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Former CIGNA executive says Michael Moore was right

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by Holy Diver, Jul 14, 2009.

  1. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Pro Bowl Player

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    #80 Jersey

    Bill Moyers Journal . Wendell Potter on Profits Before Patients | PBS

    Video: Bill Moyers Journal . Watch & Listen | PBS


    Transcript:

    BILL MOYERS: So what did you think when you saw that film?

    WENDELL POTTER: I thought that he hit the nail on the head with his movie. But the industry, from the moment that the industry learned that Michael Moore was taking on the health care industry, it was really concerned.

    BILL MOYERS: What were they afraid of?

    WENDELL POTTER: They were afraid that people would believe Michael Moore.

    BILL MOYERS: We obtained a copy of the game plan that was adopted by the industry's trade association, AHIP. And it spells out the industry strategies in gold letters. It says, "Highlight horror stories of government-run systems." What was that about?

    WENDELL POTTER: The industry has always tried to make Americans think that government-run systems are the worst thing that could possibly happen to them, that if you even consider that, you're heading down on the slippery slope towards socialism. So they have used scare tactics for years and years and years, to keep that from happening. If there were a broader program like our Medicare program, it could potentially reduce the profits of these big companies. So that is their biggest concern.

    BILL MOYERS: And there was a political strategy. "Position Sicko as a threat to Democrats' larger agenda." What does that mean?

    WENDELL POTTER: That means that part of the effort to discredit this film was to use lobbyists and their own staff to go onto Capitol Hill and say, "Look, you don't want to believe this movie. You don't want to talk about it. You don't want to endorse it. And if you do, we can make things tough for you."

    BILL MOYERS: How?

    WENDELL POTTER: By running ads, commercials in your home district when you're running for reelection, not contributing to your campaigns again, or contributing to your competitor.

    BILL MOYERS: This is fascinating. You know, "Build awareness among centrist Democratic policy organizations--"

    WENDELL POTTER: Right.

    BILL MOYERS: "--including the Democratic Leadership Council."

    WENDELL POTTER: Absolutely.

    BILL MOYERS: Then it says, "Message to Democratic insiders. Embracing Moore is one-way ticket back to minority party status."

    WENDELL POTTER: Yeah.

    BILL MOYERS: Now, that's exactly what they did, didn't they? They--

    WENDELL POTTER: Absolutely.

    BILL MOYERS: --radicalized Moore, so that his message was discredited because the messenger was seen to be radical.

    WENDELL POTTER: Absolutely. In memos that would go back within the industry — he was never, by the way, mentioned by name in any memos, because we didn't want to inadvertently write something that would wind up in his hands. So the memos would usually-- the subject line would be-- the emails would be, "Hollywood." And as we would do the media training, we would always have someone refer to him as Hollywood entertainer or Hollywood moviemaker Michael Moore.

    BILL MOYERS: Why?

    WENDELL POTTER: Well, just to-- Hollywood, I think people think that's entertainment, that's movie-making. That's not real documentary. They don't want you to think that it was a documentary that had some truth. They would want you to see this as just some fantasy that a Hollywood filmmaker had come up with. That's part of the strategy.
     
  2. Mabeyitstrue

    Mabeyitstrue Banned

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    Michael Moore is the man, I really like him he just get's it.

    The movie was great best part was when they went to the other countries hospitals and how nice they where and how it was not like anything the right-wing says it is, was a great eye-opener for me and our family.

    Scare tactics only work for so long right wing;)
     
  3. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    Thank God there isn't a chance is hell we'll go to Single Payer and only a small chance we'll go to a Public Option. Filling the holes is all we're going to do - as it should be.
     
  4. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Pro Bowl Player

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    #80 Jersey

    the public option will probably lead to single payer. FYI.
     
  5. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    WOULD . . . not WILL. There likely won't be a public option.
     
  6. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Pro Bowl Player

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    #80 Jersey

    riiiiiiiiight.......the mandated president is pushing it with a filibiuster-proof majority....


    I guess we can keep the system that the former CIGNA exec says is complete BS, and will bankrupt out country in 40 years?

    sounds wonderful.

    what excatly does "fill in the holes" mean?
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2009
  7. BelichickFan

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    #24 Jersey

    obama has no mandate on healthcare, the polls are split almost even. American people want the uninsured covered but not for the government to take over.

    As for your filibuster proof majority, that doesn't help unless they vote along party lines and that's not going to happen with the current polls.

    It means giving necessary (but no more) healthcare to those Americans (not illegals) who can't afford it but not changing the working system we already have.
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2009
  8. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Pro Bowl Player

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    #80 Jersey

    70% of americans favor a public option. Thats a mandate and a half.
    I agree that democrats are B!tchez when it comes to the 60 votes. But reference the CIGNA exec who claims that they threatened the dems with non-funding and attack ads if they went aginst the insurer.

