Felger:This defense cant stop anyone

[Kontradiction]

Felger: This defense can't stop anyone.

PatsFans: This forum can't stop posting Felger articles.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Folks forget that NE had the 28th ranked run defense in 2001 and 11th ranked pass defense. NE is 26th in both categories now tied for best record in the NFL.

This bend dont break defense is making enough plays to win. Mcourtys 1st INT was the turning point in the Detroit game for NE.

What stats are you looking at?

There is no comparison to the 2001 D to this one. Except for the run D, 2001was both statistically and talent-wise better by a wide margin.

 

[Rob0729]

The Pats defense can stop anyone, but not for a complete game - at least not yet. The Pats were up 24-3 against the Steelers going into the fourth. They beat the Lions in the second half 35-7. The Pats held the Colts to 14 points almost midway through the fourth (and held them scoreless in both the first and third quarters). The Pats were beating the Vikings 21-10 in the fourth. The Pats were beating the Chargers 20-3 going into the fourth.

The Pats' defense's problem isn't that they cannot stop anyone. Their problem is that they cannot put together a complete game and they can go from a shutout defense to a siv in a matter of one drive to the next. They need to work on their consistency. Unfortunately, inconsistency is a trait of a young defense.

 

[RobertWeathers]

The Pats defense can stop anyone, but not for a complete game - at least not yet. The Pats were up 24-3 against the Steelers going into the fourth. They beat the Lions in the second half 35-7. The Pats held the Colts to 14 points almost midway through the fourth (and held them scoreless in both the first and third quarters). The Pats were beating the Vikings 21-10 in the fourth. The Pats were beating the Chargers 20-3 going into the fourth.

The Pats' defense's problem isn't that they cannot stop anyone. Their problem is that they cannot put together a complete game and they can go from a shutout defense to a siv in a matter of one drive to the next. They need to work on their consistency. Unfortunately, inconsistency is a trait of a young defense.

No question. When commenting on the youth of this defense, I've heard Bru, Harrison and McGinest say that making adjustments on the fly based on not just filmwork and study, but learnings from years and years of just playing makes a huge difference. Their points were that coaches can't coach everything- some things you just need to see and learn for yourself.

 

[convertedpatsfan]

Felger: This defense can't stop anyone.

PatsFans: This forum can't stop posting Felger articles.

This.

Felger's a troll. Somehow he got a media gig, but he's a troll nonetheless.

 

[Dutchmaster617]

Its not a horrible comment really, a better one would be 'This defense has trouble stopping everybody' because that is what it is, they can stop somebody (if its by taking an INT, or forcing a FG, punt) but they have had trouble in every game, including the blowout in MIA when Davon Bess converted every first for a god while.

 

[goz421]

They do bend a lot and break a little but what they are doing different from the previous couple of years is creating turnovers and getting special team plays.

 

[goz421]

While watching Belickick miked I was suprised to see against the colts that coach lets the players at the line switch things up. he trains his players to be coaches. Interesting philosophy. No wonder they are so unpredictable.

Alos, in those years Bruschi was just as valuable as Brady in the sense he was the reader.

I think it mus be Mayo who is doing it now. On top of the fact he is mailing all those tackles.

I also love how he called Mcourty a Champion. He know he has something special there.

Coach gets smart players.

 

[RobertWeathers]

They do bend a lot and break a little but what they are doing different from the previous couple of years is creating turnovers and getting special team plays.

Statistically, that is not true.

Last year the team had 18 INTs and 19 forced fumbles for an average of forcing 2.31 turnovers a game.

This year they are averaging 1.18 TOs a game 13 INTs and 4 FF.

Difference: they are not turning the ball over and the timing of the TOs has been incredible.

 

[BSR]

I'm baffled at why anyone would argue this point. Of course the overall statement is hyperbolic but the point stands. They are awful on defense, especially in the second half of games which is most troublesome. Thats not so say they don't have talent, as they have plenty, but as someone else said, they are just way too inconsistent.

 

[Richard Camembert]

I'm baffled at why anyone would argue this point. Of course the overall statement is hyperbolic but the point stands. They are awful on defense, especially in the second half of games which is most troublesome. Thats not so say they don't have talent, as they have plenty, but as someone else said, they are just way too inconsistent.

That should do it for this thread.

 

[moosekill]

Statistically, that is not true.

Last year the team had 18 INTs and 19 forced fumbles for an average of forcing 2.31 turnovers a game.

This year they are averaging 1.18 TOs a game 13 INTs and 4 FF.

Difference: they are not turning the ball over and the timing of the TOs has been incredible.

17/11 =1.545 not 1.18

 

[moosekill]

I'm baffled at why anyone would argue this point. Of course the overall statement is hyperbolic but the point stands. They are awful on defense, especially in the second half of games which is most troublesome. Thats not so say they don't have talent, as they have plenty, but as someone else said, they are just way too inconsistent.

I'm sorry but I disagree. The patriots have been able to go into prevent defenses in at least three games, the Bengals, Colts, and Steelers. In all three of those games, which the Pats won, they went up by three scores and stopped doing what they had been doing. As soon as they went to prevent, the other teams put up large numbers, those numbers completely skew the Patriots' defensive numbers. If you take those 3 4th quarters out, there would be a huge difference in the Patriots defensive numbers and ratings.

