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Elite receiver (with speed) or Elite running back: which would you rather have?

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by Ice_Ice_Brady, Feb 7, 2012.

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  1. Ice_Ice_Brady

    Ice_Ice_Brady Rookie

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    I don't think the answer is obvious. It's a big problem that teams overplay our passing offense in the playoffs because they know the best our running backs can do is an 8 yard run. Anyone would take that risk-reward. Obviously, a fast WR like Vincent Jackson or Randy Moss will stretch the field, helping take some pressure off of Gronknandez. We've now seen the Jets, Giants, and Ravens all successfully limit our game to small area of the field.

    In terms of the playoffs, the most effective offense we had was in 2004. Corey Dillon made that offense so much more dynamic. Since then, we concede a 75-25 pass-run ratio against playoff defenses. That might be why we struggle to crack 20 points when it matters. Even in 2007 with Moss and Stallworth, our deep game didn't do too much damage in the playoffs.

    Obviously, elite running backs are even harder to come by than elite wide receivers. There aren't too many of them, particularly three-down backs.
  2. Palm Beach Pats Fan

    Palm Beach Pats Fan Rookie

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    The elite RB is harder to properly evaluate for most teams, is more injury-prone, and is likely to have a shorter career than the elite WR.

    You also get 10+ yards per play for the WR vs. 5 for the RB.

    Take the WR almost every time.
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2012
  3. PATRIOTSFANINPA

    PATRIOTSFANINPA Rookie

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    A 35 Year Old Quarterback needs a stud behind him to lower the amount of burden on him.

    Ask John Elway of how happy he was to have a beast like Terrell Davis behind him to make defenses respect the run and less pressure on him to carry the team.

    Give me another Corey Dillon type any day of the week over a WR
  4. ensoul

    ensoul Rookie

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    Have to go with the WR. The NFL is more of a passing based league now that there are stricter rule about pass interference.
  5. Snake Eyes

    Snake Eyes Rookie

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    WR, without a doubt! We already have 2 good backs, we just need to use them. Adding a receiver with Mike Wallace speed would have a lot more impact than a RB with Chris Johnson speed, IMO.
  6. Elijah T.

    Elijah T. Rookie

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    Belichick drafted Vereen in the 2nd round, and Ridley in the 3rd.

    I've seen plenty of Vereen in Jeff Tedford's offense at Cal, and he's basically a stronger inside runner then Jahvid Best but can cutback across the hashes for 40-50 yard gains regularly. He can accelerate left to right on a dime; a gifted runner. He's aggressive in pass protection and was a reliable receiver.

    He obviously had two hamstring issues that kept him from the field. BB isn't big on using rookies unless he has to or they give him an absolute reason too.

    Whether BJGE is re-signed or not, a healthy Vereen will win the starting job in camp and through the pre-season.

    He's our guy.

    Now go sign Marcus Colston.
  7. Perfection08

    Perfection08 Rookie

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    My kneejerk reaction is to say I want an elite receiver. But I have concerns. Even if TB has a burner, can he still throw the deep ball? I know part of it is who he has to throw to, but I feel like most of the deep balls he threw this year were underthrown. I'm not sure he has the same arm he did in 07.

    Also, I really like what we're doing with the tight ends. I feel like if healthy, it's very tough to stop this passing offense as currently constructed. Would a star receiver reduce their roles? Also, what elite receiver would you want? Many of them are no different than Moss or Owens. They want the ball and the attention. Tom is at his best when everyone gets targeted.

    That said, assuming Welker gets resigned I would probably go against the majority and wish for an elite back. Imagine what a guy like Ray Rice could do in this offense.
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2012
  8. celticboy04

    celticboy04 Rookie

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    Greetings,
    I have to go with receiver as well. There are already good running backs on this roster who are a lot better than the numbers they put up. Ridley should develop into a very nice running back by next season. I think someone posted on this board that it would be nice see to the running backs used more on screen plays and I agree. Back to receiver, I would like to see a reliable quality receivers opposite Welker with speed and nice size. I would like to see Jabbar back because he was very nice when he was here and has gotten a lot better since he left. I know he is not elite, but would be a very nice upgrade.

    Celticboy04
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2012
  9. ThatllMoveTheChains!!!

    ThatllMoveTheChains!!! Rookie

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    I'm guessing TB can still the long ball, but his precision with it has just gone down since he hasn't been throwing it with regularity. If the Pats picked up a quality deep threat I'm guessing TB would be able to get him the ball.

    On the worrying note, I'd be worried about the offense properly using an elite RB. Seems like they sour on the running game exceptionally fast if there's a fumble or negative run.
  10. ATippett56

    ATippett56 Rookie

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    The New England Patriots don't need an elite receiver with speed, the New England Patriots need an elite receiver who can run the entire route tree and beat man coverage.

    The answer to the question is Brandon Lloyd.
  11. Uncle Rico

    Uncle Rico Rookie

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    #70 Jersey

    A receiver who is a credible threat — i.e. you HAVE to cover him well (shutdown corner or "safety over the top" and all that) when he goes deep — makes everyone better.
  12. PatsFan2

    PatsFan2 Rookie

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    Easy Elite Speed on outside WR...we can already do damage inside the numbers. Outside the numbers is where we are pathetic.:snob:
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2012
  13. Palm Beach Pats Fan

    Palm Beach Pats Fan Rookie

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    There is no problem with Brady throwing the long ball if he has a clean pocket and isn't getting leveled by JPP or some another elite DLineman.
  14. Petersen23

    Petersen23 Rookie

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    Sign COLSTON, he is a beast!!!!:D
  15. ScottishPat

    ScottishPat Rookie

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    Elite WR for me.

