Globe: Mankins graded top guard

[TheSolderKing]

Mankins needs a 5 year deal... We need him protecting Brady's blind side for the remainder of TFB's contract. Are G's not worth the $$$?

 

[mgcolby]

Yeah, I think it best describes their lack of understanding with the QB position when they gave their reasoning on why Brady was so low on their top 101 players. They use the analogy that if Brady was in school he would always get "A"s, but that was because he was taking an easier test than everyone else. Basically saying that what he does is easy with just short quick passes that does not take a lot of skill and anyone could be successful at (granted if it was that easy, why isn't every team with a less than elite QB doing this?). If anything, that couldn't be farther from the truth.

I see guys like Brady and Manning taking much harder tests because they beat defenses with their minds, not as much their physical skills. While many QBs just use their God given talent to make players without much presnap reads or diagnosing the play going on (Ben Roethlisberger), Brady and Manning are disecting the play before the ball is even snapped, making adjustments, going through their reads, recognizing the rush and coverages, etc. Most QBs do that to some extent, but those two do it far more than maybe any QBs in NFL history. Unfortunately for PFF, they do not recognize that these skills are what make QBs special, not the ability to huck the ball 60 yards down the field into double coverage.

Using their logic Jeff George is a first ballot hall of famer! :rocker:

 

[supafly]

Mankins needs a 5 year deal... We need him protecting Brady's blind side for the remainder of TFB's contract. Are G's not worth the $$$?

That's a highly debatable question. One that most would answer 'no' to, based on the average salary of a guard, and what they are specifically asked to do--as opposed to Left Tackles for instance.

In this situation, I would just give him the damn extra money/extra year, whatever it is that he wants (within reason). But I would come up a bit to keep him around, and that's exactly what I expect them to do.

 

[Ring 6]

I will never get why the media loves PFF so much when their stats are so blatantly flawed it isn't funny. Funny, I never saw any of the local guys run the PFF story stating that Brady was the 33rd best player in the NFL last year and question whether the Pats made a mistake giving him such a big deal.

Mankins is A top guard in the league. Possibly even THE top guard. But not because PFF says so.

They love PFF because it offers a lot of information. They appear unconcerned whether that information has any accuracy.

 

[SanAngeloState]

I could see the patriots somehow making this story...it will be easier to dispose of mankins this way and get a 1st for him. Pack your bags, Logan!

 

[crowell33]

Karen Guregian of the Boston Herald quotes PFF as well on Mankins:

BostonHerald.com - Blogs: Rap Sheet

 

[BaltimorePatsFan]

Pay the beast!

 

[Rob0729]

Karen Guregian of the Boston Herald quotes PFF as well on Mankins:

BostonHerald.com - Blogs: Rap Sheet

Yeah so?!? Every hear the phrase, two wrongs don't make a right? Do you really think that showing us that a lot of people in the media are either too ignorant of the fact that PFF's data is flawed or just don't give a crap because it gives them stuff to write about is going to "prove" to us that PFF is a legitimate site?

Sorry, Guregian and SMY quoting PFF does not make the site anymore legitimate. It just hurts their credibility.

 

[VJCPatriot]

I will never get why the media loves PFF so much when their stats are so blatantly flawed it isn't funny. Funny, I never saw any of the local guys run the PFF story stating that Brady was the 33rd best player in the NFL last year and question whether the Pats made a mistake giving him such a big deal.

Mankins is A top guard in the league. Possibly even THE top guard. But not because PFF says so.

I don't believe that Mankins is the best guard in the NFL. At least not in terms of pass protection. He is a beast in the run game though. PFF's ratings are about as useful as used toilet paper, not very. Not only did PFF argue that Tom Brady was not an MVP candidate, they even snubbed him for the lesser offensive player of the year award based on their 'statistical analysis'. They were the only football related website to do so.

Their ratings are totally ridiculous considering Tom Brady was the first unanimous All-pro selection at the QB position, eliminating a second team all-pro selection. I mean wow, talk about twisting facts, if you had half a brain and actually watched the game you would have seen that Brady dominated the game like no other QB last year.

PFF = Sophists with self-inflated opinions of themselves. Please never bring up their faked up stats to me as support for anything as they have zero credibility with knowledgeable football fans.

