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[FREUD ALERT?] “Even though we’re three, we could be at 23,” Pioli said.

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by JSn, Feb 22, 2009.

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  1. JSn

    JSn Rookie

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    OK, so in a transcript of Pioli talking at the Combine from the KC Star, Scott said this:

    Alrighty, did he pick #23 randomly out of the sky, or is this a hint/slip-up?

    I didn't see anyone else mention this, so pardon me if it was covered in some "Everyone Loves Matty" thread.

    Full Article: http://www.kansascity.com/sports/story/1047043.html
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2009
  2. Box_O_Rocks

    Box_O_Rocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Good find!

    Reading the article, I get the impression a reporter prefaced his question with a reference to New England's past draft day trades...arguably that brings NE into the discussion leading to the #23 remark. Though it does make one rub his hands with greed pondering a swap of first round picks and the potential of taking a top LT/WR/LB in this draft.
  3. ctpatsfan77

    ctpatsfan77 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Fixed your post for you. :D
  4. drew4008

    drew4008 Rookie

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    Re: [FREUD ALERT?] “Even though we’re three, we could be at 23,” Pioli said.

    lol, Pioli is way too smart to both a) just randomly pick that number, and 2) make a slip-up of giving away information. He's doing it for kicks.
  5. BPF

    BPF Rookie

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    Re: [FREUD ALERT?] “Even though we’re three, we could be at 23,” Pioli said.

    How about this from Pioli:
    Official Patriots Football Weekly Blog Blog Archive Pioli: Cassel “hasn’t signed” franchise tender

    Lots of interesting comments from SP today.
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2009
  6. signbabybrady

    signbabybrady Rookie

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    #24 Jersey

    OK so now that that is settled who should we take at #3 ....my vote goes to Curry.
  7. AzPatsFan

    AzPatsFan Rookie

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    LBs can be gotten throughout the draft. Premium LOTs and Richard Seymours require top 10 picks. The Pats are seldom there. When they are, you take the Big Uglies. As Bill says "...God made only so many fast, quick, big men...". :eek:;)
  8. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    The questions is, do the Patriots really want #3. So far I'd be happy with their 2nd rounder and some other comp, like 2nd next year.
  9. Box_O_Rocks

    Box_O_Rocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Re: [FREUD ALERT?] “Even though we’re three, we could be at 23,” Pioli said.

    I'd be happy with that too, but #3 got more interesting with the Jason Smith/Monroe battles added to Crabtree and Curry.
  10. StyLeZ X

    StyLeZ X Rookie

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    Crabtree/Welk and Moss?

    oh my ******* GOD.

    but yeah I'd have to go with Curry...him and Mayo?

    oh my ******* GOD.
  11. JSn

    JSn Rookie

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    If we actually take a player at #3, please, please, please let it be a defensive player. If we got a Mayo 2.0, that would be DEF!
  12. DW Toys

    DW Toys Rookie

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    OK. I felt that a swap of picks and their second gets the deal done with K.C. and Scott keeps a first rounder. Now we shop that pick to Carolina for Peppers and they get Stafford to groom under the Jakester. Carolina does not have a first rounder either. Everyone thinks that the Lions will go Stafford.....Why would they do that when they had a better team and drafted Harrington and he looks like he came back from a very rough tour in Afghanistan to date? He has never been the same. An 0-16 team is not going to fix itself overnight with a QB. They need too many things. Think how Long helped the Dolphins. The Lions actually do have the makings of a decent O-Line. Monroe would solidify it. They can let Culpepper have another year. The Rams have a QB that if they had some new weapons and some O-Line help they could flourish better. They have a great RB. So I say they could go Crabtree for the sexy pick or OT Jason Smith from Baylor if Pace retires or they cut him. Stafford would be a bad investment for them there. So I can see Stafford falling to third.
    We get Peppers and the #34 pick. Pioli gets Cassel (is this already a done deal?) and keeps a first rounder at.....#23!!! and the Panthers get Stafford.
    DW Toys
  13. pats63

    pats63 Rookie

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    one of the top LT......SP is too smart to just slip....and for sure give up anything......
  14. Bobs My Uncle

    Bobs My Uncle PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #12 Jersey

    If I am understanding this correct, this scenario would only make sense if you figure the Panthers value Stafford more than Cassel. Otherwise, it would make more sense for the Pats and Panthers to do a straight trade of Cassel and Peppers.

    Panthers get the proven QB in Cassel instead of tossing a dart on Stafford. Pats get Peppers and keep their own 1st.
  15. Brettlax3434

    Brettlax3434 Rookie

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    I think Pioli is playing his cards and sending a message to the pats. That message being he will not give us the three for Cassel, but he will give the three for cassel and the twenty-three (I also believe the chiefs would throw in the thirty-four in that trade).
  16. JSn

    JSn Rookie

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    Considering Scott and Bill are close friends, I doubt he's "sending the Pats a message". :rolleyes:
  17. mayoclinic

    mayoclinic PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Trading the #3 pick for Peppers doesn't make sense to me. A 30 year old DE who wants to convert to 3-4 OLB, with his salary issues? I'm sorry, I'm all for Peppers if we can make it work, but not for that deal.

