ESPN Article on Spoelstra - Sounds a LOT like Young Belichick

[captain insano]

They still beat the Celtics and played about a month longer than them.

SORRY.

you dont get a championship ring for that or a parade . you get nadda sorry lmao.

 

[ausbacker]

You must have forgotten about how much Phil Jackson badmouthed the Heat last offseason. There's no way that piece of sh!t is getting hired as our head coach. Spoelstra will stay and Jackson will look for the next superstar to join together with a super team that he can coach. This guy has easily had the best job in the NBA. Give me those Bulls and Lakers teams and I could win a championship.

Not that I disagree with you but that's the beauty of Phil Jackson's coaching. He's been able to make great players play well together and win multiple championships. There's a definite skill that can't be denied there Kontra, even if the teams were talent laden.

As for Jackson, bad mouthing or not money talks and he's not exactly a geriatric yet. The Heat probably need a more mature coach that can handle the egos in the side but over all, you'd have to be pretty happy with his performance. He designed some excellent plays for the Heat which the players didn't execute and once LeBron's biggest asset in his athleticism was rendered useless, he didn't know what to do.

Spoelstra and Bosh (he really showed up in the Finals and showed emotion and the want to rise every night) surprised me to be blunt. Wade and LeBron not so much (not that it was unexpected with LeBron). Together these two seem like a petulant little couple that got their just desserts when Dirk handed them an arse whooping in the finals.

Which ever way it rolls Spoelstra is going to have a handy future in the NBA where ever he may end up.

 

[Kontradiction]

you dont get a championship ring for that or a parade . you get nadda sorry lmao.

In the last five years, the Heat and the Celtics have won and have been to the same amount of NBA Finals. I don't care about the history, the Celtics have that area of the argument won. What I care about is where you get the room to talk sh!t (and badly at that). You usually don't talk sh!t about the team that has the best future in the NBA. You especially don't talk sh!t about the same team that handed your team their asses in the semifinals. I respect the Celtics a lot, but I don't respect their sh!t talking fans. Your post is the exact reason why.

If you'd like to reply to this, then I would like you to name to me one team that got to the Finals and won multiple games with a 6'9" C.

 

[Kontradiction]

Not that I disagree with you but that's the beauty of Phil Jackson's coaching. He's been able to make great players play well together and win multiple championships. There's a definite skill that can't be denied there Kontra, even if the teams were talent laden.

The Heat played well together. You don't go to the Finals if you don't play well together. The team mentality of grabbing rebounds just didn't work against the Mavericks. On top of that, the defense failed (you just can't give a team like Dallas that many second chance points). The point is that, under Erik Spoelstra, the team came together and made it deep into the playoffs. Give that team a seven footer in the paint next season and there is no stopping them.

And yes, Jackson did a good job of winning championships with talent laden teams. But there's nothing that can be said of his ability to "make them come together". A great team is going to come together no matter what. He just did the best he could with, arguably, the top two players to ever play the game and the most dominant center that this game has seen. Give me that much to work with and add in some Scottie Pippen and I guarantee you that I could win multiple championships too.

As for Jackson, bad mouthing or not money talks and he's not exactly a geriatric yet. The Heat probably need a more mature coach that can handle the egos in the side but over all, you'd have to be pretty happy with his performance. He designed some excellent plays for the Heat which the players didn't execute and once LeBron's biggest asset in his athleticism was rendered useless, he didn't know what to do.

Read up on Erik Spoelstra and how he developed their AV department (which, in turn, helped the Heat's college scouting) and then take a look at how he came up within the organization and you'll change your mind. Spoelstra is a good coach. A very good one. He's been widely acclaimed for the plays that he draws up. He handled the egos going out of control at the beginning of the season and steadied the ship to guide it to the Finals. He's Riley's boy. He came up under Pat and he studied Pat. It's going to take a lot to boot him from the bench, especially for a doucher that badmouthed the entire Miami organization in the offseason. F*CK Phil Jackson. I hate him and the Lakers organization more than I hate anything else. The day that piece of trash takes the bench for the Heat is the day I stop watching basketball.

