From a Jets fan, I would like to hear some Positives about the Patriots from Pat fans

[patsox23]

Re: From a Jets fan,I would like to hear some Positives about the Patriots from Pat f

Hmmm.... Why dont you hgo talk about this on a Jets forum. Or a Bills FOrum. Or Dophins. You see, the problem is we have trouble hearing you here since you are so far below us in the standings!
Sorry, I had to say that, You guys might have a decent season, but the patriots are going to win championshps!

Hey. Mr. 9-posts. Pipe down. This is pretty much the ONLY good, productive thread DWC has started and it's perfectly legit, given the jets are our opponents this weekend.

This site has always prided itself on being open to multiple points of view, for arguments sake and for the sake of greater understanding - and while DWC has been largely a troll the last couple of days, THIS is not an example of it. I appreciate the spirit in which it was started.

Oh, and by the way, DWC - the Patriots' list of positives is too long to list. They are more talented across the roster than they may ever have been and have improved more than the jets since the last time we played, when we won by 21 points.

 

[Ring 6]

Re: From a Jets fan, I would like to hear some Positives about the Patriots from Pat

I just wanna add this as a Jets fan.

With Moss, Stallworth, Welker, A.Thomas, all playing thier first game as Patriots and with Seymour out-J.Green in, Harrison out-Sanders in, and also this will be Maroneys first game as the feature back along with A.Samules missing time because of the hold out...

Put it this way... From a Jets fan...

This is the best time for the JEts to play the Pats... Week one.

Why would an NFL veteran playing his first game with a new team be a negative? Wouldn't starting 2 rookies and hoping you can find a good High School G to start for you be worse?
Jarvis Green is a 5 year vet who has played a lot of football. If he is a problem them basically every team in the NFL including yours has a problem at DE. Harrison missed almost all of the last 2 seasons.
Maroney's position is running back, which is what he played last year.
I dont who A Samules is, but Asante Samuel may or may not play, and it wont effect the outcome of this game.

Given that your QB and OL have been awful in the preseason, and your RB is injured, plus you are FORCED to start 2 rookies on defense, I think you will regret having the Pats in week 1.
The difference is we can get through week 1 issues, because we are only playing the Jets.
You have to expose those week 1 issues against the Patriots.

I dont know when would be a good time to play the Patriots if I were the Jets, but the answer isnt this Sunday.

 

[DefenseWinsChampionships]

Re: From a Jets fan,I would like to hear some Positives about the Patriots from Pat f

I feel the Patriots have the best QB in all of Football in T.Brady. Some say P.Manning, I have always said T.Brady. If T.Brady had Harrison and Wayne over the past 3-4 seasons... Look out.

This year Brady will have Moss and Stallworth along with Welker. Maybe the Patriots best WR's that Brady has ever had a chance to work with. But at the same time, come week one... The chemesty may not be at 100% and the Jets may beable to slip through the cracks on Defense. Thats what I pray for.

The Patriots have always had one of the best Offensive Lines... Put it this way, if the Jets had the Patriots Offensive Line I would be relaxed each and evey play when Pennington drops back in the pocket on Sundays, but that's not the case as of right now.

L.Maroney is an explosive back. The AFC East added 2 RB's with great potential in L.Maroney and L.Washington. If Maroney can stay healthy and Morris can be a solid backup... The Patriots will have a strong running attack this season. I just feel the loss of Dillion will hurt them in the Redzone... But thats about it. And K.Faulk is underrated in the eyes of many. He's been one of the best 3rd down, change of pace backs in the NFL for years now.

The loss of Seymour will hurt this Defense because he's a leader and a playmaker... But J.Green is one of the best backup DE's in all of football... There is a reason why BB has kept Green on the roster for over 6 years now, the man can play... He may not be a R.Seymour, but he's no Kimo either. Add the fact that your D-Line has Wilfork and Warren and guess what? The Pats D-Line may just survive till Seymour is 100%

The loss of Harrison in the secondary is a problem because not only is Harrison a leader of that secondary, but teams never like throwing down the middle of the field when Harrison is roaming the backfield. But then again, Sanders I believe was the starter last year when the Pats beat the Jets. So Sanders can hold his own, he's no McGraw.

The addition of A.Thomas is huge. Teddy may be up thier in age, but he brings that leadership and toughness that every 3-4 D needs. Most players who had a stroke would be in Jamica right now, just the fact that he's still playing reminds me of P.Ewing with bad knees... What can you say? Other than he loves the game of football. J.Seau can still make plays and Mike Vrabel is a player who shows up for war each and every Sunday.

