Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by mgteich, Jan 9, 2009.
How good is he?
im an extreme novice at this, but ill take a shot
apparently guyton sucks on the outside, cant set the edge...
which is really OK, b/c he was never projected to play outsdie, and should remain inside
he is very fast, but the question is if he is an every down player similar to mayo, and i do think so at this point
he may be too small, and too weak at this point, both fixable by next season
i believe though that even next season he cant have a starting ILB role, and will share it primarily w/ whomever is starting next to Mayo at ILB (my thought is that it will be vrabel or bruschi)
question though, when our lb's were at their greatest, we had those who could set the edge and rush (AD replaces McGinest) i think the other OLB will be either vrabel or someone to do some similar things
my main question is, if Mayo takes bruschi's responsibilits of the 03 year, then dont we need to find another ILB in the mold of ted johnson? and guyton is not in that mold, but if we find a rookie in that mold this year, then guyton will be amazing at spelling the two ILB's
When I watched Guyton this year I saw some very good things. He was fast, athletic.
However, he was out of position in coverage often. He also seems to be a little lacking versus the run. I think he is a long, lanky player. I think that if hes going to succeed in the NFL in the 3-4 as a MLB, he is going to have to put on a little bulk.
I sometimes thought he lacked some instincts, and that was hidden by his athleticism. I would love if he could develop into an OLB with that speed off the edge, but the one game he started there I dont think he did very well, and didnt hear his name called often.
I would be shocked if we didnt look to bring in a veteran or draft another ILB this offseason, to at least give him some competition, because he has to improve.
With Mayo at 241 Lbs and Guyton at 232 LBs we are giving up a bunch of weight against gaurds in the running game. Bru at 255 LB is smaller for our system but plays big . So we need some one atleast 30 lbs heavier .
As all rookie LB he will get better in coverage but i like him to be the first guy off the bench or when an extra LB is needed for coverage.I would like a big ILB who play the bru role and take on gaurds on running down leaving mayo to make plays shooting the running lanes or using his closing speed outside runs.
Guyton`s size makes it look like he is struggling in running downs but in fact it more to with 300 LB gaurds dominating him .Unlike OLB the space in the middle is small so its like fighting inside a phone box and he is getting man handled in their and lack of space handy caps him as he cannot use his speed.
Needs to bulk up to play inside...
I am not a big fan of this as then you are sacrificing speed to gain weight and his body might never gain more than few pounds of muscle so why take a player and try to convert him to something he is not. Bru in 07 was around 245 LB when he came back and talks about really struggling as he got too light to play his position and this off season actually cut down working out to maintain his 255 LB weight.
So unless he eats and does not workout he is not gaining alot of weight .He looks long and lanky and might never hit 245lbs with the workout regime.
Out of curiosity--do you think he could be converted into a Rodneyesque-type S/LB hybrid (e.g., taking on RBs rather than Gs)?
The Pats official roster page lists-
mayo at 6'2 - 242
guyton at 6'3 - 242
bruschi at 6'1 - 247
But I agree he did look a little weak a few times, nothing an offseason in the weight-room couldn't change.
I also agree about another young beefy ILB to man the strong side.
Rodney is 225 LB and guton is a little bigger but the problem is he has never played corner or safety for a few yrs to develop coverage skills and reactionary instincts which you need to cover especially with TE running WR routes now. so having never done this in college he will stuggle. But he can be a starter when we go 4-3 ,pass rush 3rd downs and play a deep LB coverage role.
STARTING IS ADDRESSED IN THIS POLL WHEN IN REALITY HE CAN PLAY 40-80% OF SNAPS IN A GAME DUE TO GAME PLAN AND NOT BE THE STARTER.
He done good, this offseason will do him a world of good - especially if he and Mayo hang out together in the gym and film room and bug Coach Patricia and Bru/Vrabes/AD a whole lot for pointers. NE still needs a third young ILB candidate who can compete for playing time.
I agree 100%. I think that ILB should be high on our value board and should be picked on Day One.
I agree with this and with whoever said it needed to be someone who could fill the run stopping Ted Johnson style role. Either that or DB. Needs to be one of the issues addressed on Day one and if not there during free agency.
I like Guyton but he's the same player as Mayo size wise and Mayo is just not going anywhere (nice to have for once)
I would like to see Guyton blitz from the ILB spot when he is in there. With his speed and athletic ability and familiarity with OLB rushing (he has to have at least a little) maybe he can bring down some QB's in 3rd and long situations.
He had an impact doing that this past season already, with improvement on his pass rush technique (ditto Mayo), the Pats could be close to having a 4 LB pass rush jigsaw for opposing offenses again.
Brings back good memories
In person Guyton looks tall with relatively narrow shoulders. Let the weight room bulk him up a little, not too much to cut his outstanding speed. A diamond in the rough, he's only begun to develop. What's exciting about all these kids at LB is that finally we have players with the football IQ to Grok BB's defensive schemes. Hobson, Chad Brown and Monty Beisel never seemed to get it. Let them develop more physically and learn more. Second year learning can be more focused since they now have a clue as to what's going on.
I thought he seemed to struggle in pass coverage..
I am fine with bring in an ILB, even with our first pick, or in the second round. This draftee will compete for reps in 2009 and in the future. HOWEVER, I don't expect 2-gap 3-4 linebackers to be blitzing on passing downs. The role of a 3-4 ILB is to stop the run. I expect to have competent experienced corners and safeties who can cover, and who can pass-blitz and who can run-blitz. It is the defensive backs and the OLB's who I expect to cover and blitz the QB. That being said, an ILB must also be able to cover, especially running backs and tight ends. As was said, this is where Mayo needs improvement.
Thinking about it i think woods is perfect like bru is he is perfect 255 lb weight. He plays against tackles and be effective agaist gaurds. He is decent in coverage and maybe try him inside if we can get some OLB help.
Guyton did an awesome job but I think we still have a need. He got some good experience this year and he'll be a fine addition to our team, but we still need sumbuddy in there. Like was suggested, draft the best one we can, transition him in, then we'll have a very seasoned Guyton plus a transitioned draftee. Easy as pie
true ILB's should focus on run stopping, but its best to have one ILB who is balanced, and one who is heavier, a little slower, and better at run stopping
mayo is the balanced type, we need the big, slower type to fill the ted johnson type....any of u experts see anyone in that mold in the upcoming draft?
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