Filling holes in secondary.......

[ilduce06410]

actually, he went thru TC and his first 3 games as CB

Wilson got his first career start in the second game of 2003 as a safety. He has palyed that positionevery game since tehn (over fifty of them) at safety. What is this dilemma you think BB has?
Because Wilson was a CB in college does not mean that it is a dilemma if he plays another position in the pros.
Does Pittsburg have a Randel El dilemma? QB vs WR? Do we have a Neal dilemma? Wrestler vs OG?

take it easy, mon.
heck, i'm not gonna call up weei or write a letter to SP/BB. not even sure how much i like the idea m'self. BUT
wilson is a viabgle option as a first-rate CB and we're desperate to have one. what is the dilemma?
spend big money or a high draft choice to get a so-called shutdown CB, or
spend less money and get a rodney-type for one of the safety spots.
is there one out there? hey, is there a shutdown CB out there?
i don't know if wilson can still even play CB. but IMO they work him out there and presto! They Have a Conundrum. an Impasse. Something to Chew The Fat Over.

 

[maverick4]

Hell, we won a SB with Don friggin Davis back there.

Yeah, but barely.

The moment Wilson or Harrison went down in those superbowls, we became immediately susceptible to the deep throw. Remember how exciting those 4th quarters got?

.

 

[nickw308810]

Probably a bunch of people are going to disagree with me, but I feel we already have our number 1 CB for next year. His name? Randall Gay. He is big enough to stay with bigger WR as he proved when he had to cover TO in the Super Bowl. Sure TO had a lot of yards, but 40-something of those were on a play in which Gay got picked by Freddie Mitchell. If Gay is healthy I see no reason why he can't develop to be our guy. I saw a few times where someone said something about Gay being converted and I was just wondering what they meant because I thought he was a CB at LSU.
And as far as S goes it all depends on Harrison obviously. If he is healthy we are fine. But if he can't play we need a veteran. I think Hawkins did a good enough job. If he is playing for the vet. minimum I would sign him and start him until Harrison is ready to come back. No point in wasting a lot of money on a SS when we already have one of the best in the league. We also have to wait to see what we have in James Sanders. Gus Scott always looks impressive in camp but then gets hurt. He is more of a FS to me anyway, but I am sure he can play both.

 

[flutie2phelan]

To judge from his fingernail bios of almost everyone - when he's not posting for us ... Dryheat44 is a pro players scout somewhere in the league.

Anyway, he and mgteich, above, have emphatically and conclusively voiced why Eugene Wilson's continuing position on the team is not in doubt. That discussion should be closed; there is no more room. He plays safety.

 

[CheerforTom]

Excuse me for being a secondary noob, but what's so wrong with Ty Poole?? I've never heard anybody say he'll even be on the team next year, so there's obviously something I don't know or understand, but if you look back at the last couple years it seems to me the guy was a pick machine! What's the deal, why wouldn't he even be suitable for a #3 or 4??

 

[shirtsleeve]

Hmmmm...lots of good thoughts here. Although evaluating talent is not one of my talents, everything I read says that OG is really thin in this draft. That being said, I say we either resign or go FA for O line help. Maybe take a late rounder as a project. WR is always a possibility, but unless we trade up, the real impact WR's in rd 1 will probably be gone by the time we get to pick, so either we re-sign Givens, look to FA's (again, from what I read, everyone out there who is a break even or trade up in talent to David will cost us more than he will), or we draft later in day one, and if drafted well, should work out.
The same could be said for RB's in FA/or the draft.

Figuring these into the equation, I look to our first and probably second picks in this draft going to either a LB or DB. Again, from what I read, this IS the year of the DB. Lots of really good prospects out there at both the safety and CB positions. So I look for us to take one with our first pick. My personal favorite is Bing (what's his first name again? Chandler? , told ya, this aint my specialty) if he's still around. I see us going after a LB in round 2 and looking at WR with one of our 3's.


'Course, nothin would shock me on draft day. Logan who? The only Logan I heard of before last years draft was the one I've flown out of a few times.

 

[flutie2phelan]

Excuse me for being a secondary noob, but what's so wrong with Ty Poole?? I've never heard anybody say he'll even be on the team next year, so there's obviously something I don't know or understand, but if you look back at the last couple years it seems to me the guy was a pick machine! What's the deal, why wouldn't he even be suitable for a #3 or 4??

Most of us, Tom, think that (1st) Poole is overpriced - certainly costlier than a 3 or 4 should be - and (2nd) over the past couple seasons he has signaled by both word and (in)action ... that he would rather collect his gamecheck from the whirlpool, than risk himself on the field of play.

Not good omens for career longevity here.

We could be wrong, of course.

 

[dryheat44]

[
We could be wrong, of course.

As Charles Barkley would say, "But we doubt it."

 

[mgteich]

Poole has been on IR two years in a row, and doesn't seem to really want to play. If he really wants to play, he could compete for a starting spot. But I think his time is done.

Excuse me for being a secondary noob, but what's so wrong with Ty Poole?? I've never heard anybody say he'll even be on the team next year, so there's obviously something I don't know or understand, but if you look back at the last couple years it seems to me the guy was a pick machine! What's the deal, why wouldn't he even be suitable for a #3 or 4??

 

[hwc]

I don't think we have to question Poole's desire to simply say that he hasn't been on the field for two years. When a guy can't play, we can't afford to pass up the $1.8 million in cap savings and go find somebody who can play.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Until Poole is released he's here, I have no problem with him. Until Starks is released he's here, again I have no problem with that.

