Early 2008 Watch List - LB and CB

[cstjohn17]

Mark my words... this will be the year the Patriots draft a round 1 CB and a Day 1 LB.... ok, I have been saying the same thing to no avail for the past 5 years... but with 5 first day picks I expect these positions to be examined closely.

These are the players I will be watching throughout the year. Attached as an Excel file and .pdf for better viewing.
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Day One Prospects (listed by positional group in order of impact, higher impact players are at the top)

Position
ILB (6) - Currently play ILB would play ILB in the NFL.
OLB (11) - Potential to switch to ILB or OLB in the NFL
DE (9) - May have ability to convert to OLB
CB (18) - cornerback

Players must meet or have potential to grow into the minimum Height\Weight ratios for the patriots system
*Indicates Junior


Position Projected Round LastName FirstName School Height Weight 40 Time
ILB 1 Laurinaitis* James Ohio State 6-3 247 4.59
ILB 1 Wheeler Philip Georgia Tech 6-2 235 4.62
ILB 1-2 Maualuga* Rey Southern Cal 6-3 250 4.72
ILB 1-2 Brinkley Jasper South Carolina 6-2 258 4.72
ILB 2 Bell Beau UNLV 6-2 248 4.63
ILB 3 Goff Jonathan Vanderbilt 6-2 238 4.72
OLB 1 Groves Quentin Auburn 6-3 250 4.46
OLB 1 Cushing* Brian Southern Cal 6-4 245 4.65
OLB 1 Rivers Keith Southern Cal 6-3 235 4.58
OLB 1 Henderson* Erin Maryland 6-3 242 4.67
OLB 1 Connor Dan Penn State 6-3 232 4.67
OLB 1-2 Lee* Sean Penn State 6-2 232 4.67
OLB 1-2 Butler Ezra Nevada 6-2 248 4.54
OLB 2-3 Crable Shawn Michigan 6-5 245 4.65
OLB 2-3 Avril Cliff Purdue 6-3 250 4.78
OLB 3 Davis Bruce UCLA 6-3 235 4.69
OLB 3-4 Gooden Tavares Miami 6-2 235 4.47
DE 1 Harvey* Derrick Florida 6-5 252 4.73
DE 1 Blake Tommy TCU 6-3 258 4.73
DE 1 Gholston* Vernon Ohio State 6-4 258 4.67
DE 1-2 Jackson Lawrence Southern Cal 6-5 268 4.89
DE 2 Ellis Chris Virginia Tech 6-5 256 4.74
DE 2 Robertson Darrell Georgia Tech 6-5 245 4.78
DE 2-3 Ortiz Chase TCU 6-2 256 4.84
DE 3 Harrington Chris Texas A&M 6-5 268 4.79
DE 3 Iwebema Kenny Iowa 6-4 265 4.89
CB 1 King* Justin Penn State 6-0 186 4.38
CB 1 Thomas Terrell Southern Cal 6-1 198 4.46
CB 1 Tribble DeJuan Boston College 5-09 190 4.49
CB 1 Hefney Jonathan Tennessee 5-09 185 4.47
CB 1 Talib* Aqib Kansas 6-2 190 4.57
CB 1 Flowers* Brandon Virginia Tech 5-10 190 4.47
CB 1 Jenkins* Malcolm Ohio State 6-1 202 4.45
CB 1-2 Cason Antoine Arizona 6-0 190 4.54
CB 1-2 Rodgers-Cromartie Dominique Tennessee State 6-2 182 4.44
CB 1-2 Phillips* Randy Miami 6-0 192 4.55
CB 1-2 Ikegwuonu* Jack Wisconsin 6-1 202 4.54
CB 2 Porter Tracy Indiana 5-11 185 4.38
CB 2 Lowery Dwight San Jose 6-1 185 4.55
CB 2 Zenon Jonathan LSU 6-0 180 4.58
CB 2-3 Williams Trae South Florida 5-10 185 4.40
CB 2-3 Jackson Chevis LSU 6-0 192 4.58
CB 3 Sharpe Glenn Miami 6-0 186 4.42
CB 3-4 Walker Marcus Oklahoma 5-11 198 4.45

 

[DarrylS]

If Maroney wears down this year will you still hold to your beliefs??

 

[cstjohn17]

Sure, there are 5 Day 1 picks, make one a RB if you like. Even if Maroney does well they still may look to add a 3rd down back or a power back. In my quick scan the RB class in 08 doesn't look very strong, McFadden will enter but the Pats have no shot at him.

LB, CB, RB, OT, WR or something like that.

 

[dryheat44]

Sure, there are 5 Day 1 picks, make one a RB if you like. Even if Maroney does well they still may look to add a 3rd down back or a power back. In my quick scan the RB class in 08 doesn't look very strong, McFadden will enter but the Pats have no shot at him.

LB, CB, RB, OT, WR or something like that.

I think the RB class in 2008 will be the strongest in a long, long time. The early report is that Slaton is staying at Morgantown, but that leaves McFadden, Stewart, Rice, J Davis, I Johnson, J Charles, Ore, K Smith, Felix Charles, T Sutton, A Brown, Lucky, Lester, Ringer, Sheets, etc.

James Davis Jonathan Stewart and Kevin Smith are my favorites as of now. McFadden is a sick talent, but something about his running style tells me he's an injury waiting to happen. I wouldn't be surprised if his teammate Jones has the better NFL career.

 

[cstjohn17]

I think the RB class in 2008 will be the strongest in a long, long time. The early report is that Slaton is staying at Morgantown, but that leaves McFadden, Stewart, Rice, J Davis, I Johnson, J Charles, Ore, K Smith, Felix Charles, T Sutton, A Brown, Lucky, Lester, Ringer, Sheets, etc.

James Davis Jonathan Stewart and Kevin Smith are my favorites as of now. McFadden is a sick talent, but something about his running style tells me he's an injury waiting to happen. I wouldn't be surprised if his teammate Jones has the better NFL career.

It all depends on the juniors, the senior class is very weak, only one projected first rounder (Mike Hart, Michigan) and he is a borderline #1.

The 09 class is stacked, if some of them leave early it would really bolster the field. I haven't seen a lot of these backs but all are listed as first rounders in 09: (or borderline 1st rounders according to NFL Draft Scout)
1 McFadden, Darren Arkansas 1 6-2 210 4.43 - kid is sick, better than Adrian Peterson, may be a little tall
2 Slaton, Steve West Virginia 1 5-10 195 4.42 - a little small, but a playmaker
3 Stewart, Jonathan Oregon 1 5-11 235 4.56 - really interested in seeing him play, great size
4 Rice, Ray Rutgers 1 5-09 195 4.47 - see Slaton above
5 Jones, Felix Arkansas 1-2 6-0 200 4.48 - based on your comments, I will try to watch more of him
6 Ore, Branden Virginia Tech 1-2 5-11 204 4.47 - looked good in the games I saw
7 White, Pat West Virginia 1-2 6-2 188 4.52
8 Charles, Jamaal Texas 1-2 6-1 200 4.41

 

[dryheat44]

It all depends on the juniors, the senior class is very weak, only one projected first rounder (Mike Hart, Michigan) and he is a borderline #1.

The 09 class is stacked, if some of them leave early it would really bolster the field. I haven't seen a lot of these backs but all are listed as first rounders in 09: (or borderline 1st rounders according to NFL Draft Scout)
1 McFadden, Darren Arkansas 1 6-2 210 4.43 - kid is sick, better than Adrian Peterson, may be a little tall
2 Slaton, Steve West Virginia 1 5-10 195 4.42 - a little small, but a playmaker
3 Stewart, Jonathan Oregon 1 5-11 235 4.56 - really interested in seeing him play, great size
4 Rice, Ray Rutgers 1 5-09 195 4.47 - see Slaton above
5 Jones, Felix Arkansas 1-2 6-0 200 4.48 - based on your comments, I will try to watch more of him
6 Ore, Branden Virginia Tech 1-2 5-11 204 4.47 - looked good in the games I saw
7 White, Pat West Virginia 1-2 6-2 188 4.52
8 Charles, Jamaal Texas 1-2 6-1 200 4.41

I'm going to do a write up a little later today. Maybe we should have a group of fans track one position throughout the year and see how it develops, giving monthly reports, or whatever. Keep an eye on Jamal Charles. He'll probably be the fastest guy in the combine next year. He also runs sprints for the Longhorns track team.

 

[cstjohn17]

I'm going to do a write up a little later today. Maybe we should have a group of fans track one position throughout the year and see how it develops, giving monthly reports, or whatever. Keep an eye on Jamal Charles. He'll probably be the fastest guy in the combine next year. He also runs sprints for the Longhorns track team.

Sounds interesting, I could take on any of the positions with LB being my favorite. I don't have time to watch a lot of games but read the scouting reports like crazy.

Speaking of fast, this caught my eye. I think this guy is too small to ever play in the NFL but is fast, fast, fast....

Name: Brian Witherspoon
College: Stillman Number: 8
Height: 5-10 Weight: 168
Position: CB Pos2: KR
Class/Draft Year: Sr/2008
40 Time: 4.23 40 Low: 4.19 40 High: 4.32

2006 Track & Field 100 and 200 meter dash champion (Fastest Man in the SIAC), Finished 4th in the NCAA D-II Outdoor Track & Field Championships, 2006 D-II Track All-American.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

I think the RB class in 2008 will be the strongest in a long, long time.

Uncle Heatster:

Since you seem to follow a lot more NCAA football than the rest of us--do any LBs (e.g., Animal, Jr.) strike you as the kind of player that the Patriots might be willing to jump up a few spots in the draft to grab?

 

[dryheat44]

Uncle Heatster:

Since you seem to follow a lot more NCAA football than the rest of us--do any LBs (e.g., Animal, Jr.) strike you as the kind of player that the Patriots might be willing to jump up a few spots in the draft to grab?

Most people who contribute to this board are more qualified to answer than me. Most of my knowledge comes from the effort I put into draft prep. With an infant around, I had to sacrifice my Saturday afternoons to keep my Sundays free. I saw maybe 15 games during the regular season, the major Conference Championships, and maybe eight more bowl games.

So with that frame of reference, my answer to your question is 'no'. Laurinaitis is the best I saw, but I'm not sure he's worth trading up for.

 

[cstjohn17]

This LB thing is driving me crazy. By not drafting any LBs we have put the heart of the defense in a tough spot next year. Keeping Rogers would have helped the cause, I don't think he was ever going to be a starter but could provide TBC quality backup (which wasn't that bad).

2008 LB Picture
ROLB - Colvin, Woods - no real problems here
RILB - Alexander, Herron
LILB - Thomas, Lua, Mays
LOLB - Vrabel, ????

Assessment
Colvin - Very solid player in the peak of his career, no issues with him at all.
Woods - Appears to be an improving adequate backup, time will tell.
Thomas - Good player, not sure I want him at ILB but so far I like what I see.
Alexander - Improving player, not sure I want him as the number 1 starter
Vrabel - Trending down, it will be interesting to see if he bounces back with more time at OLB.

Mays, Herron - Fringe roster players, JAGs who can contribute on special teams, take the spot of Izzo.
Lua - Has shown some potential, it would be a disaster to pencil him in as the starter next year.

Wildcards - Bruschi - I think he returns for P/T duty.

Forecast - very hazy
Day 1 - ILB\OLB is drafted, doesn't start but provides some versatility and backup ability
Aging veteran - Who knows maybe Big Willie is brought back from the dead


Potential FAs - A ragtail bunch to be sure, outside of Haggins, Hobson and Dansby none of them offer starting ability.
Name Team Pos DOB Age Height Weight Comments Link
Victor Hobson Jets ILB 2/3/1980 27.6 6'0 252 Knows system http://www.rotoworld.com/Content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?id=910&sport=NFL
Clark Haggins Steelers OLB 1/10/1977 30.6 6'4 243 Pure OLB http://www.rotoworld.com/Content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?id=689&sport=NFL
Chaun Thompson Browns ILB 5/22/1980 27.3 6'2 249 Hardly starting quality http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?sport=NFL&id=2591
Boss Bailey Lions ILB 10/14/1979 27.9 6'3 235 Small, no 3-4 http://www.rotoworld.com/Content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?id=1884&sport=NFL
Dontarrious Thomas Vikings ILB 9/2/1980 27.0 6'2 241 Small, no 3-4 http://www.rotoworld.com/Content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?id=2791&sport=NFL
Karlos Dansby Cardinals ILB/OLB 11/3/1981 25.8 6'4 240 May be expensive http://www.rotoworld.com/Content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?id=2663&sport=NFL
Darryl Blackstock Cardinals ILB 5/30/1983 24.3 6'3 240 RFA in 08 http://www.rotoworld.com/Content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?id=3302&sport=NFL
Calvin Pace Cardinals OLB/ILB 10/28/1980 26.9 6'4 270 Seems like more of an OLB http://www.rotoworld.com/Content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?id=2054&sport=NFL
Niko Koutouvides Seahawks ILB 3/25/1981 26.4 6'2 244 special teams http://www.rotoworld.com/Content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?id=1731&sport=NFL
Brandon Chillar Rams ILB 10/21/1982 24.9 6'3 242 Hardly starting quality http://www.rotoworld.com/Content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?id=1630&sport=NFL

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Velly interesting:

I rewatched what I had of the Tulsa/Louisiana-Monroe game. Tulsa is playing a 3-man front, they then get college crazy on us with a 5 man LB corps and 3 DB secondary.

For LB:
SLB Alain Karatepeyan http://tulsahurricane.cstv.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/karatepeyan_alain00.html looked like a late round/UDFA candidate who may go higher since Tulsa has a well televised schedule this year. On passing downs he often put his knuckle in the dirt, he dropped into zones and didn't look bad, he filled holes with a need to work on strength and technique, but showed some promise, and he shot gaps like a laser.

Tulsa also has a MLB on the Butkus watch list, but they have the kid playing flat-footed waiting to react, there is no gap control except at NT. It was really hard to project that kid into the NFL, though he did have the size.

The two outside LBs are really SS candidates, but anyone who wants to track that should keep an eye on them: Craver #6 and Germany #9. Both took on blockers well for being SS size and were decent in coverage.
Tulsa Roster: http://tulsahurricane.cstv.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/tuls-m-footbl-mtt.html

For NT, #99 Nemon looked quite good plugging inside, I didn't see him running sideline-to-sideline like Vince, but he might later on. He's a junior.

At Louisiana-Monroe: CB Darius Battles should be watched, #19; he may be a better FS, but one game isn't a good comparison - he caught my eye because he laid the wood to some people in the run game and on Special Teams.
http://ulmathletics.cstv.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/battles_darrius01.html

ULM Roster: http://ulmathletics.cstv.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/ulm-m-footbl-mtt.html

For anyone who wants to track RB, ULM's Calvin Dawson #22 looked sharp, very good speed and quickness and vision. They did try to use him as a receiver, but he needs work there. Rang at NFLDraftScout has him as a sleeper.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Here's another LB prospect to consider: Titus Brown, he's playing DE in Mississippi State's 3-man front, but he started 5 games at MLB as a Freshman.
http://www.mstateathletics.com/View...7&DB_OEM_ID=16800&ATCLID=944633&Q_SEASON=2007

 

[ctpatsfan77]

The two outside LBs are really SS candidates, but anyone who wants to track that should keep an eye on them: Craver #6 and Germany #9. Both took on blockers well for being SS size and were decent in coverage.
Tulsa Roster: http://tulsahurricane.cstv.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/tuls-m-footbl-mtt.html

Funny . . . Craver and Germany are listed as DBs on the Tulsa roster.

BTW . . . there would be a lot of jokes bandied about if the Pats had both Germany and a certain other DB who was here earlier this year. :singing:

 

[Ochmed Jones]

I watched the LSU and Miss State game and Titus Brown was having a good game against the less than impressive LSU OL.
He looks to have decent size and strength, but I wonder about the speed, intelligence, instincts and coverage ability.

On the other sideline, Dorsey didn't impress me that much at all. Really hard to imagine him playing in our system. I'm not saying he is a bad player, but probably not 3-4 DE.

Both the CB's for LSU looked pretty good. They appear to have the necessary speed and closing burst. Due to limited chances, I'm not sure how willing they are in run support. I'm hoping we see more from them against V tech this weekend, but Glennon didn't look that good against East Carolina until #90, the East Carolina DT, left the game.

The East Carolina LB Cotton was a beast against the run and in coverage. If he wouldn't have cramped up he might have cracked 20 tackles for the game. He really impressed me with his Physical play and nastiness.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Funny . . . Craver and Germany are listed as DBs on the Tulsa roster.

BTW . . . there would be a lot of jokes bandied about if the Pats had both Germany and a certain other DB who was here earlier this year. :singing:

Yep, they ran with WRs too, but the guys listed as CBs were playing deep while these guys were right on the line peeking into the backfield and being very aggressive against the run, including taking on blockers and fighting through for the tackle. They often beat the LBs to the play.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

I watched the LSU and Miss State game and Titus Brown was having a good game against the less than impressive LSU OL.
He looks to have decent size and strength, but I wonder about the speed, intelligence, instincts and coverage ability.

I recorded the ESPN replay and fast forwarded through the 90 minutes of commercials and 30 minutes of game clips, so I was severely limited. I thought MSU's O-line looked decent to begin with, but they seemed to wear down. I never did get comfortable with what I was getting of the LSU CBs, just poor camera work in the limited looks. Brown was the only Senior who caught my eye, and I thought he looked too light to be NFL DE size, just someone to keep an eye on as the season progresses.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

Brown looks to be a good 6'3" or so, but you are right, he is probably in the 245-250 range. Not much of a run stopping threat on as a 4-3 DE, but if he has 4.6 or better speed and some instincts, he could project to a 3-4 OLB or 4-3 SLB.

But I wouldn't use a day 1 draft pick testing that projection.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

But I wouldn't use a day 1 draft pick testing that projection.

Seems reasonable.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

From last weekend: Kansas State @ Auburn ESPN limited Replay

K-State killed themselves with 16 penalties. A young team worth watching if the coaches can instill some order. Keep an eye on this team, their TE Coach is former Pats' Scout Frank Leonard. The team is using a 3-4 that looked fairly close to the way the Pats play it too.

For John's Watch list:
- #2 FS Marcus Watts looked good in coverage and on STs through the limited window of an ESPN replay, the idiot announcers gushing over him should be a negative, clowns with a classic case of credit-the-superstar-standing-by-the-pile syndrome, but Watts looked good to me too.
- #27 WR Jordy Nelson 6-2 213 led the team with 9 receptions for 90 yds and threw the team's only TD pass. He looked a little like Wes Welker out there and played a very smart game from what I could see.

- The K-State D-line had two players who caught my eye by the way they forced Auburn to double-team them: NT #99 Steven Cline 6-2 296 and LDE #96 Moses Manu 6-2 260 may both be too small for the pros at their positions, but they ate up blockers very well.
- #98 OLB Ian Campbell 6-4 249 had 11.5 sacks last year, he didn't drop into coverage that I saw, but looked like a player we should keep an eye on. Not the best at setting the edge, but he did play well and looks like he could be built up and coached up. (They have a Sophomore OLB across from him who might be even better down the road).
- #8 RB James Johnson 5-11 200 didn't accomplish much in the run game, and I can't say if that was Auburn's D or an issue with K-State or Johnson; however, he looked very good as a receiver, they split him wide and worked him out of the backfield. He was 2nd on the team with 7 receptions for 40 yards. A potential 3rd down back.
- Others to monitor: #51 ILB Justin Roland 6-0 245, #22 CB Justin McKinney 5-9 191

For Auburn, the announcers gushed over #54 DE Quentin Groves 6-3 254 who did have 2 sacks, but I didn't get too excited by him, maybe if I'd watched the entire game instead of the replay.
- #20 DB Patrick Lee 6-0 201 and #24 DB Jonathan Wilhite 5-11 185 both looked to play well, I think Wilhite is a CB and Lee a S, but don't hold me to it.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

http://www.gbnreport.com/2007qbpreview.html

Top 20 QB Prospects
#    Player	         H/W	       School		
1    Andre' Woodson    6-4, 240	Kentucky 		
2    Brian Brohm       6-3, 228	Louisville	
3    Chad Henne        6-2, 233	Michigan	
4    John David Booty  6-3, 210	Southern Cal 	
5    Eric Ainge        6-5, 220	Tennessee 	
6    Colt Brennan      6-3, 195	Hawaii 	
7    Sam Keller        6-4, 227	Nebraska 
8    Matt Ryan         6-4, 225	Boston College 
9    Chase Holbrook    6-5, 230	New Mexico State (JR)	
10   Alex Brink        6-3, 215	Washington State 	
11   Paul Smith        6-2, 220	Tulsa 	
12   Anthony Morelli   6-3, 232	Penn State
13   Kyle Wright       6-4, 220	Miami 	
14   Bret Meyer        6-3, 205	Iowa State
15   Josh Johnson      6-3, 210 	San Diego 
16   Brandon Cox       6-2, 210	Auburn	
17   Dennis Dixon      6-3, 210 	Oregon 	
18   Ricky Santos      6-2, 195 	New Hampshire 	
19   Matt Flynn        6-3, 228 	LSU 	
20   Kevin O'Connell   6-5, 215 	San Diego State

Sleeper file: Mike Kokal, Miami of Ohio; Alex Tafralis, San Jose State; Omar Haugabrook, Troy; Joe Flacco, Delaware.