For the McDaniels Haters...

[BradyisGod]

From Don Banks Week 11 notes...

? Green Bay (4-5) at New England (6-3) -- People close to the Patriots say New England this season has sorely missed former offensive coordinator Charlie Weis and his knack for both creative play-calling and making mid-game adjustments. You want to dissect some of Tom Brady's struggles? Look no further than not having Weis on the sideline, and the Patriots' rebuilt receiving corps. There's a belief that Bill Belichick continues to have heavy input in terms of play-calling, often steering offensive coordinator Josh McDaniels in the direction he wants to go. The problem? "Belichick's a defensive coach and offensive play-calling just isn't his forte,'' said one league source. "And that shows.''

Discuss...

 

[TomBradyWoot]

Sounds like we need an OC with a pair.

 

[Poll]

That's why someone with a big mouth is needed as an OC.

 

[pats1]

All very true.

But let's also remember the same duo had in effect the same duties last year. And that offense was better (but without a running game).

 

[OsloRhino]

Can I just say that McDaniels reminds me of my high school coach.

Very basic Offense at a premium.

Do you think he could pop over to Notre Dame and borrow Charlie's play book?

 

[pats1]

More proof that a 27 year old McDaniels is out of his league.

Mike Martz would have been, and was, my choice.

I was thinking the same thing this morning.

 

[BelichickFan]

We're 11th in the league in both yards and points this year despite losing both starting WR. We were 17th and 12th, respectively, when we won the Super Bowl in 2003. Last year we were 7th and 10th with the same offensive setup.

No, not the same offense as 2004 but stats say this year and last were better than any of the Weis years except 2004.

 

[vyrago]

We're 11th in the league in both yards and points this year despite losing both starting WR. We were 17th and 12th, respectively, when we won the Super Bowl in 2003. Last year we were 7th and 10th with the same offensive setup.

No, not the same offense as 2004 but stats say this year and last were better than any of the Weis years except 2004.

Don't bother people with the facts, please. Blaming McDaniels works so well for so many fans.

 

[Digger44]

I was thinking the same thing this morning.

Why would we want a guy to come in for a year to teach the offense a brand new system that is so drastically different, and then just up and leave for a head coaching job possibly in the middle of the season? That would do more damage that good. May I cite the Detroit Lions???

McDaniels will grow. NEM, you were a huge Charlie Weiss hater. He leaves and you are his biggest fan? Please get some logic and consistancy.

 

[Digger44]

Don't bother people with the facts, please. Blaming McDaniels works so well for so many fans.

For a guy with 25 posts, you post as if you have been here for a while. Thanks for dealing in reality.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

You know I had noticed a couple of things in the Colts and JETS games that I didn't want to add to the mix and ruin somebody's mantra. During the Colts game at one point JM seemed to be engaged in a pleading his case type of discussion with BB on the sidelines, like maybe he was explaining why something did or didn't or would or wouldn't work. Then this week against the JETS I noticed himself talking more into the headset during offensive series, and he appeared to have a copy of a play sheet, something he previously hasn't seemed to have on him in game.

I have long contended that this offense, like the defense, is fundamentally his - with those who run it just flushing it out and smoothing the rough edges. He approaches game planning from an exploit their weakness POV as opposed to what most OC's would prefer to do which is showcase their own units strengths. Which is also why a Mike Martz or other outsider would not work here - he will not allow them to substantially alter HIS offense, let alone replace it with one he undressed to the point it and it's architect never recovered. You would end up in the kind of situation Billick and Fassel created in Baltimore - untenable.

Belichick's offense works when we have the players (or the players we do have have the will or the instincts or intelligence) to execute his plan. When we don't, whether due to injury or miscalculation, things get problematic.
I believe BB's voice is the loudest one in the room. It may always have been, but Charlie likely had learned over the years how to navigate around that in part because he faced the same situation with Parcells, and he had cache with BB as well as his players.

Josh is being asked to run an established offense with a unit that has not yet established it's identity or mastered all it's nuances primarily because it's WR corps was cobbled together reactively rather than proactively at the 11th hour. Add to that he's dealing with an offensive line that for reasons of it's own remains wildly inconsistent despite being coached by a guy whose been here longer then Belichick. And it would appear just for good measure he's being asked to do that with one hand periodically tied behind his back because players are not available situationally either due to their progress on a learning curve that is strictly monitored, or because their utilization and availability is being managed in a rote rotation of some design, or because they are being reprimanded by the HC on the fly.

