Florio, King, Moss on Cassel's future

[ctpatsfan77]

Florio: Trading Patriots QB Matt Cassel not as easy as it looks

He sees six candidates: KC, MIN, NYJ, DET, TB, and . . . WAS.

He thinks that KC is out: "With both sides of the transaction fearful of the external perception that one of them was snookered (and with each side surely hoping to snooker the other), it'll be virtually impossible to forge an agreement with which everyone feels comfortable."

Needless to say, he sees NYJ as a non-starter, and brings up the Mills incident to pooh-pooh the likelihood of MIN.

WAS is his dark-horse candidate: "Today, most teams regard draft picks with greater value. The Redskins don't; they were ready to give up a first-round pick and possibly a second one last year for Chad Johnson. So if they decide to make a run at Cassel, they'll likely be the ones to land him."

He doesn't have anything negative to say about DET per se, except for perceptions, and he doesn't rule out TB either.

* * * *

King: I can't figure out a landing spot for Matt Cassel, but I'll be surprised if he's a Patriot on July 1.

He sees KC, DET, MIN, TB, and SF.

He then manages to dismiss MIN and SF on money/picks, and DET and TB on fear.

Finally, he manages to dismiss KC, too: "I say no because of Pioli's history. The Patriots took Tom Brady with the 199th pick in 2000. They took Cassel with the 230th pick in 2005. Let's say the Patriots asked Kansas City for its second-round pick in 2009 and 2010. Pioli values picks in the thirties the way most team value picks in the teens. I'd be stunned if he did it. I think he'd trust Haley to pick a Josh Freeman in this draft in the third round, let's say, and work with Freeman, Brodie Croyle and Tyler Thigpen over the next couple of years and say, "Let the best man win.''"

That's funny . . . I seem to remember Pioli saying "There is no other Matt Cassel. . . ."

* * *

Moss (from JSn's link): If the money can be worked out, he wants Cassel to stay a Patriot in 2009.

 

[bakes781]

1st time I heard the Skins mentioned as a possibility. Now THEY would be the one team who might give up two 1st rounders! haha I still think Minnesota is the favorite landing spot.

 

[Patriots2001]

I highly doubt we would ever see a trade with the Jets.JMO

 

[ScottieC]

I can't wait for this to be over.

I just want a few Draft Picks and then move on. If he's in camp with us, this will mushroom into a "Spygate" sized story - Not to mention any time the Offense goes 3 and out - every stupid ass announcer will be talking about the other QB and if they should be in the game.

 

[bakes781]

Friday is the 1st official day he can be traded right?

 

[mayoclinic]

I hate to say, but this is one of the few times I've ever heard Florio make sense. I had thought of Washington, and had even heard them listed as a possible candidate. It all depends on what they think of Jason Campbell.

On the plus side, Dan Snyder wants to win now at all costs. The Skins always seem to throw draft picks around like they are water (a #2 for Jason Taylor being their most recent extravagance), and tends to overspend exorbitantly. #13 plus a 2010 conditional pick would be nice.

On the minus side, I'm not sure they are ready to give up on Campbell, and they have no 2009 #2 so trading #13 would leave them with no 1st day picks.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

I hate to say, but this is one of the few times I've ever heard Florio make sense. I had thought of Washington, and had even heard them listed as a possible candidate. It all depends on what they think of Jason Campbell.

On the plus side, Dan Snyder wants to win now at all costs. The Skins always seem to throw draft picks around like they are water (a #2 for Jason Taylor being their most recent extravagance), and tends to overspend exorbitantly. #13 plus a 2010 conditional pick would be nice.

On the minus side, I'm not sure they are ready to give up on Campbell, and they have no 2009 #2 so trading #13 would leave them with no 1st day picks.

2009 third + 2010 first [+ 2010 third if they do well enough]. Problem solved.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

I hate to say, but this is one of the few times I've ever heard Florio make sense. I had thought of Washington, and had even heard them listed as a possible candidate. It all depends on what they think of Jason Campbell.

On the plus side, Dan Snyder wants to win now at all costs. The Skins always seem to throw draft picks around like they are water (a #2 for Jason Taylor being their most recent extravagance), and tends to overspend exorbitantly. #13 plus a 2010 conditional pick would be nice.

On the minus side, I'm not sure they are ready to give up on Campbell, and they have no 2009 #2 so trading #13 would leave them with no 1st day picks.

