Fred Smerlas..."The Jets are a fraud"

[Richter]

This is illogical. You have taken a negative opinion of Mangini and thus assumed that he can't possibly do anything right, instead of looking at what he actually did, and what he actually lost.

For example...

Favre > Chad Pennington...this is obvious. Well you might say that Favre's low is lower than Chad, while ignoring that Favre's upside is absurdly better.

Jenkins > Robertson...Sure Jenkins has had his issues. So does Robertson. Mainly he stinks. The Jets couldn't even get a 3rd round pick for a guy they drafted 4th overall. And he was playing out of position, playing 3-4 nose. How is this not a big upgrade?

Pace > Hobson...Victor Hobson playing his best position can't get a job on any team in the league. Victor Hobson playing his weaker (OLB) position STARTED last year on the Jets. Pace is a rush linebacker who fits well in a 3-4 defense. Mangini is not the only one who thought so. Bill Parcells did. Bill Belichick did. But of course, he is not an upgrade over a guy who was playing out of position last year and this year can't find a job.

08 OL > 07 OL...Faneca is only a seven-time Pro Bowler. Woody is only replacing Anthony freeking Clement. But yea I could see how these aren't significant upgrades.

Something isn't illogical because you don't agree with it. And please, before you start to argue, don't tell someone else what their position is and then attempt to debate it. My opinion is my opinion because it is what I have concluded after evaluating the situation, not because I dislike Mangini. I've never even stated I dislike Mangini. You have your evaluations of the players they brought in versus their replacements, and I have mine. We don't agree. Why can't you accept that, rather than build a strawman to knock down and call my argument illogical without even understanding it?

Edit: Oh, and I've seen you make this claim before, and it's still wrong- Hobson's natural position is OLB in the 4-3, and it's where he played in the NFL in the 3-4. Not ILB. He didn't play there at Michigan, there was just talk of moving him to the inside when he came into the league, and we see how that panned out. His greatest success came at OLB.

 

[JoePats]

Something isn't illogical because you don't agree with it. And please, before you start to argue, don't tell someone else what their position is and then attempt to debate it. My opinion is my opinion because it is what I have concluded after evaluating the situation, not because I dislike Mangini. I've never even stated I dislike Mangini. You have your evaluations of the players they brought in versus their replacements, and I have mine. We don't agree. Why can't you accept that, rather than build a strawman to knock down and call my argument illogical without even understanding it?

Edit: Oh, and I've seen you make this claim before, and it's still wrong- Hobson's natural position is OLB in the 4-3, and it's where he played in the NFL in the 3-4. Not ILB. He didn't play there at Michigan, there was just talk of moving him to the inside when he came into the league, and we see how that panned out. His greatest success came at OLB.

You are correct on Hobson, my mistake. I just can't look at those guys that have been replaced and say that they are good. They are not good, by any standard. Everyone who has come in is an upgrade, mostly significant upgrades. When you have significant upgrades at your biggest positions of need, the team is far better.

 

[averywhitehall]

First of all...You think Fred Smerlas might be a little biased, seeing as how he played for the Pats and the Bills? So I take his words with a grain of salt.

Nobody takes into account that Chad knows us so so well; well enough that he was able to exploit matchups and drive his team on the field. He knew to avoid Ted Ginn Jr. because Darrelle Revis was in shutdown mode. He attacked us at the tight end position, because we had linebackers on them. His two TD's were to tight ends Hagan and A. Fasano.

He had most of his yards in the fourth quarter as well. Over 100+ I believe. Fraking prevent defense. The only thing I can think of that I am scared of is our pass rush withered during the 4th quarter. He had too much time. Picked us apart. Can't cover anyone forever y'know.

But you're crazy if you don't think that the Jets aren't above average in all three phases of the game. Just how much above average is up to arguement.