Wade and LeBron not so much (not that it was unexpected with LeBron). Together these two seem like a petulant little couple that got their just desserts when Dirk handed them an arse whooping in the finals.

There's no doubt that Wade and LeBron are douchebags. Most professional athletes are (hello Kevin Garnett, hello Paul Pierce). If you read my posts, I admitted as much. But, what you call ****iness and egotistical, South Beach calls "swagger". If you don't believe me, then look at all of the dominant teams that ever came out of Miami. There should be one that pops out of your head immediately: the Hurricanes. During the 80's and early 90's, the Hurricanes embodied the idea of the South Beach swagger. The Dolphins, that sorry franchise, have embodied it all the way up to the mid-90's. And now the Heat are embodying it. See, the thing is that everybody says that Wade and LeBron are douchers. And, up to an extent, I can admit that. But not everyone is like the 2007 Patriots. Not everyone can just sit there in the face of all that hate and preach about just looking forward to the next game and that their opponents are all they care about, etc. That's really a tribute to Belichick. The Heat simply responded to the hate that has been poured at them ever since "The Decision" and, by responding, they were made out to look like even bigger bad guys than they already were.

Which ever way it rolls Spoelstra is going to have a handy future in the NBA where ever he may end up.

That's why I hope he stays with the Heat.

 

[IcyPatriot]

When LeChoke learns how to play without the ball he will win a ring. He either refuses to play without the ball or he's just to damn ignorant to realize he ha to do it. Paul Pierce, Kevin Garnett and Ray Allen all three of them carried their teams to many victories with the ball in their hands. But when they came together they all learned to play without it - it was hardest of all for Paul Pierce.

This isn't rocket science - kids grow up learning this concept. Except LeChoke - because he never had to do it - his coaches let him do as he pleased because it made them look good. We will see next year - his key to success in the 4th quarter is playing without the ball as that is when the opposing team's defense is the toughest. Has he learned - stay tuned.

 

[ausbacker]

When LeChoke learns how to play without the ball he will win a ring. He either refuses to play without the ball or he's just to damn ignorant to realize he ha to do it. Paul Pierce, Kevin Garnett and Ray Allen all three of them carried their teams to many victories with the ball in their hands. But when they came together they all learned to play without it - it was hardest of all for Paul Pierce.

This isn't rocket science - kids grow up learning this concept. Except LeChoke - because he never had to do it - his coaches let him do as he pleased because it made them look good. We will see next year - his key to success in the 4th quarter is playing without the ball as that is when the opposing team's defense is the toughest. Has he learned - stay tuned.

You would have noticed Boston's big three were never given the opportunity to "figure it out" either. They performed from day 1.

 

[Kontradiction]

You would have noticed Boston's big three were never given the opportunity to "figure it out" either. They performed from day 1.

Yeah they were. There were numerous articles that came out after the original Big 3 signing that stressed that it could take time for Piece, Garnett, and Allen to figure it out. They just looked better because they figured it out from Day 1. A very good (albeit young) PG will do that for a big three.

 

[captain insano]

In the last five years, the Heat and the Celtics have won and have been to the same amount of NBA Finals. I don't care about the history, the Celtics have that area of the argument won. What I care about is where you get the room to talk sh!t (and badly at that). You usually don't talk sh!t about the team that has the best future in the NBA. You especially don't talk sh!t about the same team that handed your team their asses in the semifinals. I respect the Celtics a lot, but I don't respect their sh!t talking fans. Your post is the exact reason why.

If you'd like to reply to this, then I would like you to name to me one team that got to the Finals and won multiple games with a 6'9" C.

your the one talking sh!t not me. all i did was make a comment about the heats gay coach. then you get all upset like a child. its ok. your in pain over the loss i know. go take your miami heat bull **** where it belongs a heat message board. this is the celtics area of the pats message board. miami heat miami heat blah blah blah. again your in the celtics area of this message board and you don't think your gonna read anti miami heat comments? you cry baby wha wha wha. MIAMI HEAT ARE THE MOST HATED TEAM IN SPORTS IN CASE YOU DIDNT KNOW.

