Football Outsiders rankings

[glm]

For Team Efficiency, we're ranked 4th.

Offense Efficiency - 3rd.

Defense - 15th.

Tom Brady - 2nd.

Randy Moss - 5th.

Wes Welker - 16th.

Ben Watson - 8th.

Note: All of our RB are in the 10 - 49 rushes category.

So, in that category:

Fred Taylor - 3rd.

Laurence Maroney - 5th.

Sammy Morris - 14th.

Kevin Faulk - 18th.

RB Receiving:

Sammy Morris - 4th.

Kevin Faulk - 6th.

Defensive Line:

Run - 26th.

Pass - 16th.

Offensive Line:

Run - 7th.

Pass - 5th.

 

[theglorydays]

For Team Efficiency, we're ranked 4th.

Offense Efficiency - 3rd.

Defense - 15th.

Tom Brady - 2nd.

Randy Moss - 5th.

Wes Welker - 16th.

Ben Watson - 8th.

Note: All of our RB are in the 10 - 49 rushes category.

So, in that category:

Fred Taylor - 3rd.

Laurence Maroney - 5th.

Sammy Morris - 14th.

Kevin Faulk - 18th.

RB Receiving:

Sammy Morris - 4th.

Kevin Faulk - 6th.

Defensive Line:

Run - 26th.

Pass - 16th.

Offensive Line:

Run - 7th.

Pass - 5th.

That 59-0 pounding you guys put on Tennessee kinda skews these statistics, wouldn't you agree?

 

[BelichickFan]

That 59-0 pounding you guys put on Tennessee kinda skews these statistics, wouldn't you agree?

We still did it. Or maybe we should only count the stats for the other games we played when every team we played was undefeated at the time.

And don't forget how much worse last week could have been if Brady hadn't been taken out in the third quarter.

 

[theglorydays]

We still did it. Or maybe we should only count the stats for the other games we played when every team we played was undefeated at the time.

And don't forget how much worse last week could have been if Brady hadn't been taken out in the third quarter.

I'm not saying it shouldn't count, but it isn't a true reflection of the Patriots play this year. If i'm not mistaken, the Pats haven't scored more then 27 points in a game this year. Brady has been average all year.

I think you guys have a very good team, one that could easily make a run to the superbowl. But to not take into consideration last weeks games effect on these stats isn't smart.

Brady had 6 td and 2 ints coming into Tennesse. You guys were 3-2. He didn't play well in the Broncos game and that resulted in a loss. He didn't play well in the Jets game and that resulted in a loss.

But, he throws for 6tds against Tennesse and he is the second ranked quarterback?

 

[BradyFTW!]

I'm not saying it shouldn't count, but it isn't a true reflection of the Patriots play this year. If i'm not mistaken, the Pats haven't scored more then 27 points in a game this year. Brady has been average all year.

Umm... I guess you missed last week?

I think you guys have a very good team, one that could easily make a run to the superbowl. But to not take into consideration last weeks games effect on these stats isn't smart.

Any ranking that you take midway through the season (or even after the season, for that matter) is going to be skewed by strength of schedule. The Pats have played one terrible team, one kind sucky team, and 4 good teams. Throwing out every result where you have a good game against a bad team is fine, but you'd have to do the same for every team.

Brady had 6 td and 2 ints coming into Tennesse. You guys were 3-2. He didn't play well in the Broncos game and that resulted in a loss. He didn't play well in the Jets game and that resulted in a loss.

But, he throws for 6tds against Tennesse and he is the second ranked quarterback?

Hard to say where Brady is in terms of coming back from the injury. If he turned the corner last week (week 6 was around when Manning turned the corner last year, remember) then that #2 is looking pretty reasonable. If he hasn't yet, then it isn't. Either way, we'll know more on Sunday.

 

[theglorydays]

Umm... I guess you missed last week?



Any ranking that you take midway through the season (or even after the season, for that matter) is going to be skewed by strength of schedule. The Pats have played one terrible team, one kind sucky team, and 4 good teams. Throwing out every result where you have a good game against a bad team is fine, but you'd have to do the same for every team.