 

[Rob0729]

I don't believe that Mankins is the best guard in the NFL. At least not in terms of pass protection. He is a beast in the run game though. PFF's ratings are about as useful as used toilet paper, not very. Not only did PFF argue that Tom Brady was not an MVP candidate, they even snubbed him for the lesser offensive player of the year award based on their 'statistical analysis'. They were the only football related website to do so.

Their ratings are totally ridiculous considering Tom Brady was the first unanimous All-pro selection at the QB position, eliminating a second team all-pro selection. I mean wow, talk about twisting facts, if you had half a brain and actually watched the game you would have seen that Brady dominated the game like no other QB last year.

PFF = Sophists with self-inflated opinions of themselves. Please never bring up their faked up stats to me as support for anything as they have zero credibility with knowledgeable football fans.

I do agree that Mankins is far better vs. the run than the pass. I think he is a big reason why BJGE emerged as a productive RB. I don't know if he is the top guard, but he is a top guard. He may be the best run blocking guard in the league. He isn't the top pass blocking one. Overall though he still be #1.

 

[jmt57]

Yeah so?!? Every hear the phrase, two wrongs don't make a right? Do you really think that showing us that a lot of people in the media are either too ignorant of the fact that PFF's data is flawed or just don't give a crap because it gives them stuff to write about is going to "prove" to us that PFF is a legitimate site?

Sorry, Guregian and SMY quoting PFF does not make the site anymore legitimate. It just hurts their credibility.

That (hurts their credibility) is true for people like us, but let's face it: even though the vast majority of the people here at this site are in agreement regarding PFF, we're not really representative of all Pats fans, or sports fans that read the Globe. The majority of people that spend their time here are more fanatical, and because of the above average amount of time they spend following the team and the game they tend to be more knowledgeable.

However, we are probably a very tiny portion of the audience for a newspaper like the Globe. For every one of us whose first thought is 'why are they quoting PFF', there are probably hundreds of people who read those articles and took it at face value, having no reason to believe the numbers might not be accurate.

So in reality when reporters who are generally held in high esteem (e.g., Mike Reiss, Christopher Price, Karen Guregian, Shalise Manza-Young) quote PFF, the hit to their reputation is infinitesimal. Reiss and Price have previously used PFF stats on their blogs; I don't think anybody stopped reading them, or found them to be a questionable source of information afterwards.

Unfortunately, with each time one of these writers again quotes them and uses them as part of a column, PFF's credibility and reputation subtly does indeed grow in the minds the general public.

 

[townes]

Kareem McKenzie > Tom Brady

 

[TheSolderKing]

Franchise tag will stick for Peyton Manning

The Boston Herald reports the NFLPA executive committee will not recommend any special considerations for the 10 plaintiffs in the Brady v. NFL antitrust settlement.
Realizing it would be too "cumbersome" to satisfy individual demands, the NFLPA's decision came with "far less wrangling and horse trading behind the scenes" than recent reports suggested. The upshot is that Peyton Manning and Drew Brees will not be exempt from the franchise tag going forward. Logan Mankins and Vincent Jackson will not be granted free agency, nor a $10 million payout.
Source: Boston Herald
Jul 19, 9:49 PM

 

[Off The Grid]

That (hurts their credibility) is true for people like us, but let's face it: even though the vast majority of the people here at this site are in agreement regarding PFF, we're not really representative of all Pats fans, or sports fans that read the Globe. The majority of people that spend their time here are more fanatical, and because of the above average amount of time they spend following the team and the game they tend to be more knowledgeable.

However, we are probably a very tiny portion of the audience for a newspaper like the Globe. For every one of us whose first thought is 'why are they quoting PFF', there are probably hundreds of people who read those articles and took it at face value, having no reason to believe the numbers might not be accurate.

So in reality when reporters who are generally held in high esteem (e.g., Mike Reiss, Christopher Price, Karen Guregian, Shalise Manza-Young) quote PFF, the hit to their reputation is infinitesimal. Reiss and Price have previously used PFF stats on their blogs; I don't think anybody stopped reading them, or found them to be a questionable source of information afterwards.

Unfortunately, with each time one of these writers again quotes them and uses them as part of a column, PFF's credibility and reputation subtly does indeed grow in the minds the general public.

You're conflating "credibility" with "reputation", my good man.

Just because the majority might perceive a writer as credible, does not make it so.

Me, I'll take "credibility" ~ even if it only garners me the respect of the educated few ~ over "reputation" ~ the meaningless respect of the ignorant masses ~ every time.

