Welcome to PatsFans.com

Dr Z pats tidbits

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by SVN, Nov 22, 2006.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. SVN

    SVN Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2005
    Messages:
    22,514
    Likes Received:
    14
    Ratings:
    +14 / 0 / -0

    http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writers/dr_z/11/22/power.ranks/index.html


  2. kptmorgan04

    kptmorgan04 Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2005
    Messages:
    507
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    locker room material.... thank you Dr. Z, nothing like getting called out for playing like a dog by the national media
  3. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    31,088
    Likes Received:
    29
    Ratings:
    +37 / 2 / -3

    #24 Jersey

    I like Dr. Z but Glenn's helmet was on, unlike the Haynesworth incident. It wasn't an overly dangerous act which is why he was fined not suspended.
  4. vyrago

    vyrago Rookie

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2006
    Messages:
    1,841
    Likes Received:
    5
    Ratings:
    +5 / 0 / -0

    Are we back to that "They hate their coach" stuff?

    Maybe I have to watch that tape another 5 times, but it looked to me as though he stepped on his chest, not his face. Still bad, dirty football, but no where near as bad as stepping on his unprotected face and going back for seconds as Haynesworth did.

    There has been an explanation--Seymore was cut blocked--which is also no excuse, but was provocation. However, saying Seymour's stomp was the same as Haynesworth's is just not looking at the evidence.

    I will agree they played horribly against the Jets, pukey in fact.

    Finally, the word you want in your last sentence, Dr. (Is this Dr. as in Dr. J) is lying, not laying!
  5. chris_in_sunnyvale

    chris_in_sunnyvale Rookie

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2005
    Messages:
    2,091
    Likes Received:
    8
    Ratings:
    +8 / 0 / -0

    Regarding the Seymour dogging it...I've noticed this myself, but with some caveats: I think Seymour is best suited as a DT. When the Pats have gone to a 4-3 and he shifts inside, he looks dominant. I think his switch to a 3-4 DE in 2003 may benefit the D as a whole, but did not benefit him personally. He's asked to focus on controlling 2 gaps which is a hugely important task, but it's not sexy like bull-rushing up the gut against overmatched guards. I think he gets mentally lost at times, especially against the supposedly inferior teams like the Jets. However, he seems to take his game up a notch when needed (like vs. Green Bay). The bottom line is that I don't worry about Seymour come January because he knows when to crank it up a notch.

    If you remember the 80s Celtics, Robert Parrish was on record as "pacing" himself during the season. Seymour's play reminds me of this.

    Regards,
    Chris
  6. RayClay

    RayClay Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2005
    Messages:
    17,518
    Likes Received:
    40
    Ratings:
    +49 / 0 / -1

    #75 Jersey

    Thanks Dr. Z for proving once again what an overrated POS you are.

    Maybe he's hurt? You never know?

    I guess that would require doing some basic research.

    Hmmmmm I wonder if having a 200 Lb. player fall on your arm and bend it backward at the elbow would affect your ability to hold tight ends?

    I guess since he went back and played with it the following week, you assume he was never injured.

    I'm telling you this Dr. Z is the biggest fraud going. Just because he tells you he watches lots of film doesn't mean he really prepares.

    My guess is he's more of a wino than a connoisseur. And his wife's probably a red headed hag.

    If you don't think Sey was still feeling the effects of the injury, I have a little test for you.

    Put you left hand on a desk, elbow up. Take a 20 lb. weight, (1/10th of what fell on Seymour) and smash it on the elbow part.

    Bang it against a wall occasionally for an hour every Sunday, then tell me how it feels in a couple weeks.

    At least you will know a little more about Seymour's condition than the renowned sports expert.:D
  7. PatsWickedPissah

    PatsWickedPissah PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2005
    Messages:
    22,515
    Likes Received:
    75
    Ratings:
    +86 / 0 / -0

    Disable Jersey

    I agree with the fact of Sey's really poor play against the Jets. I had a front row view and focused on the DL. Yes, Hill was even worse and got pulled, only to return to the perrenial inactive status against GB. I don't know why Sey played so poorly against the Jets, injury or desire, but pulling him was a rational response.

    Put me in the camp that says Warren really, really helps Sey produce. I think that at this juncture Richard Seymour is the most over rated, under achieving Patriot. That's a shame.
  8. JR4

    JR4 In the Starting Line-up PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2004
    Messages:
    2,733
    Likes Received:
    7
    Ratings:
    +7 / 0 / -0

    I too have felt Seymour is overrated. Because he isn't full tilt all the time.
    I was worried when he got his big contract that this would happen.
    He's got his money and will play but rarely will we see 100% effort all the time. Maybe in the playoffs ... one can only hope.
    I am disappointed with him.
  9. Battaglia

    Battaglia Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2005
    Messages:
    46
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    Dr.Z is a complete idiot and one of the most whiny negative writers out there. Hes a fraud. The last thing Ive ever heard about Seymour is lack of effort, which is different from not playing well. I think its insulting to Seymour to question his heart, when he has veterans surrounding him who wont let him slack off, and vice versa.
  10. unoriginal

    unoriginal Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2006
    Messages:
    3,166
    Likes Received:
    16
    Ratings:
    +16 / 0 / -0

    The reason that's the last thing you've heard is because he's been "slacking off" only most recently, and its been covered everywhere from this messageboard to Reiss' mailbag to, now, Dr. Z. So he's a "complete idiot" because he's writing what he and others are seeing, instead of lovingly knitting Seymour a fuzzy warm monogrammed jockstrap?