So.. allow me to argue:

1) The 49 rushing yards allowed is a FREAKING HUGE leap over last year. You can't say, "Well it's just the Dolphins and they were 1-15 last year.", Well that same 1-15 team ran for 100+ yards both games last year on the Jets. Kris Jenkins is the difference. He eats up two blockers and still gets in the backfield. You can't just run on these Jets anymore. Also the Jets had 4 sacks in the first game. It took them to the 6th game to get 4 sacks last year. It's not the same team as last year. Also...Darrelle Revis, Matt Cassel better not throw this man's way. All I'm saying is he shut down Moss and T.O. last year and that was without a training camp and with both all pro-QB's. Just don't throw his way is all I'm saying. He shrinks the playing field.

2) The offense is better as well with our HOF QB...and they will make our recievers better than they already were. Jerricho Cotchery had 1 TD all of last season...and has matched that already. I also like how Thomas Jones matched his TD totals of last season in just one game. This should tell you something. How bad we were last year vs how good we are this year. Tremendous difference.

3) Our return game for both punts and kickoffs have been exceptional for years. Both Justin Miller (when he returns) and Leon Washington are exceptions return specialists. The only think in question is our field goal game. But even if it is just at an average level...it's doesn't bring down out ST value.

You think Favre will throw passes like the one he threw on 4th & 13 on a regular basis? Ha...hell no! It only happened because the kicker was hurt. Feely would have made that 32 yard FG that Nugent missed as well as the point after that we made after failing to convert. That adds an additional 4 points and makes the game not even that close.

Not going to predict a win...just dont be so shocked if the jets pull it off.

-Chris

 

[PATSNUTme]

Gee, I took a nap, what did I miss???????

I came up with the Rodney sig when he went down. It seems to work out well even though there were many doubters. Hopefully it will work for Tommy coming back at full tilt next year.

 

[Richter]

You are correct on Hobson, my mistake. I just can't look at those guys that have been replaced and say that they are good. They are not good, by any standard. Everyone who has come in is an upgrade, mostly significant upgrades. When you have significant upgrades at your biggest positions of need, the team is far better.

I'm not disputing that they are upgrades, remember- just that they aren't going to make that big of a difference. The Dolphins look like they are worse than last year, that defense is significantly weaker. We'll need to see the Jets play more of the schedule to have a better idea of how good they are, but as it stands, I am not impressed by their signings. People are picking them for double digit wins, and I think that's a pipe dream. 6-10 to 8-8, at best.

 

[Richter]

1) The 49 rushing yards allowed is a FREAKING HUGE leap over last year. You can't say, "Well it's just the Dolphins and they were 1-15 last year.", Well that same 1-15 team ran for 100+ yards both games last year on the Jets. Kris Jenkins is the difference. He eats up two blockers and still gets in the backfield. You can't just run on these Jets anymore. Also the Jets had 4 sacks in the first game. It took them to the 6th game to get 4 sacks last year. It's not the same team as last year. Also...Darrelle Revis, Matt Cassel better not throw this man's way. All I'm saying is he shut down Moss and T.O. last year and that was without a training camp and with both all pro-QB's. Just don't throw his way is all I'm saying. He shrinks the playing field.

One game, against a gimpy Ronnie Brown and Ricky freakin' Williams, and suddenly you can't run on the Jets anymore? Fatboy Jenkins still looks sloppy and moveable in the middle. I'll take my chances with the Patriots rushing attack against the Jets.In fact, that entire post is Jets homerism at its worst. 4 sacks against the worst offensive line in the league! In the words of the immortal Derrick Coleman, whoop-de-damn-doo.

 

[cstjohn17]

Smerlas is an idiot, almost impossible to watch.

 

[Richter]

I felt the need to bump this. Looks like Smerlas was right. Bunch of frauds. Fatboy Jenkins looked real good getting steam-rolled by our offensive line and 3rd runningback. Calvin Pace definitely changed field position with his play - too bad for the Jets it was through personal fouls and not sacks. Faneca and Woody? Nice holes they opened, Thomas Jones really ran wild. The only reason Revis got off the hook was because Cassel couldn't throw the ball when Moss burned him utterly. I don't even need to comment on the so-called legend at quarterback. Same old Jets, some upgrades they showed today.