FS vs. SS

[JSn]

I see a lot of talk about us drafting a FS early, and I agree we need a safety, but isn't Meri technically a FS? We don't have a young, knock-out SS, shouldn't that be the focus?

I might be missing the difference, but isn't a SS "almost" a linebacker, with speed and mad cover skills?

 

[The_Riddler]

Which is exactly why I'm hoping Mr. William Moore falls right into our laps at 23 and there's a good chance that might happen based on his somewhat disappointing Senior Bowl week.

James Sanders, even if he stayed is a role player and it would be great to draft guy like this, bring back Rodney for one more go-around to tudor the kid and use the 3 of them in the triangle safety rotation that we like to run and I can see him eventually gaining more and more snaps as the season progresses to give Rodney more of a blow. We would have potentially the next Atwater/Dennis Smith with Moore and Meriweather

 

[tanked_as_usual]

depends on the player and the scheme......ed reed is an SS in an FS body.......

some schemes give responsibility for TE coverage to the SS in which case he needs to be bigger.....other give that responsibility to LB so then the SS can be ed reed

 

[JSn]

James Sanders, even if he stayed is a role player and it would be great to draft guy like this, bring back Rodney for one more go-around to tudor the kid and use the 3 of them in the triangle safety rotation that we like to run and I can see him eventually gaining more and more snaps as the season progresses to give Rodney more of a blow. We would have potentially the next Atwater/Dennis Smith with Moore and Meriweather

Bold one: true - safety seems like a position we need to fill with a big-time player, unlike CB

Bold two: a tudor is a period of medieval architecture spanning 1485–1603.

Bold three: that's some serious rookie hazing.

 

[The_Riddler]

Bold one: true - safety seems like a position we need to fill with a big-time player, unlike CB

Bold two: a tudor is a period of medieval architecture spanning 1485–1603.

Bold three: that's some serious rookie hazing.

Wow, you're pretty smaaaaaaaat. I will definately start spell checking any more of my responses to your posts....asap.....But more to the relevant point at hand. James Sanders needs to be upgraded and Will Moore is that guy. I'm really hoping he's a Patriot in April.

 

[dryheat44]

I see a lot of talk about us drafting a FS early, and I agree we need a safety, but isn't Meri technically a FS? We don't have a young, knock-out SS, shouldn't that be the focus?

I might be missing the difference, but isn't a SS "almost" a linebacker, with speed and mad cover skills?

I think in the BB ideal world, he'd have a "free safety" that can come up and support the run as well as a linebacker, and a "strong safety" that can cover tight ends and slot receivers like a cornerback. In other words, two guys in the deep backfield that can do it all. I think Meriweather is fast becoming one of those guys. James Sanders can do both as well, but certainly isn't any better than average when it comes to coverage. I think Will Moore can also play both roles, which he is a player to watch on the first day.

 

[JSn]

Wow, you're pretty smaaaaaaaat. I will definately start spell checking any more of my responses to your posts....asap.....But more to the relevant point at hand. James Sanders needs to be upgraded and Will Moore is that guy. I'm really hoping he's a Patriot in April.

I was just messing with you. And sadly I don't have one of those adorable Bostonian accents.

So do we traditionally carry four safeties? That could make a case for Meri, Moore, Sanders and Harrison for one year.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

I was just messing with you. And sadly I don't have one of those adorable Bostonian accents.

So do we traditionally carry four safeties? That could make a case for Meri, Moore, Sanders and Harrison for one year.

That depends on whether folks like Ventrone count as safeties.

 

[Mogamedogz]

Which is exactly why I'm hoping Mr. William Moore falls right into our laps at 23 and there's a good chance that might happen based on his somewhat disappointing Senior Bowl week.

James Sanders, even if he stayed is a role player and it would be great to draft guy like this, bring back Rodney for one more go-around to tudor the kid and use the 3 of them in the triangle safety rotation that we like to run and I can see him eventually gaining more and more snaps as the season progresses to give Rodney more of a blow. We would have potentially the next Atwater/Dennis Smith with Moore and Meriweather

That's some pretty high praise right there.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Oddly enough, there is a post in the Top 100 thread stickied above that links to the "Value Chart" created by Wes Bunting for National Football Post. Will Moore is projected as a 4th round value, which is also where Mike Mayock was looking at him following his Senior year. Our Moore fans above remember a fine junior campaign that had him projected as a first round pick by many observers, but in the 'what have you done for me lately' world of the NFL, lately for Moore is a difficult senior season capped off by a poor Senior Bowl. I have little doubt that he will be available at 23, though I expect BB to draft Louis Delmas before he drafts Moore.