Swap 1st round picks...#13 for #23 and Cassel, with a guaranteed 2nd in 2010 that becomes a 1st on performance escalators. It's do-able.

 

[Bertil]

If he's in camp with us, this will mushroom into a "Spygate" sized story.

No story will EVER become a "spygate" sized story.

That was a purely political hit from Day One. Every purveyor of crap had an Axe to grind. The Sports Media establishment wanted it's "Nixon". The NFL brass wanted to appease the PC Gods, having recently punished Vick and a bevy of minority players for numerous transgressions. Goodell especially wanted to enhance his "New Sheriff in Town" persona. The rest of the NFL wanted to take a competitor down a peg (or two, or three or...). Fans of other teams wanted the same thing.

Dare I say, there will NEVER (or NEVER EVER, NEVER EVER EVER in Joey Porter parlance) be a Perfect Storm surrounding a non-story like this. Cassel and Brady in Training Camp is not even close.

 

[Jackson 2]

No story will EVER become a "spygate" sized story.

That was a purely political hit from Day One. Every purveyor of crap had an Axe to grind. The Sports Media establishment wanted it's "Nixon". The NFL brass wanted to appease the PC Gods, having recently punished Vick and a bevy of minority players for numerous transgressions. Goodell especially wanted to enhance his "New Sheriff in Town" persona. The rest of the NFL wanted to take a competitor down a peg (or two, or three or...). Fans of other teams wanted the same thing.

Dare I say, there will NEVER (or NEVER EVER, NEVER EVER EVER in Joey Porter parlance) be a Perfect Storm surrounding a non-story like this. Cassel and Brady in Training Camp is not even close.

Nice analysis. Well-done.

 

[ScottieC]

No story will EVER become a "spygate" sized story.

That was a purely political hit from Day One. Every purveyor of crap had an Axe to grind. The Sports Media establishment wanted it's "Nixon". The NFL brass wanted to appease the PC Gods, having recently punished Vick and a bevy of minority players for numerous transgressions. Goodell especially wanted to enhance his "New Sheriff in Town" persona. The rest of the NFL wanted to take a competitor down a peg (or two, or three or...). Fans of other teams wanted the same thing.

Dare I say, there will NEVER (or NEVER EVER, NEVER EVER EVER in Joey Porter parlance) be a Perfect Storm surrounding a non-story like this. Cassel and Brady in Training Camp is not even close.

Lets hope your right. For our and any fan of any team's sake. No fan should have to endure what we did.

 

[VJCPatriot]

Swap 1st round picks...#13 for #23 and Cassel, with a guaranteed 2nd in 2010 that becomes a 1st on performance escalators. It's do-able.

Matt Cassel is worth a lot more to us than moving up 10 slots. #13 pick come on down to NE. Darkhorse Washington if they want Cassel they'll have to pony up their 1st. The crazy thing is that they might just do it the way they regard picks.

 

[bakes781]

Matt Cassel is worth a lot more to us than moving up 10 slots. #13 pick come on down to NE. Darkhorse Washington if they want Cassel they'll have to pony up their 1st. The crazy thing is that they might just do it the way they regard picks.

THEY might, but realistically as Michael Holley just suggested on WEEI, KC's 2nd(34th overall) and a 2ND in 2010 is more likely. Now perhaps we could make it a conditional 1st in 2010 depending on how well Cassel does, but expecting anything beyond a mid 1st round pick is fantasy land IMO.

 

[VJCPatriot]

THEY might, but realistically as Michael Holley just suggested on WEEI, KC's 2nd(34th overall) and a 2ND in 2010 is more likely. Now perhaps we could make it a conditional 1st in 2010 depending on how well Cassel does, but expecting anything beyond a mid 1st round pick is fantasy land IMO.

Hmm #13 is actually a mid 1st round pick isn't it? It isn't on the nose but it's not far off from #16 overall.

 

[patriots pam]

He thinks that KC is out: "With both sides of the transaction fearful of the external perception that one of them was snookered (and with each side surely hoping to snooker the other), it'll be virtually impossible to forge an agreement with which everyone feels comfortable."

This. I never really thought that KC was a viable option because both the Pats and KC would want to avoid the appearance of "monkey business", to use a technical term. Plus, it seems KC and most of their fans are content with Thigpen, at least for now.

