ESPN: Charlie Weis accepts OC job with Chiefs

[chevss454]

Well this could be really interesting. Charlie handpicked by Pioli to do the job on offense also working with Cassel who was handpicked by Pioli. If the Chiefs o-line gets improved signficantly in the offseason, I'd say Cassel might be in for a breakout year in 2010.

Agree 100%. Cassel will benefit greatly with Weis in charge of the offense. Just think of the storylines in 3 or 4 years when our Pats play the Chiefs for the AFC Championship!

 

[RayClay]

Apparently you didn't watch the game. That's too bad, because it was a pretty exciting game, even though the Patriots lost in the end. You might want to find out if a friend taped the game so you can take a look at it.

Yeah, that's it. I didn't watch the game. What a rebuttal, you got me. I can't believe you caught on to me, all I do is read news stories like this...

a dominating defense that spent much of the night pounding Tom Brady into the turf. They hit him nine times and recorded five sacks, including two by defensive end Justin Tuck.

Then it was up to the defense, which held New England to just 274 total yards, to stop the Patriots one more time.

When the Giants did, red white and blue confetti came shooting from everywhere, putting the final touches on what even Big Blue conceded was an improbable championship run.

Read more: Giants stun Patriots to win Super Bowl

 

[PittPatriot]

Agree 100%. Cassel will benefit greatly with Weis in charge of the offense. Just think of the storylines in 3 or 4 years when our Pats play the Chiefs for the AFC Championship!

Can you imagine a Chiefs vs. Pats playoff game next year? My gosh, I think my head would explode.

 

[PatsFanSince74]

I don't know, but it would have great to find out. When we polled the reasons for our problems three or four weeks ago, more than 60% thought that the problems we were having had more to do with coaching than with anything else!!!!

Wow! If 60% here said so, then it must be the truth!

I'll take minority status on that one.

 

[PatsFanSince74]

Games are always won or lost on the field. It doesn't follow that we should not want to have the best coordinators and coaches in the business.

Obvious to the point of being tautologous. My point was that I've followed the team as closely as most since Charlie and Romeo shipped out and I'm not sure at all that different coordinators would have made a material difference, given how things ended up year by year.

 

[Jimke]

I remember Charlie and Romeo were amoung the worst paid at their positions in the NFL. Maybe its about the $, simple as that and would not surprise me.

The light bulb finally went on in somebody's brain. Romeo Crennel
was the lowest paid defensive coordinator in the NFL when he was
with the Patriots. Charlie Weis wasn't paid much better than Romeo.
Before Charlie signed with Notre Dame, his agent was looking into
coordinators jobs with other NFL teams. He was not going to
return to the Patriots.

Seeley, Capers, and Mangurian left the coaching staff this past
year to seek better paying jobs. If O'Brien and Pees leave, they
will not be replaced by big name coordinators, they will be replaced
by a former coaching assistant for less money.

 

[Boots Electric]

Weis definitely has some tools to work with on offense. Jamaal Charles is fantastic and we have all seen what Matty C. can do. They still need major improvements on that O-line and a slot receiver. Also need someone to help Charles running the ball.

Here's to hoping he can improve that offense in Kansas City.

 

[mgteich]

You are one of those who apparently think that coaching doesn't matter much. It is certainly a strange position. In the past, we used to think that our coaching was a great asset. Is it really true that our influx in talent has been SO GREAT that coaching now matters so much less?

Obvious to the point of being tautologous. My point was that I've followed the team as closely as most since Charlie and Romeo shipped out and I'm not sure at all that different coordinators would have made a material difference, given how things ended up year by year.

 

[TrueBeliever]

So what happened with the Bears? Did they tell him they weren't interested?

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Yeah, that's it. I didn't watch the game. What a rebuttal, you got me. I can't believe you caught on to me, all I do is read news stories like this...





Read more: Giants stun Patriots to win Super Bowl

They say Dante still hasn't gotten over how his OL collapsed. I don't think Charlie could have done anything to alter that. We were lucky to get the go ahead score with 3 minutes left. It took a ST brainfart on the part of the Giants. Unfortunately the uphoria only lasted for about 2 minutes as the defense chose that moment to collapse. Not that we wern't subjected to that even in the SB's we won...

Did you watch SB XXXVI or XXXVIII where we were fairly shut out for the first half on offense. Charlie was the OC is all three SB's we did win...by a FG.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

You are one of those who apparently think that coaching doesn't matter much. It is certainly a strange position. In the past, we used to think that our coaching was a great asset. Is it really true that our influx in talent has been SO GREAT that coaching now matters so much less?