Now, back to your first query:
- Technically, Strong Safety refers to the side of the formation with the greatest number of receivers, e.g.: if the formation had Moss and Welker on one side, and Gaffney, Watson, and Evans on the other, the three receiver side is the secondary's "strong" side. Free Safety seems to have derived from the Man-Free coverage where a single defender floats in the middle of the field with no individual coverage assignment while trying to read the QB's intentions and keep an eye on the other defenders playing man-to-man.
- Safeties for New England are preferably adept at both coverage and run support. Size is nice if one is going to be doing more run support than the other, but tackling ability and good read/react skills are more critical.
- Rodney is a wily old veteran who was drafted in the 5th round, whether he proved to be as good as he is in his rookie year I couldn't say, but I'd guess he's like a number of others who spend a couple years developing on Special Teams before all the pieces fall together and they explode into the NFL consciousness.
- Meriweather is more of a ballhawk than Sanders, which is why I believe he was down in the box playing the 'Rodney role' more than James; however, both can play either position. Aging CB Artrel Hawkins was moved to Safety his first year with the team and played more of a Strong Safety role - tackling ability and the experience/mental speed to read/react faster in a short area trumps size.
- Draftnik sites not fixated on Will Moore's junior season now have Louis Delmas and Patrick Chung as the top two Safeties in this class. Some suggest Sean Smith may be a Free Safety for some teams and rank him up with them.

 

[The_Riddler]

I was just messing with you. And sadly I don't have one of those adorable Bostonian accents.

So do we traditionally carry four safeties? That could make a case for Meri, Moore, Sanders and Harrison for one year.

No biggie, all is well...

James Sanders, right now, I would have to say is anyone's guess as to whether he re-ups. Patriot plucking could be the order of the day for safety-needy teams like Houston who I could see overpaying for James simply because of his Patriot-pedigree.

 

[JSn]

Technically, Strong Safety refers to the side...

Thanks BOR! That's a very helpful explanization.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Thanks BOR! That's a very helpful explanization.

The Queen talks kinda funny...

 

[Wotan_the_Wanderer]

At this point, I'm a bit disappointed by this draft's safety class and especially in Moore. I suppose I can live with it should BB decide to draft someone like Chung in the second or third round, but I'm now thinking that a better option might be to pay the piper and acquire a vet safety like Jermaine Phillips or Sean Jones and going the DE/DT (Tyson Jackson), pass rushing OLB, CB and WR on day one.

 

[DW Toys]

Oddly enough, there is a post in the Top 100 thread stickied above that links to the "Value Chart" created by Wes Bunting for National Football Post. Will Moore is projected as a 4th round value, which is also where Mike Mayock was looking at him following his Senior year. Our Moore fans above remember a fine junior campaign that had him projected as a first round pick by many observers, but in the 'what have you done for me lately' world of the NFL, lately for Moore is a difficult senior season capped off by a poor Senior Bowl. I have little doubt that he will be available at 23, though I expect BB to draft Louis Delmas before he drafts Moore.

Now, back to your first query:
- Technically, Strong Safety refers to the side of the formation with the greatest number of receivers, e.g.: if the formation had Moss and Welker on one side, and Gaffney, Watson, and Evans on the other, the three receiver side is the secondary's "strong" side. Free Safety seems to have derived from the Man-Free coverage where a single defender floats in the middle of the field with no individual coverage assignment while trying to read the QB's intentions and keep an eye on the other defenders playing man-to-man.
- Safeties for New England are preferably adept at both coverage and run support. Size is nice if one is going to be doing more run support than the other, but tackling ability and good read/react skills are more critical.
- Rodney is a wily old veteran who was drafted in the 5th round, whether he proved to be as good as he is in his rookie year I couldn't say, but I'd guess he's like a number of others who spend a couple years developing on Special Teams before all the pieces fall together and they explode into the NFL consciousness.
- Meriweather is more of a ballhawk than Sanders, which is why I believe he was down in the box playing the 'Rodney role' more than James; however, both can play either position. Aging CB Artrel Hawkins was moved to Safety his first year with the team and played more of a Strong Safety role - tackling ability and the experience/mental speed to read/react faster in a short area trumps size.
- Draftnik sites not fixated on Will Moore's junior season now have Louis Delmas and Patrick Chung as the top two Safeties in this class. Some suggest Sean Smith may be a Free Safety for some teams and rank him up with them.

Box. Good post. Very thorough. Thank you. My guy to throw in here is Nik Harris from OU. The kid can play both safety positions and OLB. BB type versatility. He has run a 4.5. He is 6'2" and 233 lbs. He can cover and hit like hell. He could be the in-the-box Rodney guy as well.The good news is they are trying to jam him into the OLB position so he drops down in the draft but he was a safety at OU. He is also an excellent citizen and community kid. The big news is his cover skill. James Sanders did not do well there. I think Lewis Sanders played Safety down the stretch better than James S. and will cost us less to resign. He was just starting to get it. He can also play corner in a pinch so he has versatility. Lewis is also bigger than James at 6'1" and 210. So Merriweather, Harrison, Harris and Lewis Sanders for a rotation (if Rodney comes back) Would be an upgrade. I think Sean Jones , the FA from Cleveland could be considered. He is only 27 and has recovered from his injuries if Rodney retires. One FA and a good draft SS would work.
DW Toys

 

[CanadianPat'sFan]