Big NO on the Jets, no explanation required, I'm sure.

DET has too many other issues that need to be addressed, IMO, and I don't think they'll bite for Cassel, but then again, I wouldn't be shocked if they did. And Cassel to Calvin Effin Johnson would probably be pretty sweet to watch.

The Skins I hadn't really considered before, but it definitely sounds plausible.

Personally, I'd like to see Cassel in TB. I live in Florida and wouldn't mind going to a Bucs game and cheering him on. What the heck! I've been trying to convince my Bucs fan friends that it's in the realm of possibility that Cassel will end up there, but they aren't really biting. Guess it's time for me to make bets with them!

 

[bakes781]

Hmm #13 is actually a mid 1st round pick isn't it? It isn't on the nose but it's not far off from #16 overall.

I suppose and like I said Snyder is a fool when it comes to draft value.

 

[Synovia]

Matt Cassel is worth a lot more to us than moving up 10 slots. #13 pick come on down to NE. Darkhorse Washington if they want Cassel they'll have to pony up their 1st. The crazy thing is that they might just do it the way they regard picks.

I just don't understand why they'd want Cassel.

Campbell looks pretty good. Their defense needs help. They need a big receiver. They need line depth. They really don't need a QB

 

[Synovia]

DET has too many other issues that need to be addressed, IMO, and I don't think they'll bite for Cassel, but then again, I wouldn't be shocked if they did. And Cassel to Calvin Effin Johnson would probably be pretty sweet to watch.

While I agree that Det has tons of issues, QB is the most important one. The only reason they wouldn't want Cassel is if they're grabbing Stafford/Sanchez. In my opinnion, they'd be better off swinging the Dal's #1 for Cassel, and dropping #1.1 for a big body, like Munroe (now that Smith appears to have gone nuts)

 

[JoeSixPat]

Matt Cassel is worth a lot more to us than moving up 10 slots. #13 pick come on down to NE.

Not at $15 million he's not, given such a high price for a backup QB and what that means in addressing other needs or extensions.

THEY might, but realistically as Michael Holley just suggested on WEEI, KC's 2nd(34th overall) and a 2ND in 2010 is more likely. Now perhaps we could make it a conditional 1st in 2010 depending on how well Cassel does, but expecting anything beyond a mid 1st round pick is fantasy land IMO.

I agree - I don't buy this "KC won't happen because neither side wants to be seen as snookering another".

I think KC is a real possibility but not the #3 pick (in part because I question whether Belichick values a player that high and at that price, and would likely be unable to trade down).

Everyone seems to forget that this is not a negotiation between the Patriots and another team.

It's a three-way negotiation - and Cassel holds the trump card to block a trade from a bad and desperate team... or a team that won't pay him what he feels he deserves.

As such, the Patriots can't expect a team to give up TOO much in terms of draft picks, knowing that they also have to expend a lot of money on Cassel as well.

Cassel meanwhile knows that his options are limited by the Patriots demands for high picks in return... and that if he stays with the team at $15 million this season, he goes into free agency next season when he can work with ALL teams, none of whom will have to give ANYTHING up in terms of draft picks by waiting one more season AND they likely won't have to worry about fitting him under the cap (which might lead them to make more of his upfront money guranteed to minimize the hit if and when they restore a cap in a new CBA).

Cassel, for his purposes avoids going to a loser of a team, collects $40 million in guaranteed money over the 2009 -2010 season ($15 million this year, $25 million next in a new contract as a signing bonus - as opposed to a new contract this year with say $25 million).

Monetarily there's little downside to sitting on the bench behind Brady - no one's going to question Cassel's skills because Brady returns as the starter rather than he. But since I assume Cassel wants to start, a team like KC, that has lots of room to bring in new, good complimentary players, makes sense... and it can happen if the Pats don't demand too much in return... a win win win for all three parties involved.

 

[JSn]

Cassel meanwhile knows that his options are limited by the Patriots demands for high picks in return... and that if he stays with the team at $15 million this season, he goes into free agency next season when he can work with ALL teams, none of whom will have to give ANYTHING up in terms of draft picks by waiting one more season AND they likely won't have to worry about fitting him under the cap (which might lead them to make more of his upfront money guranteed to minimize the hit if and when they restore a cap in a new CBA).

Isn't there some glitch where if he stays he's an RFA next year instead of a regular FA?