Why do you persist in claiming that those who don't want Bill to hire outside coaches fans may perceive as more talented to coach or replace his system are the ones who don't get what a great asset coaching is? When the fact is those who do want that are simply the ones who don't grasp that we have a system and scheme that has worked so well for a HOF HC for decades now because it is home grown.

Where do you imagine the Giants young DC of 2007 who crucified us came from, a worldwide talent search? He came up through the ranks just like they all do and he wasn't making much more than RAC was when he left here. Which is why they gave him a $2M extension when Snyder came calling immediately after the SB to cover their ass in case they still ended up moving on from Coughlin. Unfortunately for them they didn't and he took a HC job in 2009...which is what guys with ambition do. He isn't making much more than what the Giants were by then paying him to remain a DC.

He was a position coach in Philadelphia for six years after signing on as an assistant after a decade bouncing around the college ranks. He had never been a DC beyond the Frankfurt Galaxy. He worked briefly with Tuna who likely recommended him to Coughlin. Few outside of his coaching circle likely knew who the hell he was while he worked under Jimmy Johnson. Kinda like the guys who work under BB. RAC was once one of those, too.

Outside talent can't coach this system because they don't know it. Charlie and RAC would not come back here as coordinators no matter how much the job paid because it won't make it any easier for them to land another HC job for the same reason it took them so long to in the first place.

BTW the young superstar DC isn't doing all that well in his new HC position probably because he lacks talent. But he will draft first this year to compensate. Will likely be drafting thereabouts for a while yet. Charlie's offensive prowess and RAC's defensive accumen somehow couldn't save their jobs when they left here. Go figure.

 

[emoney_33]

Because of BB's ego, I knew it was a long shot for Weiss to return. I think BB wants to prove he can win a super bowl on his own without his original coordinators.

Yea that has to be it. It's always about BB's ego

 

[Jimke]

Because of BB's ego, I knew it was a long shot for Weiss to return. I think BB wants to prove he can win a super bowl on his own without his original coordinators.

Got news for you. BB also wants to prove he can win without Tom

Brady. Tom will be traded to a West Coast team either this offseason

or next. No way the Patriots will pay Brady like Peyton Manning.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Got news for you. BB also wants to prove he can win without Tom

Brady. Tom will be traded to a West Coast team either this offseason

or next. No way the Patriots will pay Brady like Peyton Manning.

Oh go stuff a sock in it. I got news for you. Your drivel is getting beyond old. Tom has never asked to be paid like Peyton Manning because he wants a better team around him to accomplish his goals. Your not remotely a fan of this team, you're either a die hard malcontent or a troll, Jimke.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Got news for you. BB also wants to prove he can win without Tom

Brady. Tom will be traded to a West Coast team either this offseason

or next. No way the Patriots will pay Brady like Peyton Manning.

He did- See Cassell.

Actually, Brady's total dollars in the first 3 years of his most recent deal was more than Mannings.

BTW- You are completely high.

 

[Deus Irae]

Yeah, that's it. I didn't watch the game. What a rebuttal, you got me. I can't believe you caught on to me, all I do is read news stories like this...





Read more: Giants stun Patriots to win Super Bowl

I was referring to your claim about what the Patriots offense was doing. It's been demonstrated on numerous occasions that the team wasn't able to even get the short game and screen passing going because the line play was so poor.

 

[RayClay]

They say Dante still hasn't gotten over how his OL collapsed. I don't think Charlie could have done anything to alter that. We were lucky to get the go ahead score with 3 minutes left. It took a ST brainfart on the part of the Giants. Unfortunately the uphoria only lasted for about 2 minutes as the defense chose that moment to collapse. Not that we wern't subjected to that even in the SB's we won...

Did you watch SB XXXVI or XXXVIII where we were fairly shut out for the first half on offense. Charlie was the OC is all three SB's we did win...by a FG.

Amazing that with a special teamer and a street free agent as the only receivers, an offensive line with at least two street free agents and a street free agent at running back, Weis and a first year 7th round pick found ways every game.

Yes there are ways to slow down the rush that have little to do with the offensive line holdin while the qb waits for long patterns to open up.

The line can run block, the line can block for screens, there are virtually a limitless number of things outside of deep drops and long pass patterns that don't risk the QB and make long passes, especially with play action, more effective.

 

[mgteich]

I never said that either Charlie or Romeo is qualified to be a head coach.

