Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by PonyExpress, Sep 9, 2008.
Thanks PE, I was going to post this today as well. I love Factcheck.
There's a big difference, Pony. Those rumors are embraced by a tiny number of Democratic groups. In Democratic Underground, when people posted them, others were quick to chime in with accurate facts and the stories quickly died. The only one that I disagree with, from what I've read, is that Palin's stand on Creationism is that she does favor teaching it, but doesn't oppose teaching evolution as well, which is sort of like favoring teaching astrology, but also astronomy as well.
The difference is that lies and rumors from the right are often broadcast by Fox, Rush, and Drudge, while the rumors on the left rarely even make Huffingtonpost or RawStory. The rumors about Palin fade quickly, while there are still people pushing the idea that Obama is a Muslim or that his birth certificate is forged or that he was closed friends with various terrorists or that Democrats trashed hundreds of American flags.
You were gleefully posting information about Palin's baby, information you knew to be false. Don't ever lecture anyone about ethics of any kind.
Pony, I'm not disputing some of the erroneous info appeared in this forum, but once the facts came out, unlike with the Obama stories, I think the liberals in this forum stopped pushing the misinformation. Meanwhile, with Ayers, Obama's religion, and the birth certificate, I think those stories have been around in this forum for much longer than the Palin baby-is-not-hers rumor.
But, again, the issue here is not what happens in the patsfan political forum, it's how people in positions of power are using false info. Rush and Fox have reported rumor and innuendos as news, and they continue to report it.
Bingo. I actually thought Patters was starting to lose it there for a while. He's seems to have adopted the same campaign strategy most campaigns do. They don't necessarily start the rumors but they pose questions to advance things they know not to be true. That gets legs and it's off to the races. But let me tell you, in the Berkshires, the creationist, book burning and AIP stuff is just about all I here about when Palin comes up. You want to here a good one? last week I heard the AIP stuff from a fellow office worker that didn't even know who Joe Biden was.
Actually, the only rumor that it appears is untrue is that the baby is Palin's, but it's not untrue because there's any evidence, it's untrue because the circumstantial evidence (lack of photos of her being pregnant, her daughter being out of school because of a 5-month case of mono, she told no one about her pregnancy until her seventh month; her water broke in Texas, so she delivered a speech, took a 10 hour flight to Alaska, traveled to a remote hospital where the birth was induced, etc.) appears to be insufficient to make a strong enough case.
The evidence is that Palin inquired about banning books, advocates teaching creationism along with evolution, and there's a video of her speaking to the AIP. What's untrue is that Palin actually banned books (did anyone say that?), that she opposes teaching evolution (did anyone say that?), or that she was a member of the AIP.
But people don't see it that way here(Berkshires) , they see that she indeed called for books to banned, was indeed member of the AIP and that she indeed doesn't want evolution taught in schools. Just the effect that the spin mongers wanted. Did you just miss this part ? She has said that students should be allowed to "debate both sides" of the evolution question, but she also said creationism "doesn't have to be part of the curriculum."
You did the same thing talking about McCain giving up military info in exchange for hospital care. You purposley chose to close the quote at a spot to make it appear that it was a simple trade off. You purposely left out the part where he showed that it was just a ploy to get the care but he then resisted for days while being beaten and tortured before finally succumbing to it. You knew the whole truth of it but chose to mislead by leaving the most important facts out. ..hell yeah, just take care of the arm and I'll tell you anything you want to know.........that's the impression you left and i think you know it. So the "evidence" that's chosen by the campaigns usually leaves out just enough to mislead. You're becoming a very good campaigner.
Sarah is here to stay, and she scares the hell out of the Democrats, including Barack Hussein Obama.
I certainly can't speak for what's going on in the Berkshires, and I don't know where you are hearing this stuff from, but as a liberal I think the accurate reporting of those stories is enough to convince people
"As a candidate for governor, Sarah Palin called for teaching creationism alongside evolution in public schools. But after Alaska voters elected her, Palin, now Republican John McCain's presidential running mate, kept her campaign pledge to not push the idea in the schools."
Also, her husband was a member of the AIP and she spoke before the group.
The book banning rumor is the weakest by far in my opinion since there's only one source (a librarian).
What you're saying is not true. I did leave in the part about McCain facing "the bug," a "psychotic torturer" when he offered to give up military secrets. My impression from reading McCain's account was that at that point he was prepared to do so, and I don't blame him. My issue with McCain is that he lost 4 planes prior to combat, flew about 20 hours of combat, and then became a POW. He offered to give military secrets, and under duress supposedly made some propaganda for the Vietnamese and signed a confession to be released. My point is that McCain was not a war hero. He acted as almost any normal human being would. To me, to be a possible hero, one must make a conscious decision to go above and beyond the call of duty (whatever the job). I don't think McCain did that. McCain was a victim and a survivor, but his war exploits have been exaggerated to a preposterous and embarrassing degree.
Ha ha, Patters continues to focus on Palin. Remember she only has a 15% chance of becomming President in the next 4 years if McCain is elected (saw article about it, that 85% of people who are 72 are still alive in 4 years) and even if she became President here lack of experience and possible dirt in her background is certainly no worse than Obama's.
Focus, Patters, Palin isn't the Presidential candidate. LOL.
And when picking on McCain he goes after his military experience.
The thread is about Palin, in case you didn't notice.
Yeah I'm with Patters on this one. There has been a pretty ridiculous focus on Palin as of late, but Patters is responding to a thread about Palin, and specifically, a thread regarding the truth of rumors the are being pushed by the media. Can't blame Patters for that.
All the threads are about Palin - but don't let me stop you
Some of these fact check really only dispute minor details but the basic allegation is still true. And in most cases the rumor they are disputing is several step beyond the rumors I have seen.
Evolution: I never heard the rumor that "she opposed teaching evolution." The rumor I heard is that "she want schools to teach creationism." And while it is true she doesn't oppose teaching evolution, she does support teaching creationism, she supports teaching both. The rumor I heard and have spread is true.
Banning books: The rumor I heard is she ask the librarian if the librarian would remove books that Sarah wanted removed. The librarian was later fired and then rehired. The rumor I heard never said any books were actually removed. I will leaving it up to each persons own gut check to assess the character of a mayor that asks the librarian about the possibility of banning books.
AIS: Rumor she supported the secessionists organization. The rumor I heard had many parts. The 2008 video and the her attending in 1994, 2000, 2006. And that both she and her husband were registered to that party. One fact was false. Based on the rest of the facts one of which is still in dispute and the rest that have been confirmed. The rumor stands she supported the secessionists organization.
Chris Matthews has been, and was saying just last night, that Palin wants creationism taught in schools instead of Evolution. So it's not just the blogs on the internet, although it is mostly the blogs on internet.
The politically correct Obama groupies were all blindsided by Sarah, they are now terrified that their "Great Messiah" may actually get his a$s kicked and be sent along with "Beautiful Michelle" running back to their Uncle Jeremiah and his congregation of Racists.
If the republicans were smart they would dump Mccain and run Sarah for president, she would landslide them to an easy victory.
Barack Hussein Obama will not be the next president, the silent Americans are waiting to vote, they will be out by the millions.
Mattews also said that she supports 0 abortions under any circumstances(he actually pounded that point) but I have seen quotes from her saying that if the mother's health was at risk she would support that.
Hey, haven't you heard? Sarah Palin is like Al-Queda & the Taliban.
Separate names with a comma.