Welcome to PatsFans.com

Gasper: We're witnessing a breakdown in communication

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by Deus Irae, Dec 12, 2009.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Deus Irae

    Deus Irae PatsFans.com Retired Jersey Club PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2006
    Messages:
    40,774
    Likes Received:
    64
    Ratings:
    +89 / 3 / -1

    Disable Jersey

    There's some interesting commentary in the article. Here are a few points:

    Time to communicate - Christopher Gasper's Blog - Boston sports news - Boston.com
  2. KontradictioN

    KontradictioN Do you even lift? PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2006
    Messages:
    25,448
    Likes Received:
    69
    Ratings:
    +94 / 2 / -2

    #24 Jersey

    Watch. If Wilfork goes in the offseason, we'll see the same people that are complimenting Wilfork on his attitude toward the contract negotiations now saying that he was "always a cancer" and "chasing the almighty dollar" if/when he goes to another team and speaks out. It's almost a travesty that he hasn't been re-signed yet.
  3. emoney_33

    emoney_33 Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2005
    Messages:
    5,194
    Likes Received:
    8
    Ratings:
    +8 / 0 / -0

    I suspect that there isn't a lot different in "communication", aside from that one bad seed who continues to go to the media. We lost a lot of leaders in the locker room for sure, but others will step up, the team will improve and this will be another "they hate their coach" memory.
  4. emoney_33

    emoney_33 Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2005
    Messages:
    5,194
    Likes Received:
    8
    Ratings:
    +8 / 0 / -0


    Oh OK except there is no evidence to suggest that will be the case. Unless you have examples of specific posters being hypocritical like this, then it's not fair to lump 2 arguments into one and accuse them as coming from the same person.
  5. RhodyPatriot

    RhodyPatriot Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2007
    Messages:
    2,392
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    Gasper the Friendly Ghost can't do better than this??
    This team is 7 - 5 because the virtually intact offense has struggled this season with a new coach in Bill O'Brien on the sidelines and a QB coming back from a year off and a significant injury. Do you notice how the media refuses to train their eyes on Tom Brady and this O??
    Vince Wilfork and his contract isn't the problem at all right now and Dick Seymour's presence would not have changed the outcome of a single game this team. How do we know that?? Dick producted 1 and 1/2 sacks in the 5 losses the Patriots had last season to the Jets, Dolphins, Colts, Steelers and Chargers and did so when 1 on 1. The days of Double Team Dick have been over for a couple of years at least. Dick doesn't save his best games for the biggest opponents. Seymour as a team leader is also highly overrated. Dick was a guy known for playing hard when the smell of money inspired him. Hardly leadership qualities.
    Jerod Mayo and Brandon Meriweather are the future leaders of the D. BB needs to rid the team of cancers Thomas and Springs so these leaders can blossom.
  6. KontradictioN

    KontradictioN Do you even lift? PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2006
    Messages:
    25,448
    Likes Received:
    69
    Ratings:
    +94 / 2 / -2

    #24 Jersey

    I don't recall anyone spewing venom about Richard Seymour last season the way people have lately. I know you read the thread so I don't believe I have to list specific examples for you.
  7. RhodyPatriot

    RhodyPatriot Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2007
    Messages:
    2,392
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    I hope we do re-sign Vince but if we don't I've got no problem with him. Vince Wilfork plays hard, keeps his mouth shut and doesn't strut around like a rooster in heat telling anyone and everyone who will listen how he's a "man" ala Dick Seymour.
    I was critical of the Big Overrated when he was here so my critique of him now that he's gone is no different. I've got no issue with Vince Wilfork and if he leaves I'll wish him well. Terrific player and a hell of a guy who will be missed if he does leave.
  8. Garbanza

    Garbanza Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2004
    Messages:
    2,203
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    I completely agree
  9. RhodyPatriot

    RhodyPatriot Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2007
    Messages:
    2,392
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    :wha:
    I'm proud to say I've had the same low opinion of Dick the Big Overrated Seymour for at least a couple of years now and have freely shared those thoughts with my fellow Patriot brethren on this site. And I've had company that's been in agreement with me for those couple of years.
  10. SVN