Hard to say where Brady is in terms of coming back from the injury. If he turned the corner last week (week 6 was around when Manning turned the corner last year, remember) then that #2 is looking pretty reasonable. If he hasn't yet, then it isn't. Either way, we'll know more on Sunday.

That 59-0 pounding you guys put on Tennessee kinda skews these statistics, wouldn't you agree?

I think i already acknowledge last week in my original post...

And I'm pretty sure the Titans had 4 healthy defensive backs on the roster.

The #2 ranking for Brady is not reflective of his play this year.

If Brady puts together another good game (which he should, the Bucs are one of the worst defenses in football) then i would agree that he may have turned the corner.

 

[Patjew]

If Brady puts together another good game (which he should, the Bucs are one of the worst defenses in football) then i would agree that he may have turned the corner.

Your agreement will certainly be a relief to us.

 

[jmt57]

I'll agree that it would be nice to see more consistency in the passing game.

But if you're going to throw out a player's best game when you look at statistics, then shouldn't you also throw out his worst game, if you're trying to be objective?

 

[theglorydays]

Your agreement will certainly be a relief to us.

Do you think has currently performed as the second best quarterback in the league? What about your offense, do you think it has been the 3rd best in football?

 

[Patjew]

I'll agree that it would be nice to see more consistency in the passing game.

But if you're going to throw out a player's best game when you look at statistics, then shouldn't you also throw out his worst game, if you're trying to be objective?

Not if you're an opposing fan.

 

[theglorydays]

I'll agree that it would be nice to see more consistency in the passing game.

But if you're going to throw out a player's best game when you look at statistics, then shouldn't you also throw out his worst game, if you're trying to be objective?

I'm not saying throw it out completely, but the number 2 ranking isn't indicative of Brady's play thus far.

I'm pretty sure i read a thread on this forum a couple days back and posters were acknowledging this.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Do you think has currently performed as the second best quarterback in the league? What about your offense, do you think it has been the 3rd best in football?

To date? I dunno, it's tough to say. The offense was good for 3 weeks, awful for 1, alright for 1, and historically good for 1. Frankly, it's too small a sample size to tell, so if anything I'd just say that these statistics only mean so much at this point in the season.

Given that, I absolutely don't see the point in throwing out the Pats' game against the Titans. Are we throwing out every team's best game? Are we throwing out worst games too? Gotta be consistent, otherwise you're just using your own bias to manipulate the statistics to say what you want them to say.

Either way, the Pats' offense goes as Brady goes. If he's turned the corner, then the Pats, Colts, and Saints are in a league of their own offensively. If he hasn't, then they're a tier below. Not a whole lot more to say.

 

[BradyFTW!]

I'm not saying throw it out completely, but the number 2 ranking isn't indicative of Brady's play thus far.

You're throwing that out there like it's a self-evident statement, but it just isn't. 6 teams have played the Titans so far, and only the Pats put up 59 on them. The Pats honestly could have put up 100 if they didn't take it easy throughout the entire second half.

Just as you feel that it's necessary to weigh their rankings down for playing an absolute garbage team in week 6, what about the fact that through week 5 they had one of the hardest schedules in the NFL? Do you advocate adjusting up for that? Because if not, then your entire argument is blatantly inconsistent

I get where you're coming from, and in a general sense I do agree to an extent. On the whole, though, I think that your conclusions have as much to do with your own personal bias as with any desire to correct misleading numbers, since you're being pretty inconsistent in terms of how they should be applied.

 

[theglorydays]

You're throwing that out there like it's a self-evident statement, but it just isn't. 6 teams have played the Titans so far, and only the Pats put up 59 on them. The Pats honestly could have put up 100 if they didn't take it easy throughout the entire second half.