    We saw what happened in 07 when Moss was joined and Welker taking the underneath routes. We had 2 great receivers (Moss and Welker) and 2 good receivers (Gaffney and Stallworth), they all played their own role but with Gronk and Hernandez instead of Kyle Brady and Ben Watson and this years RB's too. I recently watched the highlights from 07 and if I had the chance I would take the '07 receivers over this years Packers and Saints.

    Our O would be scary if we get that Elite receiver (and I'm not saying Welker isn't Elite) with Gronk and Hernandez.

    Vereen and Ridley will both compliment each other next season. This could be our "Smash and Dash" version of LenDale White and Chris Johnson in Tennessee.
  16. chicowalker

    chicowalker Rookie

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    Not sure if this is a theoretical question or about the Pats right now, but I'd take the elite RB, as it adds another dynamic to the offense.

    I like BJGE and Ridley (and hopefully Vareen) as a combo, but if there were a guy other teams had to game plan around and respect every time he was on the field, I think it would make the passing game more effective (just as an elite receiver would) and enable us to control the clock more easily through effective running.

    (In the real world, I'd say let's hope Lloyd will come here for a reasonable amount, re-sign Wes, and then let's focus on the defense in the draft but maybe pick up a high-quality C/G for the OL if there's one available)
  17. sambam94

    sambam94 Rookie

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    it's a passing league,,given we have a stud QB, give me the WR. A team with an average QB should take the stud RB.
  18. WhiZa

    WhiZa Rookie

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    I'm going to say Elite RB. I think the time is coming when we just can't assume the Brady is going to be able to cover the weaknesses of the rest of the team over a 19 game season all by himself. He needs support from other areas just like he had 5-10 years ago.
  19. Elijah T.

    Elijah T. Rookie

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    Absolutely.

    He runs the entire 9 routes (route tree), works hard and keeps his mouth shut. No character issues or prima donna attitude; classic Patriot.

    Colston has better speed than anyone on our roster at WR and is 6'4 225, gets open consistently and doesn't drop passes. He's only 28 years old; a young veteran in his prime.

    What's not to like about Colston?
  20. borg

    borg Rookie

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    BOTH

    As GM of YOUR NE PATRIOTS

    Trade a #2 to Carolina for Jonathan Stewart.....Big 3 down back with hands...a Corey Dillon like bruiser with 3rd down skills

    Sign Lloyd at WR

    Lets have it all
  21. Peachhead

    Peachhead PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    Elite RB. It may finally force BB and McDaniels to get serious about the run. I'm probably gonna take some heat for this but: Since (including) Randy Moss' last year here Brady has been below average on long passes. It may not help as much as we like to get an elite, speed-merchant WR if half the time the WR goes long Brady under/over throws him by a yard or two, and passes start getting picked off much more often.

    Even average WRs can get wide open deep if the opposing D is forced to stack the box to prevent a potent running attack. Play action works like a charm then too.
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2012
  22. parthasas

    parthasas Patriots Nation PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Elite WR. I have absolutely NO CONFIDENCE that this team will stick to its running game when ***** hits the fan :mad:

    McD, BoB, : potato - potaato :rolleyes:
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2012
  23. VrabelJr

    VrabelJr Rookie

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    Elite WR. This team doesn't run the ball anymore. It's unfortunate because we have 3-5 Pro Bowlers on our Offensive Line.
  24. PATRIOTSFANINPA

    PATRIOTSFANINPA Rookie

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    And they are pretty good against the run

    If a borderline JAG like BJGE can run for about 1,700 yards behind that line the past 2 years,Imagine a guy like an Adrian Peterson of what he could do back there.

    I love Brady and he will always be great in my book,but at 35 its time for him to share the workload and getting a top flight receiver over a top flight back is not the way to have Brady finish out his career.

    ....as I mentioned before,Elway finished his career with a Superstar RB and a pretty good D that was only noticed when they knocked off heavily favored GB in the Super Bowl,Had Elway had all that burden like Brady does now there is no way he wins back to back SBs to end his career.

    I think people are crazy to not want a HOF caliber type back on this team like Dillon was - Our RBBC has been O.K. but I think its time to change that format but as we know Belichick can be the most stubborn coach in the league and likes it as it is ....it was O.K. when Brady was younger,times are changing.

    I really hope Belichick thinks long and hard about changing the offense to a much more 50/50 type team - and if your RBBC can't give you 50% great production,then you need a superstar RB who touches it 25 times a game.
  25. Deus Irae

    Deus Irae PatsFans.com Retired Jersey Club PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Disable Jersey

    For this team?


    WR, no question
  26. THELAWFIRM226

    THELAWFIRM226 Rookie

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    Maybe because we never have an ELITE RB.

    With that said, I think it's an obvious answer, ELITE RB is the better option. With Tom Brady slingin it around back there, we don't even need an elite receiver, we just need someone who can take the top off. You don't need to be elite to do that. Give us an Elite running back so that teams actually honor our run game and I'll be damned if someone can beat us.
  27. PATRIOTSFANINPA

    PATRIOTSFANINPA Rookie

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    Better yet question is which one of these 3 would you rather have in 2012

    Matt Forte
    Ray Rice
    Brandon Lloyd

    Rice is all but locked up but you never know
  28. Dutchmaster617

    Dutchmaster617 Rookie

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    You also get 0 rings without the ability to run the ball and help your defense. Take the RB anytime, Brady has done some amazing things now its time to give him a break.
  29. ATippett56

    ATippett56 Rookie

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    Matt Forte - franchise tag
    Ray Rice - franchise tag
    Brandon Lloyd - no franchise tag
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2012
  30. ATippett56

    ATippett56 Rookie

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    The New England Patriots drafted a running back in the second round of the 2011 NFL Draft and a running back in the third round of the 2011 NFL Draft.
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