 

[IcyPatriot]

If you'd like to reply to this, then I would like you to name to me one team that got to the Finals and won multiple games with a 6'9" C.

1978 Washington Bullets with the 6'7" (really 6'6") Wes Unseld.
The Bullets made it to the finals 4 times over his career there as a center.

Dave Cowens 6'9" C for the Celtics won it in 74' and 76'

 

[Patsfanin Philly]

1978 Washington Bullets with the 6'7" (really 6'6") Wes Unseld.
The Bullets made it to the finals 4 times over his career there as a center.

Dave Cowens 6'9" C for the Celtics won it in 74' and 76'

And the Lakers won game 6 and the championship in 1980 with a 6"8 guy filling in at center, someone named Magic Johnson.

 

[ausbacker]

Yeah they were. There were numerous articles that came out after the original Big 3 signing that stressed that it could take time for Piece, Garnett, and Allen to figure it out. They just looked better because they figured it out from Day 1. A very good (albeit young) PG will do that for a big three.

No they weren't. They figured it out from day 1 so your point is moot. They didn't need to rely on people continuously making excuses for them because as a collection of superstars brought together, they were smart enough to "figure it out" together.

 

[IcyPatriot]

And the Lakers won game 6 and the championship in 1980 with a 6"8 guy filling in at center, someone named Magic Johnson.

That was one of the most incredible performances ever ...

Magic at that stage of his career was capable of playing all 5 positions ... unreal.

 

[Patsfanin Philly]

That was one of the most incredible performances ever ...

Magic at that stage of his career was capable of playing all 5 positions ... unreal.

And he was a 20 year old rookie, younger than the 26,28,29 year old guys down in South Beach.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

The Celtics' Big Three made it work, and their team was full of 30+ veterans and it still almost didn't work out - remember how many game 7's they played in those playoffs?

The Heat are a work in progress. All their stars are young and immature. It will take more time for them to gel.

I don't understand all the calls to have Spoelstra fired. People think he had the easiest job in the world and didn't bring anything to the table. Many forget, or never knew, what Spoelstra had done before LeBron + Bosh joined. The Heat were the league's worst record the season before Spoelstra became head coach, and with the same bad roster he took that team to the playoffs two years in a row.

 

[captain insano]

keep in mind there is a nba lock out coming and when the dust settles there will be a hard cap not the current soft one. some teams are going to have to cut large amounts of salary to get under the cap.

 

[ausbacker]

The Celtics' Big Three made it work, and their team was full of 30+ veterans and it still almost didn't work out - remember how many game 7's they played in those playoffs?

The Heat are a work in progress. All their stars are young and immature. It will take more time for them to gel.

I don't understand all the calls to have Spoelstra fired. People think he had the easiest job in the world and didn't bring anything to the table. Many forget, or never knew, what Spoelstra had done before LeBron + Bosh joined. The Heat were the league's worst record the season before Spoelstra became head coach, and with the same bad roster he took that team to the playoffs two years in a row.

That is such BS and the media driven perception crap about the Celtics and the Heat. The Celtics performed from day 1. They won from day 1 and they won on the last day of the season.

2008 Celtics Championship roster vs 2011 Miami Heat Finals roster. The starting 5 age of the Celtics in 2008 was Allen (32), Garnett (31), Pierce (30), Perkins (23) & Rondo (21) - 27.4. The rest of the roster had an average age of 29.7. Miami's starting 5 in the finals were Wade (29), James (26), Bosh (26), Anthony (26) & Chalmers (24) - 26.2. The rest of the roster had an average age of 32.3.

Spoelstra did a good job with the side but seemed like he may be a bit young to control them. You can either blame it on ego or blame it on LeBron being a choker as per usual. Wade vanished towards the end of the finals which leaves Chris Bosh as their MVP given he played very well starting with the Bulls series.

Figure it out is such a cop out. They figured it out in every finals series leading into the finals and when they flopped and were beaten by a better side the chorus of "they have to figure it out" started again.