    SVN Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2005
    Messages:
    22,514
    Likes Received:
    14
    Ratings:
    +14 / 0 / -0

    so many reactionary articles about the entire season. Brady doesnt throw and INT in miami in the EZ and gasper would have to shut this article up for a few more weeks. I hate this timely crap. If players had issues with seymour being let go and and you as a report want to write a story then do it then . Dont do it when its convenient for you .
  11. Brady to Brown

    Brady to Brown Rookie

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2007
    Messages:
    1,893
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    I did, never liked the guy. Even when the kool-aid was being shipped in faster than the players could drink it, Seymour was about Seymour.

    Wilfork is another story. The front office should have given this man his money by now. Kaczur, Neal, Warren, AD, Koppen, Light, Green, etc all have bigger cap hits than Wilfork in 2009. He gets much respect from me for playing his best every game while having every right to moan and cry. He is a man who signed a contract and will play it until the end. A great example of a man who's word is more important than the $.
  12. Bonzo

    Bonzo Rookie

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2007
    Messages:
    337
    Likes Received:
    2
    Ratings:
    +2 / 0 / -0

    Agree 100%. I generally ignore opinion pieces, because while these "journalists" tend to be talented, trained writers, they generally lack such qualifications with regard to the game itself. To me, "sports columnist" is nearly a contradiction of terms.
  13. kolbitr

    kolbitr Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2006
    Messages:
    653
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    A pretty gossipy article, which might well be true but it's impossible to know whether this is coming from 3 or 4 players, or more. Gasper doesn't want you to know. He also doesn't know the difference between ferment and foment, which is pretty funny for a supposed journalist.

    The fact remains though that once the players start dictating who plays and who doesn't, it will only be a matter of time before Gasper gets to write articles about how BB isn't the boss anymore. When Carroll was here Borges constantly mocked him for trying to placate the players; he's been eviscerating BB ever since for not placating them. Borges constantly reminded people on the radio and in his columns that "your players will get you fired"...and he has been pushing for that to happen here for years.

    It seems very possible that Springs is being punished for being an *******...and maybe it's backfiring. Is it any surprise that players that come from Washington and Baltimore, where the coach is "chill as long as you a playa", are chafing in NE? Too many new faces, too many new coaches. Not enough accountability.

    The point about Wilfork is true, though--if he were getting paid better, he'd be a more important force in that room.
  14. HEY BRO! WHAT UP?

    HEY BRO! WHAT UP? Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2006
    Messages:
    4,370
    Likes Received:
    3
    Ratings:
    +3 / 0 / -0

    Let's assume 2010 is capped. I'd franchise Wilfork, trade him for a 1st round pick and go after Casey Hampton or Aubrayo Franklin (he will probably get the tag). In the end, you'd save money, gain a first round pick without much of a drop off (if any) at the NT position. If the Pats ever want a balanced defense, they're going to have to let Wilfork go get his money somewhere else.
    Last edited: Dec 12, 2009
  15. IcyPatriot

    IcyPatriot ---- JAG ----- PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    36,492
    Likes Received:
    18
    Ratings:
    +24 / 1 / -0

    #87 Jersey

    We're witnessing a team that is going through change
    ... media blowhards trying to make some extra money off of it.
  16. kolbitr

    kolbitr Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2006
    Messages:
    653
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    Truth. Although I think that BB could stand to question some of his own tactics, and could probably use some vocal assistants, the media stance is almost always going to be in favor of failure and controversy. It's just better for them, professionally. You know this by considering that while losing and discontent are bad and are worth covering, even in 2007 when the Patriots were dominating and everyone was focused and unified, much of the coverage was negative and critical: they were too cold, too machine-like, they had a dark cloud over them, they were mean, they were feeling the pressure--if not this week, then surely next week, right?