A.Samuels is one hell of a CB. I would love for this man to be on the Jets. We would have Samuels and Revis as our 1-2 for years to come, with Dyson and Miller as our 3-4 with Rhodes in the secondary as a Safety. WOW. Put he's a NE Patriot... And I honestly hope he's not ready to start because of the Holdout come week one... But as a fan of the NFL, I know he will be ready come week 3.

The Patriots have a great team... I wont lie... But as a Jets fan, I'm starting to like alot of things that Mangini is doing with this Jets team... Kinda reminds me of a younger NE team without a HOF QB. We simply have a game manager in Chad,I can live with that.

Once again Patriot fans... I'm a Jets fan who knows a thing or two about the Patriots. I know you all have a great team... I actually love the fact that the Jets have played in the AFC East with the Patriots for all these years for the simple fact it's only making the Jets a stronger team. As you can see in my post above... I know the Patriots are a strong team. Am I saying the Jets will win? No... But if you read my first post in this thread, you will see the reasons why I feel we stand a good chance.

The thread I made yesterday about the Jets winning the AFC East and the Pats missing the playoffs was just a way of letting this site know that I'm a Jets fan. I did it as a joke, not to piss anyone off or be a troll. Im from JetNation, believe me... We all know how great the Pats team can be this year. But as a Jets fan, I believe in this team this year just like I did last year... Sorry to say, but we are a MUCH better team this year than last. As a fan... Believing is everything, if you cant believe, whats the point of even being a fan?

And if you all think Im bad as a "Troll" just go to JetNation,com and check out ALK, or Garb or even PatriotsReign... Thank god PatsFanTX has been banned for life, and thank god Shasta has got the boot. If you think I'm bad, lmao... U aint seen nothin yet.

 

[Lloyd_Christmas]

Re: From a Jets fan, I would like to hear some Positives about the Patriots from Pat

Sure... I'll take the bait

Positives on the Pats:

We only lost a couple key players (Graham, Dillon, and I guess Banta-cain).

We were very close to winning the AFC Championship and possibly the SB last year with the same team minus the players above.

We added Kyle Brady to replace Graham (although he has been injured, so jury is still out. Rivers looks good as a #3 TE and Watson and Thomas are both excellent)

We added Sammy Morris to replace Dillon (Maroney is the starter). Morris has looked pretty good so far. Faulk is still a great 3rd down back. Maroney should have a great year and Evans is a decent FB.

Oline is about the same. QBs... ditto except that we added Gutierez instead of Vinny.

WR is the biggest difference. We have so many good additions that we could actually cut Caldwell, our leading WR last year. Moss is a great bargain and has a lot of upside. Stallworth should be a solid deep threat. Welker looks fantastic as a slot receiver. Even Washington looks halfway decent. We have really upgraded this position.

Defense is about the same plus we added A.Thomas. Randall Gay and many others are back from injury. I expect our defense to be as good and probably better than last year.

 

[SmokeShowin]

Re: From a Jets fan, I would like to hear some Positives about the Patriots from Pat

Well for one I'm positive that I hate Peyton Manning.

Oops! Positives about the Pats.

You'll see Sunday! BWAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

 

[amazinPats]

Re: From a Jets fan, I would like to hear some Positives about the Patriots from Pat

Ease up on DWC, guys! His posts on this thread have all been well argued and thought out.

But to respond to his main doubts about the Patriots for this game, I remind him that both Sey and Harrison were frequently out of games last year owing to injury or being reduced to a lesser effective role (as w/ Seymour) owing to being banged up. We're used to these two guys not playing. No big deal.

The main problem for teams facing the Pats this year will be how to keep up on the scoretable. Can old spaghetti arm answer to the pressure of having to score on almost every possession? I see our offense as being unstoppable right now w/ the new receiver corps, the experienced and unified o-line, and with Maroney and his backups.

Have fun trying to keep up and throwing against our prevent defense for most of the game.

 

[Ring 6]

Re: From a Jets fan, I would like to hear some Positives about the Patriots from Pat

OK, DWC, you keep fishing for a response. Here is my opinion of the Jets.

They may be the most thoroughly average football team I have ever seen.

I can understand your excitement because you have listed your players and overrated all of them.