    #3, #34, #47 and #58 would be a sick first day. Even better if we can trade back with Jax for #8 and #40 and end up with #8, #34, #40, #47 and #58. My dream:

    8: BJ Raji DT
    34: Sean Smith CB/S, or possibly Alphonso Smith/DJ Moore CB or Louis Delmas/William Moore S
    40: Eben Britton OT or Alex Mack OG/C
    47: Best available LB prospect among Connor Barwin, Clint Sintim, Larry English or Clay Matthews
  18. tanked_as_usual

    tanked_as_usual Banned

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    and where do premium LOT's get you?

    2006 - ferguson at #5 or marcus mcneill at #50?
    2005 - brown at #13 or roos at #41?
    2004 - gallery at #2 or starks at #75 or jason peters at (undrafted)?

    sure there are guys who are perennial probowlers but when has tying up huge resources at OT ever equated to an incremental improvement of a team?

    in my opinion, ''good enough" works much better at OT than at many other positions
  19. Brettlax3434

    Brettlax3434 Rookie

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    Its about playing your cards and negotiating, not malicious or unfriendly, just business. :eek:
  20. tanked_as_usual

    tanked_as_usual Banned

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    pioli and BB know each other and create a more mutually beneficial situation

    which is another reason why you leave the division for your promotion
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2009
  21. mayoclinic

    mayoclinic PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Your point is a good one. But it is still very hard to get quality big men later in the draft than quality LBs.

    I love Aaron Curry. I had my eye on him a year ago, and 6 months ago when everyone was hyping Laurinaitis and Maualuga I thought he was the best LB around by far. But if we have a top 10 pick (especially a top 5 pick) I think that unless we are absolutely 100% convinced that he will be another Lawrence Taylor, or at least another Junior Seau/Ray Lewis, that we're better off spending the pick on a big guy. BJ Raji and Jason Smith would both be excellent picks, and would have enormous value to the team.
  22. tanked_as_usual

    tanked_as_usual Banned

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    I just think there is a bigger law of diminished returns with the drafting of a top of round 1 OT..........I believe it forces you to overpay for the position.....not just in the resources yoy give up (the draft pick), but also the $$ you spend on the contract........Leonard Davis is a better OL than Matt Light, but what difference would he have made? if you go over the past years, what could walter jones, or jordan gross, or any of the top LOT's in the league done to put the pats in a better place than they are? you also must consider the $$ it would have cost for that guy and the compromise it would have forced somewhere else on the roster.........
  23. tanked_as_usual

    tanked_as_usual Banned

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    I simply don't believe the pats would move up to #3 to get an OT........

    the way I see it, if this deal would go down, it would only go down on draft day and only if curry is available.........I don't see anyone else in that spot that the pats would get all jiggy over
  24. tanked_as_usual

    tanked_as_usual Banned

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    what is better value? a guy like jason smith at #3 or a guy like beatty at #23 and why?
  25. JSn

    JSn Rookie

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    I find it hard to imagine the top 5 even holds "good value" since that would be equivalent to getting your money's worth, and that's not gonna happen with top tier players like... ever.
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2009
  26. Richter

    Richter Rookie

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    I totally disagree with you and think you couldn't be more wrong, to be frank. Linemen on both sides of the ball are the most valuable commodity aside from a QB. It costs more to lock up a top tackle in the league than it does a linebacker usually. If you hit with an OT at the top of the draft, you're probably set there for several years, and the money you're spending is equivalent to what you would have spent to lock up a guy in FA. What could a guy like Jones or a Clady or Thomas have meant to putting the Pats in a better place? I dunno, 19-0 instead of 18-1? If the Pats had an elite LT that allowed them to slide Light to RT, it could have strengthened the line as a whole and allowed the offense to perform well against the Giants. Yes, it was the defense that ultimately failed in that game, but they did their job for 58 minutes or so. Had the offense done more before that final hookup between Brady and Moss, the game would have long been won. It's all hypothetical, but I'm a firm believer of building from the lines outward. The way the Patriots run things, defensive linemen are the most valuable commodity, but offensive linemen are valuable too. Going after a guy like Curry, who is overrated as an athlete and won't be a franchise type defender in the Patriots' scheme for the same amount of money makes far less sense to me. I'd much rather go after a premium defensive end (to be rush linebacker), defensive tackle or offensive tackle at the top than a guy like Curry who'll probably play inside in the Patriots' scheme where we already have a top quality performer in Mayo who'll command significant dollars down the line. If you evaluate Curry as the best player in the draft, or better than the top OTs, and think he'll be more than a just a solid WILB in the Patriots' scheme, taking him makes some sense, but I don't think he's nearly that good and plays a less valuable, easier to fill position.
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2009
  27. JoeSixPat

    JoeSixPat Rookie

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    Pioli's just probably running his mouth off without even thinking about what he says. It's a bad habit he picked up from Belichick.
  28. mayoclinic

    mayoclinic PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Totally agree. I see one DL player worth going after, BJ Raji, and one OL player, Jason Smith. Curry is a great player, but we've already got Mayo, and if we hypothetically should get another top 10 pick I would go after one of those 2 guys. Same thing with Crabtree - great player, but give me OL/DL, with a strong preference for defense.
  29. The_Riddler

    The_Riddler Rookie

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    Are you assuming we replace Big Vince with Raji, or would Raji be Big Sey's replacement ? If so, not sure how that helps our overall defense. I agree with focusing on the interior, but in our situation that value is with the stud OT who could start out at RT and take over for Matt in 2-3 years, fully groomed.
  30. ctpatsfan77

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    :rofl: :D
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