    While columnists do offer some insight into the locker room dynamics, their writing will always be slanted. It's just what sells.
  17. BelizePats

    BelizePats Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2004
    Messages:
    871
    Likes Received:
    5
    Ratings:
    +5 / 0 / -0

    Can anyone explain to me why Big Vince has not been extended yet? For the life of me I just don't get this one. I'll chug the Kool Aid with the best of them but management has dropped the ball here! Big Time!!!
  18. klinefan

    klinefan Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2009
    Messages:
    543
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    He would costa too much money. Maybe they think money would be best spent elsewhere on say a 32 year old malcontented LB who can't rush the passer to save his life.
  19. robertweathers

    robertweathers Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2006
    Messages:
    7,628
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    Just not a fan of Gasper. I'm all for criticizm of BB, but Gasper is spending too much time on 98.5 and listening to Joey From Malden...
  20. upstater1

    upstater1 Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2005
    Messages:
    12,926
    Likes Received:
    9
    Ratings:
    +9 / 0 / -0

    I don't believe Gasper's hysterics, but if I did it's almost like a few losses would be good for this team so we can figure out who all the weak-kneed malcontents are. These are grown men, and if they can't figure out a few obvious things about Belichick, then they don't deserve to be on the team.

    The Patriots won as a team--and if they get rid of the malcontents, I'd be happier to see them go down fighting than win a few to cover over the festering cancers.
  21. upstater1

    upstater1 Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2005
    Messages:
    12,926
    Likes Received:
    9
    Ratings:
    +9 / 0 / -0

    I can think of one easy obvious answer.

    It's much better to sign your guys during an uncapped year so that you can frontload the contract.
  22. satz

    satz Rookie

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2006
    Messages:
    1,919
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    Vince used to be on sports tonight and already expressed his displeasure.
    He will not be here he wants a 9 million/yr contract which will put him below brady,Moss,AD in the team.

    We can get a first rounder in trade and more

    1)Chargers have a old jamal and even with years of drafting and FA signing there is no replacement

    2) Ferguon down in dolphins is retiring and do not have a replacment

    3)Jets have Jenkins who cannot play more than 6 games a year andOLD

    4)Denver Needs a NT

    5)Shaun rogers of Clevland OLD and need a replacement

    6)Steelers with casey hampton.He more of a dt who is on 1 on 1 due to the front seven.They never had a true double team requiring NT. Can you imagine harrison and woodley on TE or RB.Steeler defence will be killer.

    as a defence fan i would love to see him with the steelers to see how the OLB sack QBs.
    Last edited: Dec 12, 2009
  23. blackglass3

    blackglass3 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2007
    Messages:
    4,772
    Likes Received:
    11
    Ratings:
    +11 / 0 / -0

    This was the impression I was under, also. Would there be union trouble if he slipped up and said something like "Yeah, the front office told me they are waiting for the uncapped year to hit so they can resign me." Is that illegal in any way?
  24. RayClay

    RayClay Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2005
    Messages:
    17,518
    Likes Received:
    40
    Ratings:
    +49 / 0 / -1

    #75 Jersey

    Sounds like Gasper's been studying at the Ron Borges Journalism school. Sure, they're having some growing pains due to waiting to turn over the defense until after the solid vets were worn out.

    I's even go so far as to say they forgot a bit about what they learned about character in free agents from thr Phifers Vrabels and Harrison's. Nevertheless, there's only one real bad apple that i can see and BB's dealt with that (D-I-D). A couple wins solves a lot of issues.

    I could name at least a dozen character problem turning points that have turned into springboards, it's the nature of an emotional game.

    random

    1. A bunch of people looking at a live ball without picking it up (help me out on this one). 2002 against Green Bay?

    2. Steve Martin

    3. D-I-D

    4. Brady throwing for huge numbers against the Jets, Pitt then the team folding in 2002.

    5. Ty Law's cousin

    6. Lawyer Milloy

    7. Ty Law's family's appetite

    and on and on.