QB. Pennington is the epitome of an average QB if healthy, and we know thats a day to day thing. Weak arm, smart guy, who has had a career of leading teams to average results.
RB. How many starting NFL RBs have been in the league as long as Thomas Jones and have fewer yards? I guess none. There are 2 types of starting RBs in the NFL, young guys with tremendous ability, and veterans hanging on to great careers. Jones is no longer young, and has less of a career than any other starter in his age group.
WR. Coles and Cotchery are pretty good players, but look around the league. Most teams have guys like them. They arent special.
TE. Blah
OL. Worse than average. Ferguson was pulverized in many games as a rookie. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt that he improves. I like Mangold. The rest is average or significantly worse.
DL. Robertson has not played like he was hyped. He has played average. The DEs are decent, not great.
LB. Vilma is severely undersized in the 3-4. He is a big reason Mangini put the pins in the voodoo doll, and blitzed all day long the 2nd half of last year. You will not win consistently if you cannot stop the run without massive blitz schemes. Next to him is a rookie, and a couple of very average OLBs.
DB. A rookie starts and an average at best vet starts next to him. Safety is another very average position.
STs. Nugent made 78.6% of his FG attempts last year. How does that mean he 'is becoming one of the best kickers in the nfl"?. Our rookie made 76.9% and is a much, much better KO guy, yet no one here is calling him one of the best in the NFL. Your return game maybe above average.

There is really no unit or group that is above average (or even if you stretch it they aren't clearly above average) which is why you allowed more 1st downs and yardage than you gained last year. Why you had a winning record built upon a very weak schedule and a tremendous run of luck.

Finally, where coaching is concerned I think its ludocrous at this point to consider Mangini above average. It is his 2nd year, he has a lot to prove. If Pennington played in 2005 (and all the other injuries didnt happen) what would the Jets have been in 2005? Probably around 8-8, with a chance to sneak in at 9-7 or 10-6. If Herm had stayed for 2006, and you had the same schedule and injury luck, what would the 2006 Jets have done? Probably also somewhere between 8-8 and 10-6. What Mangini has shown so far is that he can do what Herm Edwards did without injury problems. Herm Edwards, IMO, is among the worst coaches in the NFL. Mangini needs to show more to prove he is a good coach, 1 year of maintaining exactly what the team had been doing (with 1 down year thrown in due ot injuries) before he arrived.
Do you really think you would have won more than 4 or 5 games last year with Mangini in and Brooks bollinger still at QB?
Thats not to say Mangini didn't do a good job, but its way, way to early to assess him, and to compare his year to the one before when you went from a ton of injuires to almost none is short sighted.

Your team may be improved (although I see it very identical to last years) but it was very average last year, with a record reflecting some close wins, an easy schedule and good fortune in injuries. This years team looks to me to be very average, 8-8, with a longshot chance to make the playoffs, and a bad injury season away from 5-11 or 6-10.

 

[Ring 6]

Re: From a Jets fan, I would like to hear some Positives about the Patriots from Pat

Sure... I'll take the bait

Positives on the Pats:

We only lost a couple key players (Graham, Dillon, and I guess Banta-cain).

We were very close to winning the AFC Championship and possibly the SB last year with the same team minus the players above.

We added Kyle Brady to replace Graham (although he has been injured, so jury is still out. Rivers looks good as a #3 TE and Watson and Thomas are both excellent)

We added Sammy Morris to replace Dillon (Maroney is the starter). Morris has looked pretty good so far. Faulk is still a great 3rd down back. Maroney should have a great year and Evans is a decent FB.

Oline is about the same. QBs... ditto except that we added Gutierez instead of Vinny.

WR is the biggest difference. We have so many good additions that we could actually cut Caldwell, our leading WR last year. Moss is a great bargain and has a lot of upside. Stallworth should be a solid deep threat. Welker looks fantastic as a slot receiver. Even Washington looks halfway decent. We have really upgraded this position.

Defense is about the same plus we added A.Thomas. Randall Gay and many others are back from injury. I expect our defense to be as good and probably better than last year.

OL is the same players, but the unit should play better with more experience.
Mankins is in year 3, Kaczur year 3, and OCallahan in year 2. Koppen and Light are far from the age of decline.
Keeping a strong unit together longer, and with more experience and maturity is an improvement.

 

[patsox23]

Re: From a Jets fan, I would like to hear some Positives about the Patriots from Pat

I agree with all of what AJ said, except I'll give you a bit more benefit of the doubt when it comes to safety. Coleman's okay, but Kerry Rhodes is special.