Box. Good post. Very thorough. Thank you. My guy to throw in here is Nik Harris from OU. The kid can play both safety positions and OLB. BB type versatility. He has run a 4.5. He is 6'2" and 233 lbs. He can cover and hit like hell. He could be the in-the-box Rodney guy as well.The good news is they are trying to jam him into the OLB position so he drops down in the draft but he was a safety at OU. He is also an excellent citizen and community kid. The big news is his cover skill. James Sanders did not do well there. I think Lewis Sanders played Safety down the stretch better than James S. and will cost us less to resign. He was just starting to get it. He can also play corner in a pinch so he has versatility. Lewis is also bigger than James at 6'1" and 210. So Merriweather, Harrison, Harris and Lewis Sanders for a rotation (if Rodney comes back) Would be an upgrade. I think Sean Jones , the FA from Cleveland could be considered. He is only 27 and has recovered from his injuries if Rodney retires. One FA and a good draft SS would work.
DW Toys

Well I agree on both fronts....BOR great job explaining how our FS and SS work in our system and Toy's I like Harris in the draft. Harris I believe is more like Rodney then any other of the safety prospects but each has their own perks. I think BB has to look to see who would compliment Marriweather on the backend plus is Rodney coming back or FA maybe the way to go in the short term and I think we can get Harris in the 3rd or 4th.

I like Dalmus who is coming from a small school (DRC)but did not look out of place at the senior bowl I would say he stood out. He is smaller but hits like a tank and looked extremely smooth for a safety but we have Marriweather. I think BB will look for more size out of his safety but this kid had monster stats in his last year and is a ball hawk. (would not take at #23 but if he slid to 47 BB might have to think hard)

William Moore - Well most of us have played ball and have had a bad week aka his Senior Bowl but before that everyone was on his bandwagon me included. His body of work will keep him as a late 1st rounder I believe but if this kid slipped I would pull the trigger. (Same as Dalmus)

Patrick Chung - I like the way he stepped up against the best WR in drills during Senior Bowl week. I see he was very productive in college but have not watched many of his games. (not sure yet)

Sean Smith is interesting because he can play corner and cover extremely well for a safety but is much taller then Dalmus. I think BB will like this kids versatility and we could find a spot for this kid in our secondary. (#47 is where I would target this kid)

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Box. Good post. Very thorough. Thank you. My guy to throw in here is Nik Harris from OU. The kid can play both safety positions and OLB. BB type versatility. He has run a 4.5. He is 6'2" and 233 lbs. He can cover and hit like hell. He could be the in-the-box Rodney guy as well.The good news is they are trying to jam him into the OLB position so he drops down in the draft but he was a safety at OU. He is also an excellent citizen and community kid. The big news is his cover skill. James Sanders did not do well there. I think Lewis Sanders played Safety down the stretch better than James S. and will cost us less to resign. He was just starting to get it. He can also play corner in a pinch so he has versatility. Lewis is also bigger than James at 6'1" and 210. So Merriweather, Harrison, Harris and Lewis Sanders for a rotation (if Rodney comes back) Would be an upgrade. I think Sean Jones , the FA from Cleveland could be considered. He is only 27 and has recovered from his injuries if Rodney retires. One FA and a good draft SS would work.
DW Toys

Well DW, I wouldn't touch Harris with your pole - they had him play LB at the Senior Bowl for a reason. I've also disagreed with your take on James Sanders, he may not be the greatest S in the NFL, but he's far better than you've ever given him credit - I expect BB to make an honest effort to re-sign him as the Patriots Field-Marshall in the secondary (I also believe he'll be less expensive than some of the UDFA studs being tossed out as options - this is going to be a cost conscious offseason). I predict Rodney will not be ready for Training Camp/Pre-season and will be working out and doing TV commentary until needed as an injury replacement in mid-season. I would like to see Lewis Sanders re-signed for another year to continue his tweener/STs duties and provide some veteran stability for the youngsters - he's also a tall CB for situational roles against the Antonio Gates of the league. I expect BB to draft at least 2 Safeties/CB tweeners and sign at least one more as a priority UDFA.

 

[mayoclinic]

Well DW, I wouldn't touch Harris with your pole - they had him play LB at the Senior Bowl for a reason.QUOTE]

I would agree with this. The idea of Nic Harris playing both safety positions plus LB is just not realistic - I'd be happy if he could realistically play one out of 3. The best case is that he would be another Tank William, who we could probably resign if we wanted.

 

[dryheat44]

Well DW, I wouldn't touch Harris with your pole - they had him play LB at the Senior Bowl for a reason.QUOTE]

I would agree with this. The idea of Nic Harris playing both safety positions plus LB is just not realistic - I'd be happy if he could realistically play one out of 3. The best case is that he would be another Tank William, who we could probably resign if we wanted.

I'm very interested to see how well Jonathan Casillas runs with that in mind.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

I'm very interested to see how well Jonathan Casillas runs with that in mind.

Bingo! He and a couple other speedy coverage LBs I scribbled notes on to myself somewhere...