Globe: BB rejects Lions #2 (33) for Cassel

[VJCPatriot]

There's no effective difference between #33 and #34?
Well, actually there is a difference, one pick.

There could be a player that the Pats want at #34 who goes at #33. I don't recall the Pats ever offering "after you" during the first 200 or so draft picks, for no compensation.

As noted, the Pats could have achieved the exact cap outcome by trading Cassel for the #33, and releasing Vrabel.

Further, after trading Cassel, there was no short-term salary cap imperative to release Vrabel. With $14.6mm in additional space, a further $3mm was not needed this weekend.

If the Patriots were concerned about Vrabel re-uniting in Cleveland with Mangini, they could trade him to any other team, hell, for a 2012 7th round pick or something. Given six months, they probably could have found a partner. It's possible one team valued Cassel more than KC, and maybe another team valued Vrabel more than KC. Or asked him to restructure. Before the trade, I think there were fewer "trade Vrabel" threads than "trade Brady" threads - there was no great clamor to dump Vrabel to save the defense and cap a week ago.

In the past, the Patriots seemed far less concerned about where a player ended and far more about maximizing the value of the return. The Drew Bledsoe trade is a pretty clear example of this approach.

The facts seem to show that the Pats did not maximize value in this deal. You can argue how much value - oh, it really was only a little value that they gave up. But this is a competitive organization in a competitive league. Strange to see this approach.

You're making a huge deal out of a 1 slot difference in offers. If Detroit had offered #20 instead, then I might question the Pats. But it's a nobrainer that BB sends Cassel and Vrabel to Pioli as an opening trade to establish 'good ties' with his former protege/coworker. Establishing a good relationship with KC and PIoli is more important than a 1 slot difference in draft position. Don't forget, another GM can do BB favors not just with future trades, but information, which might be just as valuable or more valuable than the very small discount that Pioli got to get 'his guys' to restart the Chiefs franchise.

 

[ALP]

Another possibility inside would be Carolina linebacker Adam Seward, whom the Patriots were interested in last offseason when he was a restricted free agent. The 6-2, 250-pound Seward is a little-used backup, but so was Vrabel in Pittsburgh before he became a Patriot.

Adam Seward is a legend

 

[Pats726]

Re: Globe:BB rejects Lions #2 (33) for Cassel

The globe article seems to imply that we were willing to take a lower pick if a team was also willing to take Vrabel in the trade. Wouldn't cutting Vrabel have created the same cap room as trading him?

I think from what I heard today, if they had cut him therer would have been some dead money that was still on the books for this year...so by trading him THAT is now gone. How much that was?? Not sure..

 

[jeffbiologist]

What I have yet to understand is WHY they didnt want him. Being the consumate Patriot, chances are he would have renegotiated to lower his cap hit for a small extension. They had room, they had $$, they asked Moss to renegotiate, there was nothing to read about him REFUSING.....to me this was a perfect case of SP having Vrabel as his Binky, and maybe BB held SP back a year and this was compensation?? No way does a guy who is that flexible, who has played for a reasonable salary forever, done all he could get dumped in a cap move. That isnt BB's style, if he likes you he honors the contract,period.

 

[unoriginal]

What I have yet to understand is WHY they didnt want him. Being the consumate Patriot, chances are he would have renegotiated to lower his cap hit for a small extension. They had room, they had $$, they asked Moss to renegotiate, there was nothing to read about him REFUSING.....to me this was a perfect case of SP having Vrabel as his Binky, and maybe BB held SP back a year and this was compensation?? No way does a guy who is that flexible, who has played for a reasonable salary forever, done all he could get dumped in a cap move. That isnt BB's style, if he likes you he honors the contract,period.

They probably asked him, "Mike, would you rather make $3.2 million this year in Kansas City and start at OLB, or make $1.5 million for us and back up either Woods or whatever OLB we bring in to replace you?"

 

[Fourthofjuly]

The fact that it's one of the Globe's "NFL Sources" ...
the same paper that hasn't broken squat this entire off-season...
the same paper that pays Mike Reiss, who lives at Gillette and was last to know about the Cassel trade...

makes me believe this 'report' is bogus.