    Bru, Troy and Willie grew into leadership. A totally focused team with great leadership is exceptional, not typical. We're building a new one and the young and old leaders will come from situations like this.
    Last edited: Dec 12, 2009
  25. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2005
    Messages:
    19,949
    Likes Received:
    29
    Ratings:
    +29 / 0 / -0

    People forget that leadership is forged through adversity. Everyone's a leader when you're winning. After Milloy was cut the media told us they hate their coach. Even guys like Bruschi and Brady were frustrated or wounded to the core. I personally feared Bill had lost his mind. Rodney wasn't all that happy either, but after the Buffalo beat down he asked them if they were all done crying or if this was what they were going to do all season. They had to think about it a bit and won one and then lost another...and then didn't lose again until sometime in 2004. Bill's not goin anywhere anytime soon so he will wait them out and when those who want to win again outnumber those who want a hug he will still be here scheming and coaching to put them in a position to win.

    They all know the deal when they walk through that door with the sign over it that reminds them to check your ego before entering and do your job. He never blows smoke up your ass and then backstabs you in the media to cover his own like the vast majority of insecure NFL HC do. Former players will tell you they always knew where they stood with Bill. What he does do is hold you accountable for effort, execution and unselfishness committment to something bigger than yourself. Even if you're not the most gifted athlete, he can help you make the most of whatever gifts you possess if you're willing to work at your craft. If you want to rest on laurals or coast on talent there isn't all that much he can do for or with you.

    I get frustrated with him too at times because he doesn't appear to do enough to make it easier. I think what gauls him is despite any deficits we see, he sees evidence on film every Monday that indicates they all could have played and executed exponentially better inspite of any talent shortfall. So he continues to coach them up and put them in a position to win inspite of themselves. But he cannot make grown men perform consistently to the best of their ability. That's on them.

    And hugging players or coddling players or enabling players doesn't make them play any better and there are lots of past and present NFL HC willing to attest to that. Preparing them to play, as just about every player who's ever succeeded here or left here to play elsewhere will attest he does, means a lot more to players to whom football truly matters than a hug and an extra couple of bucks at the front end of a disappointing career ever will. But at the end of the day no coach can make players perform to the best of their ability or perform consistently. What he can do is move on from them if they cannot or will not perform or if they measure respect in dollar signs as opposed to winning team championships.
  26. tanked_as_usual

    tanked_as_usual Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2007
    Messages:
    4,981
    Likes Received:
    7
    Ratings:
    +7 / 0 / -0

    the problem with the defense is that the team has acquired one decent LB in the last 7 years (mayo) and we are talking about a scheme that depends on LB quality
    Last edited: Dec 12, 2009
  27. Deus Irae

    Deus Irae PatsFans.com Retired Jersey Club PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2006
    Messages:
    40,774
    Likes Received:
    64
    Ratings:
    +89 / 3 / -1

    Disable Jersey

    Sadly, most of the responses in this thread so far avoid the meat of the article in favor of giving Belichick a tongue bath or bashing the writer, instead of focusing on the issues brought forward in the piece.

    Then again, I guess all's well as long as we can pretend that it's always the players at fault and never the front office.
  28. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    19,975
    Likes Received:
    24
    Ratings:
    +28 / 1 / -0

    I agree 100%.

  29. Pats726

    Pats726 Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    9,800
    Likes Received:
    8
    Ratings:
    +8 / 0 / -0

    Got it correct..it's a real feast for the mediots who LOVE teh fact the team is doing bad..and unfortunately a LOT of fans are following like sheep.
    The reason Wilfork hasn't been extended has a lot to do with the CBA..seems like many are forgetting about that. Once they have an idea about what is happening, then they will address it. They are NOT going to do anything premature and I do not blame them. No one is dropping the ball as large contracts need to be done not in a vacuum but with some sense of the future.
    I hiope he is around for teh future and would love to see that happen. My guess is it will happen.
    But I agree..it's time the malcontents are identified and dealt with starting with two of the worst, AD and SS. Thomas has not lived up to what the team paid him...Just a big rip off for this clown. Same it seems for Springs.
  30. AndyJohnson

    AndyJohnson PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    21,851
    Likes Received:
    14
    Ratings:
    +22 / 0 / -1

    Or that nothing is really different except that when the team is ONLY 7-5 its easy to criticize the same approach that won 3 SBs.
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page