I realize you can't throw out those numbers, but we end up counting garbage time numbers as the same as numbers that happened when things mattered.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

I don't see how you can argue that this defense as a whole stinks

We have a few stars like Wilfork,Chung,Mayo and McCourty but after those guys you have a bunch of guys that normally would be backups on just about every team in the league and there are rookies who will make mistakes
...Meriweather sucks one game and is good the next so I really can't put a finger on that guy.

If Brady and Co. On the other side were not playing lights out on offense and scoring 30 PPG, this team would have a record closer to the Panthers than the Jets.

Brady needed to have a near career year to keep this team in contention and he has.

Our 9-2 record is a surprise for sure but I think most Pats fans realized this young inexperienced defense would need the offense to carry them most of the season to avoid an ugly year and Brady has more than carried the load in that regards.

 

[RayClay]

You're correct that a turnover is a stop (the best kind of stop) and, ultimately, the only stat that matters is scoring more than the other team. However, you must admit the Patriot defense is allowing a conspicuously large amount of yards, is god awful on 3rd down defense and is allowing red zone TDs at an abysmal rate. Given that, I think it is fair to worry "if the opposing team's D plays us tough all 4 quarters, can our defense keep us in a game like that?". Any Patriot fan has to worry about that question after watching the Patriot D this season.

I'd feel a hell of a lot better about this defense if they could step it up in the red zone. Otherwise we better score 25 points or more a game.

I musn't admit anything. Is there a separate trophy for fewest yards allowed? I believe the first 99 yards don't count, correct me if I'm wrong. We're nine and two.

Sometimes I seriously wonder if present posters even followed the team since 2001. We have been using the same type of defensive philosophy, in general and it has been tremendously successful.

Also, in case there's confusion, our defense is composed mostly of rookies and second year players, and we lost two crucial starters before the season. This isn't the 85 Bears out there. aAttempting to play like the 85 Bears, as some posters seem to want, will result in WRs dancing through our end zone to the tune of double digit touchdowns.

We have three cornerbacks right now and the one we're waiting on is Jonathan Wilhite. Ty law's not coming through that door, Leigh Bodden's not coming through that door, Rodney Harrison's not coming through that door. we've got a rookie, an UDFA special teamer and an underachiever and we just beat Pittsburgh and Peyton Manning back to back, so pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeze stop.

We are playing the type of defense that allows a young injury riddled defense to defeat the best teams in football. what the hell more does anybody want?

 

[BradyManny]

Honestly, what is to argue in Felger's article? It's perfectly accurate. Our defense - by every measure, including opponent-adjusted - is in the bottom third of the league. If you look at Football Outsiders, our D is truly up there with the dregs of the league - we are about as bad as any defense save for Houston and Denver. It is not a good defense, by any stretch. But neither was New Orleans' D last year - but they made plays when it counted.

And so has ours.

Combine that with the best offense in the league - and by a huge margin with opposition is accounted for - and you have a team that can win the SB.

 

[NYCPatsFan]

I'm sorry but I disagree. The patriots have been able to go into prevent defenses in at least three games, the Bengals, Colts, and Steelers. In all three of those games, which the Pats won, they went up by three scores and stopped doing what they had been doing. As soon as they went to prevent, the other teams put up large numbers, those numbers completely skew the Patriots' defensive numbers. If you take those 3 4th quarters out, there would be a huge difference in the Patriots defensive numbers and ratings.

I realize you can't throw out those numbers, but we end up counting garbage time numbers as the same as numbers that happened when things mattered.

There's a seperate thread on prevent defense that was created after the Colts game. Very interesting posts - that specified the exact coverges during the 4Q - based on which some fans attempt to point out that prevent D is a myth. You might want to have a look at those posts too.

 

[Deus Irae]

34
26
28
24

That's the points totals for the opponents in the last 4 games. As unimpressive as those point totals are, they are still better than what the defensive statistics are for the season. The guy says that the team is capable of winning the Super Bowl with this defense.

Felger's a crap stirrer, but I don't see why this particular article should be seen as particularly controversial.

 

[PatsDeb]

We don't stink period, but we do stink at times. We're inconsistent, but BB teams have a way of getting better as the year progresses. We've gotten better at causing turnovers as the year has gone on. Hopefully we can get better at just getting stops.

 

[NYCPatsFan]

Honestly, what is to argue in Felger's article? It's perfectly accurate. Our defense - by every measure, including opponent-adjusted - is in the bottom third of the league. If you look at Football Outsiders, our D is truly up there with the dregs of the league - we are about as bad as any defense save for Houston and Denver. It is not a good defense, by any stretch. But neither was New Orleans' D last year - but they made plays when it counted.

And so has ours.

Combine that with the best offense in the league - and by a huge margin with opposition is accounted for - and you have a team that can win the SB.

No argument except that I would add to the last line: ..., provided the O doesn't play a D that knows them well, and, against a stout D, doesn't allow for crucial lock-killing drives to splutter in the 4Q.