I also heard Patriots turned down Adrian Peterson for Cassel, governance of the state of North Dakota for Cassel, and one night with Angelina Jolie.

#34? What were they thinking!

 

[Tunescribe]

Re: Globe:BB rejects Lions #2 (33) for Cassel

Maybe trading Vrabel instead of cutting him keeps him from potentially joining the Rat in Cleveland.

I suggested that in another thread and got criticized for it.

 

[Fencer]

Re: Globe:BB rejects Lions #2 (33) for Cassel

Wouldn't cutting Vrabel have created the same cap room as trading him?

I'm not seeing any difference.

What is more compelling if the story is true is that the Patriots didn't see value in Vrabel, as in they meant to cut him or something. Taking a #34 over a #33 as a favor to Pioli, Cassel, or somebody IS small enough that the Patriots would do it.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Re: Globe:BB rejects Lions #2 (33) for Cassel

There's no effective difference between #33 and #34, and it seems like the whole deal with KC was part of a bigger plan. I think that BB wanted to dump Vrabel before his March 1 roster bonus was due, and trading him saved BB the embarrasment of potentially cutting one of the greatest Pats of all time.

besides he was doing cassel a favor and sending him to a team taht has some talent. can you imagine cassel going to detroit and he ends up being the next scott mitchell (who also played in detroit)?

 

[Urgent]

Re: Globe:BB rejects Lions #2 (33) for Cassel

I think from what I heard today, if they had cut him therer would have been some dead money that was still on the books for this year...so by trading him THAT is now gone. How much that was?? Not sure..

Whether you release or trade a player under contract, the salary cap impact is exactly the same. The unamortized signing bonus accelerates.

In the past, there has been a difference whether you release a player before or after June 1, impacting the amount of unamortized signing bonus accrued in the current vs. next year. But, on any given date, whether you trade or release a player, the cap impact is exactly the same.

I believe the unamortized money is about $1mm. That will now be on the books as dead money due to the trade. It is not gone.

 

[ICSB]

Re: Globe:BB rejects Lions #2 (33) for Cassel

not to mention the fact that if cassel has a say, he'd probably prefer the chiefs to the lions

I honestly think the Chiefs are a potential darkhorse next year. Don't laugh. They lost a lot of close ones last year. Almost knocked SD out of the playoffs twice.

I don't blame the Pats for not sending him to the Lions. You dont hate the guy.

 

[Urgent]

Re: Globe:BB rejects Lions #2 (33) for Cassel

besides he was doing cassel a favor and sending him to a team taht has some talent. can you imagine cassel going to detroit and he ends up being the next scott mitchell (who also played in detroit)?

Sending a your player to a better team, in your conference, and accepting less compensation in trade -- that just doesn't make any sense. That just doesn't sound like Belichick. That is designed to make your conference harder and your team weaker.

By this logic, would you have been even more pleased to send him to the Jets for the Jets second-round pick at #52? Potentially even better for Cassel -- they really need a QB. Or what about the Vikings with their second-round pick at #54? Another good spot, good defense, good running game.

 

[tuckeverlasting]

Re: Globe:BB rejects Lions #2 (33) for Cassel

besides he was doing cassel a favor and sending him to a team taht has some talent. can you imagine cassel going to detroit and he ends up being the next scott mitchell (who also played in detroit)?

the comparisons would have started immediately. cassel is in a much better place now.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Another possibility inside would be Carolina linebacker Adam Seward, whom the Patriots were interested in last offseason when he was a restricted free agent. The 6-2, 250-pound Seward is a little-used backup, but so was Vrabel in Pittsburgh before he became a Patriot.

Adam Seward is a legend

ROFL, oh god, here we go again...


IMO, the trade is as simple as Belichick wanting to keep Vrabel out of New York and out of Cleveland. That's worth a 1 spot drop.

 

[Patriot_in_NY]

I think we've only seen Pt. 1 of this deal, frankly.

Yup, agreed

ROFL, oh god, here we go again...


IMO, the trade is as simple as Belichick wanting to keep Vrabel out of New York and out of Cleveland. That's worth a 1 spot drop.

Exactly. NY in particular.