    Giving necessary care to those who don't have it? sounds like a public option to me. none of what you claim is being discussed as a viable option at all.

    a public option not run for profit will eliminate the insurers who deny coverage, and operate to profit off such practices. It will create a single payer system. Its called baby steps.
     
  9. BelichickFan

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    #24 Jersey

    While that is true, I don't think most Americans have a clue what they're saying YES or NO to in polls.

    Read the MSNBC article :

    House health plan to boost taxes on rich - White House- msnbc.com

    And tell me how many mentions the Public Option gets.

    It's all about mandates for coverage and subsidies for coverage.

    I know "profit" is an ugly word to you but public healthcare has to make the same "profit" decisions, they're just deciding what's "affordable" instead of what's "profitable". No real difference. The main difference is I can change insurance companies, I can't change governments when they're running the only game in town.
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2009
  10. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    The Government destroys everything it touches, you don't want American Politicians anywhere near your family's health care, keep the dirty bastards away from your Doctor and your Gall Bladder.

    THEY WILL KILL YOU
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2009
  11. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Pro Bowl Player

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    #80 Jersey


    I dissagree, and apparently so does the former CIGNA exec...

    healthcare insurance is a scam. Why do I need to pay an insurer to be the middle man beween me and my doctor? You proponents of the current system always state that you don't want government running your healthcare, yet you accept an insurer dictating your payments?

    Its cool with you that CIGNA's Wendell Potter is creating policy decisions on behalf of people who are covered by CIGNA for profit. His company only benefits from denial of coverage, so its in HIS best interest to expand your payments and deny his companies. They do this on a regular basis.

    He admits to these practices.

    He admits to attempting to thwart the truth about it by threatening congress.



    yet.....you still believe in the likes of CIGNA??????


    You sound like teh guy who catches his wife banging his best friend, both deny it....and you accept it. After all, its your wife and best friend....they wouldn't lie to you.

    Its ass-backwards...



    FOR-PROFIT-MEDICAL-INSURANCE is an evil thing to think about.
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2009
  12. tanked_as_usual

    tanked_as_usual Banned

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  13. BelichickFan

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    #24 Jersey

    The current system isn't what I would like, I would prefer lower premiums with less covered. I can pay for the small stuff, I'd like to pay less and just have the big stuff covered. But given the choice of what I have now vs. going on medicare (single payer), I'll take what I've got.
     
  14. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Pro Bowl Player

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    #80 Jersey

    I know. Your points are valid for your situation. But 50 million people ar enot in your or my situation. They need to be accounted for,m and brought inot the system to bring down OUR payments.

    we know each other's stances pretty well.

    I think your stance makes sense for you.
     
  15. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Pro Bowl Player

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    #80 Jersey

    polls....


    http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/21/health/policy/21poll.html


    The national telephone survey, which was conducted from June 12 to 16, found that 72 percent of those questioned supported a government-administered insurance plan — something like Medicare for those under 65 — that would compete for customers with private insurers. Twenty percent said they were opposed.


    here is anopther one from a few hours ago:

    http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2009-07-13-poll-health-care_N.htm

    56% in favor if it...
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2009
  16. BelichickFan

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    #24 Jersey

    Not giving medical care to illegals and mandating coverage for those who can afford it would take care of about 2/3 of that 50M.
     
  17. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Pro Bowl Player

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    #80 Jersey

    Illegals are just that...ILLEGAL.

    I will never say I'm for illegals taking a red-cent of my tax money. PERIOD.


    we can also reduce admin costs by something like 30%, we can cover everyone.



    lets do BOTH!
     
  18. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    That's what they always say. I don't believe it. The "savings" will eventually be paid for by tax increases.
     
  19. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Pro Bowl Player

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    #80 Jersey

    Check how things are run in Taiwan....

    We spend more than anyone per insured.



    From "sick around the world" PBS: FRONTLINE: sick around the world: interviews: uwe reinhardt & tsung-mei cheng | PBS

    We noticed, traveling around the world, that every other country covers everybody, but they do it for a lot less money than the U.S. spends. How can the United States spend so much more than everybody else on health care?

    Reinhardt: There are a number of factors. The first thing is, of course, that we are the richest in terms of GDP [gross domestic product] per capita, and there is a very close correlation between health spending per capita and GDP. ... But that equation between income and spending cannot explain that we spend ... $1,500 more [per capita] than everyone else, even if you adjust for income. And that derives from the fact that we're so specialist-focused and use so much technology that other nations are much more cautious with.

    And then, secondly, our payment system is so administratively complex ... that about 24 percent of every health care dollar goes to administration. In other countries, like Canada, it would be less than half that, and in Taiwan, for example, it's much, much less. ... If we could cut administrative costs in half, we would have more than enough money to cover all the uninsured.



    (BTW, good back and forth, my man)
     
  20. BelichickFan

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    #24 Jersey

    This is where the argument always gets muddied. They say what's in bold. But then they want to spend $1.5T. If there is such massive savings to be made out of waste and admin why do we need to be spending a couple hundred billion a year ?
     

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