When you delve a little deeper into the Miami roster structure and salary system they're rather ****ed in my opinion. There's very little flexibility, no good draft picks and no expiring contracts to help bring in what they may need without some ridiculously good fantasy football trading.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

2008 Celtics Championship roster vs 2011 Miami Heat Finals roster. The starting 5 age of the Celtics in 2008 was Allen (32), Garnett (31), Pierce (30), Perkins (23) & Rondo (21) - 27.4. The rest of the roster had an average age of 29.7. Miami's starting 5 in the finals were Wade (29), James (26), Bosh (26), Anthony (26) & Chalmers (24) - 26.2. The rest of the roster had an average age of 32.3.

You actually proved my point, even though your interpretation of the data was way off. The Big Three of the Celtics were all veterans who were ready to win and make it work. The Miami Big Three stars are all still much younger and immature. The Celtics stars had 12 more years of experience than Miami's. Even though the Celtics were more mature among their stars, they still took a long time to figure it out in the playoffs and went to many game 7's to pull it off. If PJ Brown weren't on that team they might not have even won the championship in 2008. Averaging in extremely young Rondo and Perkins may skew the numbers to your argument, the point about the Big Three stars on each team is still there.

I don't understand why you're so entrenched to say the Heat were extremely stacked and a big disappointment in not winning the finals. Even talent-wise they were not heads and shoulders better than the Lakers, Celtics, Bulls, or Spurs. They pretty much finished near where they should have given how young the team is and how it still had glaring areas at center, point guard, and the bench.

 

[ausbacker]

You actually proved my point, even though your interpretation of the data was way off. The Big Three of the Celtics were all veterans who were ready to win and make it work. The Miami Big Three stars are all still much younger and immature. The Celtics stars had 12 more years of experience than Miami's. Even though the Celtics were more mature among their stars, they still took a long time to figure it out in the playoffs and went to many game 7's to pull it off. If PJ Brown weren't on that team they might not have even won the championship in 2008. Averaging in extremely young Rondo and Perkins may skew the numbers to your argument, the point about the Big Three stars on each team is still there.

I don't understand why you're so entrenched to say the Heat were extremely stacked and a big disappointment in not winning the finals. Even talent-wise they were not heads and shoulders better than the Lakers, Celtics, Bulls, or Spurs. They pretty much finished near where they should have given how young the team is and how it still had glaring areas at center, point guard, and the bench.

I didn't prove your point at all. The age of the "stars" is a few years younger for the Heat whereas the key positions for the PG and CE for the Celtics were infinitely younger than the Heat. That's a massive differential just there and makes your argument redundant.

I don't think the Heat losing the finals was a disappointment because I never expected them to make the finals. I thought the Celtics not making the finals was a disappointment, especially the roster blow up after the Perkins trade. Unless this fits into some great scheme Danny has I won't understand what value it's brought to the Celtics unless Green becomes a star. I'm willing to see it out to see what the plan is that said.

I thought the Heat had a good season once they figured it out. I'm not willing to use that as an excuse for them losing to Dallas. They were simply beaten by a better team with a better closer.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

I didn't prove your point at all. The age of the "stars" is a few years younger for the Heat whereas the key positions for the PG and CE for the Celtics were infinitely younger than the Heat. That's a massive differential just there and makes your argument redundant.

I don't think the Heat losing the finals was a disappointment because I never expected them to make the finals. I thought the Celtics not making the finals was a disappointment, especially the roster blow up after the Perkins trade. Unless this fits into some great scheme Danny has I won't understand what value it's brought to the Celtics unless Green becomes a star. I'm willing to see it out to see what the plan is that said.

I thought the Heat had a good season once they figured it out. I'm not willing to use that as an excuse for them losing to Dallas. They were simply beaten by a better team with a better closer.

Seeing this old discussion is interesting given how dominant the Heat are this year.

 

[Pats Fanatic]

Seeing this old discussion is interesting given how dominant the Heat are this year.

They were really dominant today weren't they. When did this become a Heat board, pathetic.