-technique DE
    Ron Brace
    Kyle Love

    I love that we beefed up at DE/OLB with the additions of Jones and Bequette but those guys are going to have to make the plays on their own judging by our DL. But whether we are in the 3-4 or 4-3 there is at least 1-2 positions that will be started by JAGish players. I guess we are banking on Pryor staying healthy, Fanene becoming a starter, and Deaderick and Love continuing to develop. All this pass rush help in the draft could be for naught if we don't have the guys to free them up to make the plays.

    edit: I would also like to share an article on our defensive scheme. Last season we used a 4-3 under where Wilfork is always 2-gapping. To the left of him is a 2-gapping DE and the SLB. To the right of him is a 1-gapping DT and 1-gapping DE. Here's the article (yes, it's before our Super Bowl loss, I know :() http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id...ck-vince-wilfork-new-england-patriots-defense
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2012
  2. Marqui

    Marqui Rookie

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    The DL situation sure is concerning. Missing out on Red Bryant is turning out to be a much bigger loss than I expected. They also passed on Castillo. I was hoping they'd pick up at least one DT high in the draft so I have no clue how they're going to upgrade there now.
  3. VrabelJr

    VrabelJr Rookie

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    I'm with you on Red Bryant. Lets hope that Fanene turns out to be a good consolation prize.
  4. JackBauer

    JackBauer On the Roster

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    I like Deaderick, as does Bedard. I think the kid has potential.

    DT isn't deep but the talent is there.
  5. Sciz

    Sciz PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Deaderick and Wilfork will have big roles in the base defense regardless of scheme. In the 3-4, my guess is either Deaderick-Wilfork-Fanene or Deaderick-Love-Wilfork. In the 4-3, Deaderick at LE plus either Love at NT and Wilfork at DT or Wilfork at NT and Fanene, Love, or Pryor at DT.
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2012
  6. Ron Sellers

    Ron Sellers Rookie

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    From what I read it wasn't a case of the Pats or any other team passing on Castillo, but Castillo willing to accept less money to stay in San Diego. If a guy wants to stay where he has bought a house and is comfortable, no matter how good your sell job is it's going to be difficult to convince a person to leave sunny southern California to move cross country to a much more severe climate.


    Red Bryant would have definitely been a nice addition, but it probably would have been difficult to entice him to move away from familiar settings; he got a $35 million deal over five years with a $5 million signing bonus.

    I'm not saying that he's not worth it; it's just that with some of the other big contracts the Pats have it might have been difficult to offer him enough more than that so he would come play, and still have some cap flexibility.
  7. Cellar-door

    Cellar-door Rookie

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    Fanene supposedly played DT pretty extensively in the Nickel for Cinci. I think out depth at DT is more than adequate, Wilfork, Fanene, Love, Deaderick, Pryor and maybe Brace can all play inside in a 4 man front. And Wilfork, Love and Brace can all play inside in the 3 man front.
    That is a pretty good rotation, better in my mind than most of the league can put out there. I don't see where any rookie after the first round would have broken into that rotation except perhaps at the expense of Brace.
  8. ATippett56

    ATippett56 Rookie

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    Calling Gerard Warren to the rescue!
  9. RayClay

    RayClay On the Roster

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    #75 Jersey

    Good post and well illustrated. Seems to me they are going to try to attack all over with the DE?OLB/ILB and depend less on the DL to pressure up the middle.

    No x,o guy here, but it seems to me many defenses get by with jag linemen by putting constant pressure on with smaller pass rushers.

    Maybe some affordable treadworn vets to add to the rotation again? Deaderick was a nice surprise last year, as was Love, while the other young names need to show something, be it health or motivation. All truly Jaggish, though Deaderick could emerge from that category if we are indeed switching to an attack first D.

    I liked our pass rush combo of Deaderick inside and Carter and Anderson outside. Put the defense on it's heels without time to worry about how stout the guy next to Wilfork was. Replace those names with any of a handful, though i'd love Carter back and healthy if possible.
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2012
  10. unoriginal

    unoriginal Rookie

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    The Pats have averaged close to 2 pure defensive lineman per snap for the last couple of years, what with the rise of the subpackage, so you really just need Wilfork and another fatty.
  11. signbabybrady

    signbabybrady On the Roster

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    #24 Jersey

    I have a lot of faith in
    Vince
    Fanene
    Love
    Deadrick
    And Pryor

    add Warren to the above list if he returns

    3 or less of these guys will be on the field at one time regardless of 3 man line or 4. Could be better but Fanene adds to last years group and there is time to add to it.
  12. Tyler.Durden

    Tyler.Durden Rookie

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    I am a fan of Myron Pryor.
  13. Metaphors

    Metaphors Rookie

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    Fanene should be the primary 3-tech DT along with Pryor. Essentially taking the Mike Wright role. Apparently the Pats signed Marcus Forston as an UDFA. If he is healthy, he is an intriguing option.

    From an overall defensive perspective, if the Pats run a generic/vanilla scheme this year then I don't like this draft at all. Too much duplication. If they run more amoeba sets where they are in sub packages almost all the time, then I think the defense becomes greater than the sum of its parts.

    - Who is the Mike? I count 3 of them and they won't stay still.

    - There are 5 guys on the line but only 2 are DL...and only 4 will be rushing at the snap.

    - Always looks like a Cover-1 pre-snap but can't tell if it is a zone or man under.

    If the QB and OL are thinking this, that indecision should give the pass rush an extra second to get to the QB. Maybe even generate enough protection confusion to get an occasional free rusher. Mediocre QBs will be forced to guess and a bad guess will result in a turnover.

    If the Pats simplify the scheme again and allow every blessed QB to drop 3 steps and throw to his initial read every time, then all the defensive help on the planet won't help.
  14. JMarr

    JMarr Rookie

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    I agree we have adequate depth there. Our base DTs are primarily expected to be space eaters and clog the middle. Love Fanene Pryor and maybe Brace give us A Lot of depth there.. Getting push into the backfield is pretty much gravy for DTs in our sytem, and Vince is more than capable of doing that if he's not being triple teamed.
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2012
  15. reflexblue

    reflexblue PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #91 Jersey

    I don't think they're done yet, most likely will pick up a D-line thats cut during training camp.
  16. TyronePoole

    TyronePoole Banned

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    hopefully this is where a full TC comes in

    I do worry about banking on Jones/Bequette to duplicate Carter's production with no Anderson though
  17. AzPatsFan

    AzPatsFan Rookie

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    I don't see an overwhelming need to anything at all this season. Ther is no room at the Inn for any but a dominat DL lineman and that will wait for the next Draft.

    Barber or Castillo would certainly have helped, but only guys of that quality can find a roster spot. The Pats are unlikely to carry more than 6-7 of the big heavies, and they have that many young developing guys along with a number of PS wanna-be-types developing down there.
  18. resdubwhite

    resdubwhite Rookie

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    No Jersey Selected

    if he stays healthy he is superb
  19. State

    State Rookie

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    #70 Jersey

    You nailed it!

    Or some other journeyman who wants a shot at a ring.

    Passing on the very solid group of DTs--Kendall Reyes was ordained by the fates to be our pick at 48, until BB decided to spurn them--may come back to haunt this franchise. Wolfork was utilized way too much last year. His constitution is phenomenal. But it ain't gonna last, folks.
  20. rabidfireweasel

    rabidfireweasel Rookie

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    Just like over the past 5 years, where we have had to throw out everything we thought we knew about the offense, I think we are looking at a defense in the works that we have never seen.
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