 

[jmt57]

You're conflating "credibility" with "reputation", my good man.

Just because the majority might perceive a writer as credible, does not make it so.

Me, I'll take "credibility" ~ even if it only garners me the respect of the educated few ~ over "reputation" ~ the meaningless respect of the ignorant masses ~ every time.

Yeah, true - good call OTG.

I guess what I was trying to say in a very long-winded way was that the four writers I mentioned are not professionally doomed because the quote PFF. Not only that, but their using PFF's stats helps raise awareness of PFF - which in turn enhances their reputation with the general public.

While people like you, me and Rob are acutely aware of the pitfalls of PFF's numbers, every time one of these writers refer to them in an article PFF sadly becomes more and more acceptable and reliable in the mind of the average sports fan - and that in turn will result in their being utilized more often by the mainstream sports media.

Lather, rinse repeat: a vicious circle of misinformation gets put into play.

 

[Off The Grid]

Yeah, true - good call OTG.

I guess what I was trying to say in a very long-winded way was that the four writers I mentioned are not professionally doomed because the quote PFF. Not only that, but their using PFF's stats helps raise awareness of PFF - which in turn enhances their reputation with the general public.

While people like you, me and Rob are acutely aware of the pitfalls of PFF's numbers, every time one of these writers refer to them in an article PFF sadly becomes more and more acceptable and reliable in the mind of the average sports fan - and that in turn will result in their being utilized more often by the mainstream sports media.

Lather, rinse repeat: a vicious circle of misinformation gets put into play.

Ahhh...Ain't it the truth??

You're a class act, Brother J, and that was well said, sir.

And I hope you'll continue to trend towards effusiveness. I'm a big Steven King fan, as my own meanderings no doubt suggest, and a long-winded reply, if eloquent, is not only acceptable, but highly encouraged and greatly appreciated!!

 

[Ian]

Yeah so?!? Every hear the phrase, two wrongs don't make a right? Do you really think that showing us that a lot of people in the media are either too ignorant of the fact that PFF's data is flawed or just don't give a crap because it gives them stuff to write about is going to "prove" to us that PFF is a legitimate site?

Sorry, Guregian and SMY quoting PFF does not make the site anymore legitimate. It just hurts their credibility.

I don't know why people are killing SMY and Guregian, as they weren't the only two quoting that article. Even the official site quoted it:

Link To their Post on Twitter

I'd bash PFF if you disagree with it, but I saw about 10 different mentions from other prominent writers who quoted it in our market. They were just pointing it out, and as I mentioned even the official site mentioned it.

 

[Rob0729]

I don't know why people are killing SMY and Guregian, as they weren't the only two quoting that article. Even the official site quoted it:

Link To their Post on Twitter

I'd bash PFF if you disagree with it, but I saw about 10 different mentions from other prominent writers who quoted it in our market. They were just pointing it out, and as I mentioned even the official site mentioned it.

I'm not bashing anyone in particular. I mentioned Mike Reiss uses PFF as a source too. I am just saying anyone in the media who uses a source like PFF that has stats that are easily discredited take a hit to their credibility. It just happens that SMY and Guregian as guilty of it in this particular case. If Reiss, Ian Rapport, Ron Borges, or any any other Boston writer used PFF as a source (and many of them do), I would say the same thing. I am certainly not singling out anyone.

crowell tends to be a shill for PFF and he/she seems to be using local reports quoting it as a validation of the accuracy of their site. That was my only point.

BTW, as for the official Patriots Twitter account quoting it, it is a different thing. Although they break Patriots related news on it, that Twitter account is more of a PR devise than a news source. They aren't held to the same journalistic standards and their goal is to promote the team.

 

[captain stone]

Mankins needs a 5 year deal... We need him protecting Brady's blind side for the remainder of TFB's contract. Are G's not worth the $$$?

They are if they're one of the top 4 OGs in football;
if the offense suddenly becomes wonderfully efficient upon his return
with barely one week of full-contact practice (which still blows my mind);
and if there is absolutely nobody currently signed/drafted who can even seriously
be considered a possible replacement, due in no small part to all the useless crap
besides Vollmer whom Bill has drafted/signed/traded for from 2006-2010 (2 exceptions:
Connelly, who will replace Neal; and Ted Larsen, who was lost on waivers -
instead of OBurger/Wendell??? - to Tampa).