Just as you feel that it's necessary to weigh their rankings down for playing an absolute garbage team in week 6, what about the fact that through week 5 they had one of the hardest schedules in the NFL? Do you advocate adjusting up for that? Because if not, then your entire argument is blatantly inconsistent

I get where you're coming from, and in a general sense I do agree to an extent. On the whole, though, I think that your conclusions have as much to do with your own personal bias as with any desire to correct misleading numbers, since you're being pretty inconsistent in terms of how they should be applied.

I don't think i'm biased at all with what I'm saying. I think it is pretty obvious that the Patriots offense hasn't been the 3rd best in the league to date and Brady hasn't been the 2nd best quarterback to date. If that were the case, you guys would most likely be undefeated.


Also, i'm pretty sure the Titans had 5 healthy defensive backs on the entire roster. Cortland Finnegan, Nick Harper, and Michael Griffin were all hurt last week if i'm not mistaken.

I understand what you are saying though, i guess it will all work out at the end of the year.

 

[DarrylS]

DVOA takes into consideration the opponent, so as much as folks want to think this has to do solely with the Tenn. game.. they are wrong.. Aaron Schatz has been around for a while now, but there is not universal acceptance of his formula... it is kindof complicated for some..

FOOTBALL OUTSIDERS: Innovative Statistics, Intelligent Analysis | Methods To Our Madness

The majority of the ratings featured on FootballOutsiders.com are based on DVOA, or Defense-adjusted Value Over Average. DVOA breaks down every single play of the NFL season to see how much success offensive players achieved in each specific situation compared to the league average in that situation, adjusted for the strength of the opponent.
The NFL determines the best players by adding up all their yards no matter what situations they came in or how many plays it took to get them. Now why would they do that? Football has one objective-to get to the end zone-and two ways to achieve that, by gaining yards and getting first downs. These two goals need to be balanced to determine a player's value or a team's performance.All the yards in the world aren't useful if they all come in eight-yard chunks on third-and-10.

 

[ausbacker]

I'm not saying it shouldn't count, but it isn't a true reflection of the Patriots play this year. If i'm not mistaken, the Pats haven't scored more then 27 points in a game this year. Brady has been average all year.

The sheer fact of the matter is despite Brady and the team, we've been in with a chance to win every single game all year.

That's science.

 

[theglorydays]

DVOA takes into consideration the opponent, so as much as folks want to think this has to do solely with the Tenn. game.. they are wrong.. Aaron Schatz has been around for a while now, but there is not universal acceptance of his formula... it is kindof complicated for some..

FOOTBALL OUTSIDERS: Innovative Statistics, Intelligent Analysis | Methods To Our Madness

Thanks for the post

 

[Pat the Pats Fan]

I don't think i'm biased at all with what I'm saying. I think it is pretty obvious that the Patriots offense hasn't been the 3rd best in the league to date and Brady hasn't been the 2nd best quarterback to date. If that were the case, you guys would most likely be undefeated.


Also, i'm pretty sure the Titans had 5 healthy defensive backs on the entire roster. Cortland Finnegan, Nick Harper, and Michael Griffin were all hurt last week if i'm not mistaken.

I understand what you are saying though, i guess it will all work out at the end of the year.

Thanks for the glimpse at the obvious. There are numerous teams, that save a few plays, lucky breaks, etc would be undefeated, OR defeated.

 

[theglorydays]

Thanks for the glimpse at the obvious. There are numerous teams, that save a few plays, lucky breaks, etc would be undefeated, OR defeated.

Whatever man, I'm done here. No point debating this anymore.

 

[BradyFTW!]

I don't think i'm biased at all with what I'm saying. I think it is pretty obvious that the Patriots offense hasn't been the 3rd best in the league to date and Brady hasn't been the 2nd best quarterback to date. If that were the case, you guys would most likely be undefeated.


Also, i'm pretty sure the Titans had 5 healthy defensive backs on the entire roster. Cortland Finnegan, Nick Harper, and Michael Griffin were all hurt last week if i'm not mistaken.

I understand what you are saying though, i guess it will all work out at the end of the year.

Do you think that Drew Brees' stats from week 1 should be thrown out?