Under the circumstances I don't think Charlie would be accomilishing a whole lot more, let alone dealing with the stress. I think he left in part because he knew this time was coming. When the financial component of the system and the expectations of everyone involved including an insatiable fan base would collide in what hopefully will amount to nothing more than an inevitable transition period between runs. He didn't want to survive it - that's a young mans job. He preferred to go out on a high note.

 

[BelichickFan]

MoLewisrocks, what you're saying is what Belichick said when Charlie left. That Charlie was running the offense that Belichick wanted him to run. Belichick's offense, with Charlie running it, Belichick's offense with McDaniels running it. People seem like they don't want to believe it though.

 

[Digger44]

MoLewisrocks, what you're saying is what Belichick said when Charlie left. That Charlie was running the offense that Belichick wanted him to run. Belichick's offense, with Charlie running it, Belichick's offense with McDaniels running it. People seem like they don't want to believe it though.

Well thats what happens when we have posters on this board who actually believe that they can call a better game than the pros who get paid to do it. If that is the case, then why do people sit is places like, let's say.....Arizona, and not have a pro job in the NFL. Fact is that they are Monday morning QB's who just want to scream about inside slants and crossing patterns.

We are all guilty of being a Monday QB to some extent, but the majority of us understand that we are fans and not pros.

 

[OsloRhino]

More proof that a 27 year old McDaniels is out of his league.

Mike Martz would have been, and was, my choice.

Now hotly tipped to be heading to Arizona and replace The Fat Man.

 

[SVN]

From Don Banks Week 11 notes...

? Green Bay (4-5) at New England (6-3) -- People close to the Patriots say New England this season has sorely missed former offensive coordinator Charlie Weis and his knack for both creative play-calling and making mid-game adjustments. You want to dissect some of Tom Brady's struggles? Look no further than not having Weis on the sideline, and the Patriots' rebuilt receiving corps. There's a belief that Bill Belichick continues to have heavy input in terms of play-calling, often steering offensive coordinator Josh McDaniels in the direction he wants to go. The problem? "Belichick's a defensive coach and offensive play-calling just isn't his forte,'' said one league source. "And that shows.''
Discuss...

the "league sources" only come out when something is going bad...not last yr , not after the minn game but now...all may be true or not who knows..i personally dont trust this kind of "source" information which isnt consistent.
also last yr i did see BB with the play calling chart once ina while, not sure he holds it now ..does he ?

 

[Pat_Nasty]

Well thats what happens when we have posters on this board who actually believe that they can call a better game than the pros who get paid to do it. If that is the case, then why do people sit is places like, let's say.....Arizona, and not have a pro job in the NFL. Fact is that they are Monday morning QB's who just want to scream about inside slants and crossing patterns.

We are all guilty of being a Monday QB to some extent, but the majority of us understand that we are fans and not pros.

A good motto people who like to rant angrily about football, politics, or anything else, for that matter, should learn:

"If you think the solution is simple, then you probably don't really understand the problem."

Football is a very complex game. If you think using half a playbook is the answer, you're just not being realistic. If you think the answer is obvious, then there are probably facets to the problem that you're not considering.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Can I just say that McDaniels reminds me of my high school coach.

Very basic Offense at a premium.

Do you think he could pop over to Notre Dame and borrow Charlie's play book?

We still have it. Could use a couple of Charlie's playmakers to help execute it. I'd take Samadzija, and Zibikowski could be a backup SS and PR.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

More proof that a 27 year old McDaniels is out of his league.

Mike Martz would have been, and was, my choice.

I was thinking the same thing this morning.

Now hotly tipped to be heading to Arizona and replace The Fat Man.

WOW, you know what they say about great minds thinking alike...like the Bidwells.

 

[Digger44]

A good motto people who like to rant angrily about football, politics, or anything else, for that matter, should learn:

"If you think the solution is simple, then you probably don't really understand the problem."

Football is a very complex game. If you think using half a playbook is the answer, you're just not being realistic. If you think the answer is obvious, then there are probably facets to the problem that you're not considering.

You fogot 1 thing. If you think you can coach in the nfl because of Madden video games, you are not realistic either.

 

[upstater1]

Nice to see that a league guy takes a shot at Belichick (that's all this is) and Pats fans run with it.