To address the original question, taking a CB day one builds depth and competition in an area that has been hard hit the past two years and gives us flexibility as Geno, Gay, and Hawkins have proved at S. I see no need for drafting a S and I certainly don't see it as a value selection day one.

 

[T-ShirtDynasty]

Poole has been on IR two years in a row, and doesn't seem to really want to play.

Evidenced by what was portrayed by Mike Reiss as a very unusual act of clearing out his entire locker and leaving the day after being put on IR this year. Not to mention the whole "I'm not frustrated not being on the field" interview before being put on IR.

Man when he's actually 100% he's just great, problem is he seems to refuse to play at 99%. Many of us wanted him gone last year for the same reasons, I gotta think we get our wish this year.

 

[mgteich]

There is considerable risk that one or both of these players will be injured in minicamp or working out. This would result in a considerable cap hit. The advantage of cutting these players early is not the cap relief. It is avoiding the risk of injury.

Until Poole is released he's here, I have no problem with him. Until Starks is released he's here, again I have no problem with that.

To address the original question, taking a CB day one builds depth and competition in an area that has been hard hit the past two years and gives us flexibility as Geno, Gay, and Hawkins have proved at S. I see no need for drafting a S and I certainly don't see it as a value selection day one.

 

[Brady'sButtBoy]

Why take a CB or S in the first round, or even trade up to get the best? Because we need a true Super STUD in the DB, that's why. It's a longshot that Rodney returns at his super stud level, his effort will be supreme but age and a major injury always take their toll. Even if he were to come back strong, how long could he last at that level? One year? Two?

A Super Stud has a dramatic impact - just picture what the Pat's DB was like with Rodney in his prime. While we have numerous studs and super studs in the front seven - Seymour, Brushci as supers, Vrabel and Colvin/McGinest maybe even the late season Wilfork as studs - we don't have anybody with real IMPACT in the DB with Rodney gone. Hobbs shows promise but he will always be limted by his size from being among the super elite. Samuel, Gay, Wilson (pro bowler? are you serious?) are solid contributors but none are mistaken for super studs like Ed Reed or Champ Bailey.

Since BB, like most good coaches (read: not Tony Dungy with the Dolts), usually make defense the first priority, myguess is that BB looks at the DB and sees a gaping void not to be filled by any one on the team or a mid level FA. We need either a monster bone crushing safety who can run or a big fast CB who is a blanket but can also come up and hammer on the run. Mid-range players back there will always leave us just a bit short while a super stud will make us a true force to be reckoned with again.

 

[hwc]

...myguess is that BB looks at the DB and sees a gaping void not to be filled by any one on the team or a mid level FA.

Hard to say what Belichick thinks. He may think the the Pats have a very solid core of experienced young DBs to build around. He may look at a secondary that was crippled by injuries last year (6 of the opening day roster spots on IR). The irony is that Belichick started last season with incredible depth in the secondary, with seven players who had started a SuperBowl game at CB or S on the roster. That's incredible. Even more incredible was the the depth was so wiped out by injury by the midpoint in the season that he was forced to sign street free agents on Wed. and start them on Sun.

He knows that, at the very least, Samuel, Hobbs, Gay, Wilson, Hawkins, and two Scotts are all capable of playing a role on an NFL roster. Beyond that, it is really hard to guess how Belichick views his secondary because it's never been on the field. My hunch is that his number one priority is at the safety position, where he must assume that he will have to replace Rodney Harrison in the starting lineup.

 

[Brownfan80]

the Word out of the Fin Camp is they have told Schulters that they want to Re-sign him. He will prolly stay with us. I think will Demps would be a good addition though...



Also rumors are going out that the Ravens will Cut/Trade Chris Mcalister.
-Please remember that i said it was a rumor.

Your user picture illustrates the one true benefit I recieve as a Patriots fan living in South Florida. I might not be able to go to the home games, but I get to see that sort of thing for about 9 months of the year. Yeahhhh buddy.

 

[PatsWorldChamps]

I see ZERO problems at CB... We have FOUR CB's that could start in the NFL...
Asante
Gay
Hobbs
Starks (supposedly, he injury was very bad; if true, his ineffectiveness was grossly overblown... if he recovers, he could be a starter)

To those who doubt it, Poole is long gone. Maybe we draft a guy on day two for a #5 CB. Barring injury, it is our deepest position; we have 2 starters on the bench. Of course, i realize that we usually lose 3 CB's to IR in the first 3 weeks, but that isnt normal.

 

[Brady'sButtBoy]

Starks only stays on this team if he agrees to major pay cut. With a cap number of $5.1mil and 'only' a cap hit of $1.5 if he is cut, the Pats could slash Starks and probably sign Azumah or another decent CB for the same or less than the $3.5 mil they would save. Starks was only going to get that big money if he shined, injury or not.

There will be at least two new CBs on this team come next September...

 

[shirtsleeve]

Starks (supposedly, he injury was very bad; if true, his ineffectiveness was grossly overblown... if he recovers, he could be a starter)

THAT line is the single biggest lie I keep hearing on this forum. The guy SUX! Saw him all through camp last year. He got torched more than a box of Bic's at a rock concert. When I saw him in the line up, and not cut, I almost puked. To see him start caused the convulsions we all suffered through last year.

 

[Feep_FLA]

I, for one, will be shocked if Starks is with the Pats next year. We all had high hopes but he pretty much got burned on every ball thrown his way last year. Was it because he was injured? I don't know but why was he playing if the injury was that severe?...... I'm not buying that puppy... CB thru FA or second day of the draft if my guess and Starks and his cap hit are long gone. :rocker: