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Dr. Z's positional breakdown

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by Fencer, Jan 30, 2008.

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  1. Fencer

    Fencer Rookie

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    http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/dr_z/01/29/matchups.offense/index.html

    Gives the Patriots more edges than the Giants, even though he's picking the Giants to win.

    Not too many individually ridiculous opinions. He doesn't like Samuel and Seymour as much as most do, does like Seau and Harrison a lot.

    Doesn't indicate the magnitude of the edge, of course, so Brady over Manning is "cancelled" by Snee over Neal.
  2. Nordy

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    I wouldn't give Strahan the edge over Warren and likewise with Gibril Wilson over James Sanders. I'd also say Hobbs and Webster are even.
  3. Oswlek

    Oswlek Rookie

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    Just looking at offense, I find it odd that he ranks Moss against Toomer and Donte and Plax. His breakdown makes it seem as if the top 2 are split because of this, but a more apprpriate Moss/Plax, Stallworth/Toomer pairing would probably give NE the edge in both positions.

    And I think McKenzie is better than Kaczur.
  4. LaBrady

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    What??? Sucrafice coverage and he is human?? I heard a stat that when Giants blitzed week 17 Brady's QB rating was 148. And thats just reading the first comparison. Dr Z is a moron!
  5. MNF

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    I don't understand these breakdowns. They make no sense. How can you compare Seymour to Tuck. They have different roles. A more accurate breakdown would be to compare Patriot offensive players/units to Giants defensive players/units and vice versa. This would be more useful in understanding how these teams matchup.
  6. WhiZa

    WhiZa Rookie

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    I was thinking the same thing. He must not want to hurt Plax's feelings :)
  7. flasox27

    flasox27 Rookie

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    It goes to show how irrational his reasoning is. Even by giving the Giants the benefit of the doubt the Pats have better players and undoubtedly better coaching, he picks the Giants. Time for you to hang it up Z.
  8. Oswlek

    Oswlek Rookie

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    He has stated in the past that this type of breakdown is harder to do in that manner. He realizes that the offense doesn't face the offense, but it is just the most convenient way to look at it.
  9. PantsB

    PantsB Rookie

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    Seymour losing to Tuck is ridiculous but then Dr Z has a bee in his bonnet over Seymour. I'd have Warren and Strahan as a push.

    The WR matchup is clearly a construct so the end result is closer and his Giants prediction seems more realistic. Offense should be 8-1-2 so its pretty close.

    Defense is where he tries to make it up. As I said, Warren<>Strahan but Seymour is clearly better than Tuck. Junior > Kawika Mitchell, Sanders>Gibril Wilson, Hobbs is a push at worst compared to Webster. The Giants have an advantage at 2, maybe 3 defensive positions. The Giants were exactly average in terms of points per game allowed at 16th out of 32.

    Returns and kicker (for kickoffs) should be Patriots not even.
  10. Grogan's Heroes

    Grogan's Heroes Rookie

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    MNF, I couldn't agree more. They don't tell you anything about the game. If you wanted to do a "matchup," it should be about how the Pats DL stacks up against the Giants OL, or the Pats WR against the Giants secondary. This is just stupid. Dr. Z is a dinosaur folks.
  11. NEPatriot

    NEPatriot Banned

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    Dr Z has some emotional breakdown.
  12. unoriginal

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    He probably does that because he feels Moss and Toomer are the offense's X receivers, while Stallworth and Burress are the Z's. I don't know enough about either offense to comment on that - in fact I think the Pats move their receivers around between positions - but traditionally, given that the X is supposed to be the tall, possession receiver and Z the fast game-breaker, its not that silly a categorization, at least for the Giants. Moss kind of defies categorization, but Stallworth is a traditional Z.

    EDIT: In the article he has this switched, Moss/Toomer are the Z's and Burress/Stallworth are the X's.
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2008
  13. RayClay

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    On Seymour

    WTF?

    Since they operated on it, I hope so.

    Is this a joke, or is he really this ill informed?
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2008
  14. Nordy

    Nordy Rookie

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    They went up through his knee and operated on his elbow :D
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2008
  15. MNF

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    Hey Oswlek,

    He shouldn't refer to this as a breakdown of the match up between the Pats and Giants. It's anything but a breakdown of the matchup.

    If he wanted to provide some really insight he'd figure out a way to compare D vs. O. Plus, I can't see why it is difficult to compare O vs. D. That's a natural comparison. As opposed to comparing Tuck vs. Seymour, this is impossible since their roles are different.
  16. unoriginal

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    A quick glance at the Giants v. Pats shows my guess was wrong.

    Burress is definately the Giants' X, and Toomer is their Z.

    For the Pats, in formations that utilize a tight end, Moss seems to be most often lined up off the line, with Stallworth on. Though, of course, they do switch Moss around quite a bit.

    So from a technical point of view, Zimmerman's matchups are accurate.
  17. SeymourTrophies

    SeymourTrophies Rookie

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    It's funny that suddenly Laurence Maroney isn't so terrible in the eyes of the people that claimed we had no running game 3 weeks ago. It's not like he has a magic potion now.
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2008
  18. neuronet

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    It always amazes me when people do the wrong matchups, as on ESPN. "Let's compare the offense of NE to the offense of NY, and do this for all three phases of the game, even though it only makes sense for special teams, and even then we should really compare kicking versus receiving." It is just silly.
  19. neuronet

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    He just didn't have the chance to really show his stuff in all those games where he ran like 4 times.
  20. TX_Patriot

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    As an aside, the guys that do PFW inprogress were talking about DR. Z yesterday on their show and said that he is a crank, crotchity, old man, who also appears to have lost all touch with reality. It's a funny listen and would recommend downloading the podcast for yesterdays show.

    http://library.kraftsportsgroup.com/20080130_neplor.mp3

    Edit:

    I posted the link, but I'm sure Patriots.com would appreciate the hits, so go there some time today. :)
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2008
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