I also never suggested that the patriots do not go outside to find coaches. That seems to be YOUR position. We went outside to find a top special teams coaches in 2009 and we went outside to get Pees as a linebacker coach.

I also have not questioned the general structure of our coaching or coaching promotions. However, I would note that we carry a couple of coaches fewer than most teams. We have only one coach doing double duty as QB coach and as OC.

To be clear, I'm fine with Pees, although I thought that we might have brought in better. In the end, he has done very well this year with realtively little talent. The limitations in schemes may have indeed have been a funtion of personnel.

My problem is with Bill Obrien. The reality is that Brady ended up training him as he did Josh. We just don't have an OC. We have an inexperienced quarterback coach making believe that he is an NFL OC. He was an assistant in 2007, a WR coach in 2008 and a QB coach in 2009. That is not much of a resume for an OC. And yes, it is similar to Josh's.

It is great that we have fine offensive personnel and fine position coaches and also have dante to help out in running the offense. In the end, Obrien hasn't had to do much. My gut feel says that a more experienced OC would have been better at adjusting at halftime and in adjusting to the other team's adjustments. My gut says that a more experienced OC might have been able to come up with the answer to some of the second half woes we've had this year. Apparently you disagree, but that's fine.

We have Bill Obrien as QB coach and as acting OC. He has been judged to be SO GREAT (and experienced) a coach that he can handle both positions. Forgive me if I think that we might possibly be better off with one more coach to fill one of the positions. I do well understand that bringing in a high profile coach might cause dissention and not allow Brady to run the offense. And in the end, I agree with you that a high-profile coach is not needed.

HOWEVER, Belichick has brought in experienced guys like Pees and Obrien (the ST coach). So why has it been so hard to find someone to help out at QB caoch or with play calling or with the offense in general? Does Dante really not need the help?

Why do you persist in claiming that those who don't want Bill to hire outside coaches fans may perceive as more talented to coach or replace his system are the ones who don't get what a great asset coaching is? When the fact is those who do want that are simply the ones who don't grasp that we have a system and scheme that has worked so well for a HOF HC for decades now because it is home grown.

Where do you imagine the Giants young DC of 2007 who crucified us came from, a worldwide talent search? He came up through the ranks just like they all do and he wasn't making much more than RAC was when he left here. Which is why they gave him a $2M extension when Snyder came calling immediately after the SB to cover their ass in case they still ended up moving on from Coughlin. Unfortunately for them they didn't and he took a HC job in 2009...which is what guys with ambition do. He isn't making much more than what the Giants were by then paying him to remain a DC.

He was a position coach in Philadelphia for six years after signing on as an assistant after a decade bouncing around the college ranks. He had never been a DC beyond the Frankfurt Galaxy. He worked briefly with Tuna who likely recommended him to Coughlin. Few outside of his coaching circle likely knew who the hell he was while he worked under Jimmy Johnson. Kinda like the guys who work under BB. RAC was once one of those, too.

Outside talent can't coach this system because they don't know it. Charlie and RAC would not come back here as coordinators no matter how much the job paid because it won't make it any easier for them to land another HC job for the same reason it took them so long to in the first place.

BTW the young superstar DC isn't doing all that well in his new HC position probably because he lacks talent. But he will draft first this year to compensate. Will likely be drafting thereabouts for a while yet. Charlie's offensive prowess and RAC's defensive accumen somehow couldn't save their jobs when they left here. Go figure.

 

[Jimke]

Oh go stuff a sock in it. I got news for you. Your drivel is getting beyond old. Tom has never asked to be paid like Peyton Manning because he wants a better team around him to accomplish his goals. Your not remotely a fan of this team, you're either a die hard malcontent or a troll, Jimke.

I have 50 years of watching them under my belt.

 

[Deus Irae]

Amazing that with a special teamer and a street free agent as the only receivers, an offensive line with at least two street free agents and a street free agent at running back, Weis and a first year 7th round pick found ways every game.

The Patriots were undefeated with Weis as the O.C.?

Yes there are ways to slow down the rush that have little to do with the offensive line holdin while the qb waits for long patterns to open up.

Obviously this was not the case during the Super Bowl, as anyone who bothered watching the game could see. Once Neal went down, that line played terribly.

The line can run block, the line can block for screens, there are virtually a limitless number of things outside of deep drops and long pass patterns that don't risk the QB and make long passes, especially with play action, more effective.

Again, it's been pointed out more than once that attempts to do this were made. Unoriginal, for example, broke down the screen pass attempts argument and showed it to be a fallacy.