 

[DefenseWinsChampionships]

Re: From a Jets fan, I would like to hear some Positives about the Patriots from Pat

It's amazing how little respect Patriot fans show the Jets after we just picked up Thomas Jones, and drafted the Nations #1 ranked CB in D.Revis and the Nations #3 MLB in D.Harris.

For example... A poster above actually said the Jets return game is just average? LMAO... J.Miller was the 2nd best return man in the game last year behind D.Hester...

 

[PatsFanDan]

Re: From a Jets fan, I would like to hear some Positives about the Patriots from Pat

I just wanna add this as a Jets fan.

With Moss, Stallworth, Welker, A.Thomas, all playing thier first game as Patriots and with Seymour out-J.Green in, Harrison out-Sanders in, and also this will be Maroneys first game as the feature back along with A.Samules missing time because of the hold out...

Put it this way... From a Jets fan...

This is the best time for the JEts to play the Pats... Week one.

No offense or anything but week 1 is the best time to play any team. The best teams typically play their best football towards the end of the season barring injuries. But no one really knows what to expect week 1.

Am I confident the Pats will beat the Jets this weekend? Of course. But I was confident they would beat the Bills in the opener a few years back after Milloy got cut and the Pats got completely manhandled.

Different circumstances I know, but the bottom line is the Pats of week 1 that year stunk up the joint and they went on to win the SB.

And I understand we have to start somewhere but if you are hoping the Jets win because the Pats have so many new players learning the system......well then I guess you have already answered the question of who you think is probably the better team.

 

[amazinPats]

Re: From a Jets fan, I would like to hear some Positives about the Patriots from Pat

It's amazing how little respect Patriot fans show the Jets after we just picked up Thomas Jones, and drafted the Nations #1 ranked CB in D.Revis and the Nations #3 MLB in D.Harris.

We picked up arguably the best safety in Brandon Merriweather, but rookie safeties normally don't make much impact their first year. Ditto for cornerbacks and for the most part, linebackers as well. These picks are more likely to help you down the road rather than now.

 

[DisgruntledTunaFan]

Re: From a Jets fan, I would like to hear some Positives about the Patriots from Pat

We picked up arguably the best safety in Brandon Merriweather, but rookie safeties normally don't make much impact their first year. Ditto for cornerbacks and for the most part, linebackers as well. These picks are more likely to help you down the road rather than now.

Isn't Revis a blue chip CB?

 

[amazinPats]

Re: From a Jets fan, I would like to hear some Positives about the Patriots from Pat

Isn't Revis a blue chip CB?

/So what? Read my post again.

I don't pretend to know everything, but see if you can name the last rookie cornerback to make a huge impact. Some can be solid, but I can't remember a real rookie game breaker.

 

[amazinPats]

Re: From a Jets fan, I would like to hear some Positives about the Patriots from Pat

Another point I'd like to make: Asante's return is greater news than Rodney's departure for four games.

Just a couple weeks ago, no one was sure that Asante would play until game 10.

 

[shmessy]

Re: From a Jets fan, I would like to hear some Positives about the Patriots from Pat

And here are some of my positives as a Jets fan on the Jets.


-We had a solid draft in terms of drafting starters for this Defense. We drafted D.Revis out of Pittsburg who was the #1 ranked CB in the Nation, and we also drafted D.Harris out of Michigan who was the #3 ranked MLB in the Nation. (Plus he played as a 3-4 IMLB)

In 2000, we drafted Tom Brady who was the #3,451,987 ranked QB in the nation.

 

[shmessy]

Re: From a Jets fan, I would like to hear some Positives about the Patriots from Pat

-Our Recievers. L.Coles, J.Cotch, J.Mac, B.Smith and C.Stukey is one hell of a group for opposing secondarys to try an keep up with. Last year Cotchery had one hell of a season for a first year starter, and first year working with Chad for a full season. Coles was tough as nails, J.Mac has been playing great this whole offseason, B.Smith can do alot of different things and atleast keep the Defense honest and C.Stucky has alot of potential to make some big plays for us this season. I like what I see in this group of WR's.
____________________________

Randy Moss, Donte Stallworth, Wes Welker, Kelly Washington and Jabar Gaffney send their best regards.

.......but of course, they are catching passes thrown by the #3,451,987 ranked college QB that we mistakenly drafted in 2000.