    Injured or not, Seymour was not flying around the field in most of the games this year like he was at Green Bay, where we all saw him and Junior Seau, recovering from a failed A-gap blitz, run down Greg Jennings 26 yards down the field. Did he do that because he's now playing well, or did he do that because he's now playing hard, pissed off? You're goddamn right its insulting to be written up for lack of effort - I expect that's why we saw Seymour hunt down Jennings like he wanted to eat him.
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2006
  11. NYCPatsFan

    NYCPatsFan Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2006
    Messages:
    2,402
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    Maybe you should do some research. A fraud? He is one of the rare guys who does some solid research work across all teams. Two years ago, when the Pats lost badly to the Steelers @ Heinz field in the regular season, there was not a single analysis in the entire NE media why Brady got sacked so many times. He was the only one who provided excellent information on why Ashworth (I might be wrong about the player), who never practiced at left tackle was suddenly asked to play that position when the regular back-up also went down. In addition to that, he provided a lot more information on why the Pats performance was an aberration and true enough, we beat them solidly later.

    Dr. Z might make outlandish bets like picking the Fins to win the SB and talk a lot about wine, but that doesn't mean that he is a fraud.


    [/QUOTE] And his wife's probably a red headed hag. [/QUOTE]

    Is there any need to get personal? Oh I know, you are going to retort that he mentions his red-haired wife in every column. That doesn't give you any right to call someone's wife a hag in a public forum.


    [/QUOTE] If you don't think Sey was still feeling the effects of the injury, I have a little test for you. Put you left hand on a desk, elbow up. Take a 20 lb. weight, (1/10th of what fell on Seymour) and smash it on the elbow part. Bang it against a wall occasionally for an hour every Sunday, then tell me how it feels in a couple weeks. At least you will know a little more about Seymour's condition than the renowned sports expert.:D[/QUOTE]

    Most players play with some kind of injury and that's the reason why they are pros and earn good $s. If he cannot play, Seymour himself would have sat out (or BB would have made him sit). If he suited up, he must have been confident about playing to his ability.

    What Seymour did at the Colts game was inexcusable. Period.
    Seymour played a bad game against the Jets. Period.

    No point in attacking a columnist or diverting the topic into meaningless exercises about how to experience a player's pain.
  12. RayClay

    RayClay Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2005
    Messages:
    17,518
    Likes Received:
    40
    Ratings:
    +49 / 0 / -1

    #75 Jersey

    And his wife's probably a red headed hag. [/QUOTE]

    Is there any need to get personal? Oh I know, you are going to retort that he mentions his red-haired wife in every column. That doesn't give you any right to call someone's wife a hag in a public forum.


    [/QUOTE] If you don't think Sey was still feeling the effects of the injury, I have a little test for you. Put you left hand on a desk, elbow up. Take a 20 lb. weight, (1/10th of what fell on Seymour) and smash it on the elbow part. Bang it against a wall occasionally for an hour every Sunday, then tell me how it feels in a couple weeks. At least you will know a little more about Seymour's condition than the renowned sports expert.:D[/QUOTE]

    Most players play with some kind of injury and that's the reason why they are pros and earn good $s. If he cannot play, Seymour himself would have sat out (or BB would have made him sit). If he suited up, he must have been confident about playing to his ability.

    What Seymour did at the Colts game was inexcusable. Period.
    Seymour played a bad game against the Jets. Period.

    No point in attacking a columnist or diverting the topic into meaningless exercises about how to experience a player's pain.[/QUOTE]

    He studies individual players. That's his shtick. It's a team game and I find his analysis of current teams extremely lacking quite often.

    To slam Seymour and say "I don't know if he's hurt", when the least bit of research would reveal he came back immediately from having Harrison fall on his outstretched arm is lazy journalism in the least.

    A lot of people have said the severe hyperextension was the nost gruesome thing they've seen since Theisman's broken leg.

    I think Z is so into his minutiae of grading individual players he fails to keep up with current players and teams.

    By going out of his way to slam Seymour without checking his injury status he confirms my belief.
  13. RayClay

    RayClay Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2005
    Messages:
    17,518
    Likes Received:
    40
    Ratings:
    +49 / 0 / -1

    #75 Jersey

    [/QUOTE] And his wife's probably a red headed hag. [/QUOTE]

    He called Seymour lazy without bothering to find out if he's injured.

    I didn't bother to find out if his wife's good looking.

    Equivalent. Except for the fact he's a famous writer and I'm not.:D
  14. Box_O_Rocks

    Box_O_Rocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2005
    Messages:
    20,550
    Likes Received:
    25
    Ratings:
    +25 / 0 / -0

    Just to protect Ashworth's good name, he was on IR. Gorin got shuffled to LT after Light went down (which is why remarks in training camp calling him a swing tackle had me screaming in agony), while they tried both Hochstein and Neal at RT to try to find some way to protect Tommy.
  15. Box_O_Rocks

    Box_O_Rocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2005
    Messages:
    20,550
    Likes Received:
    25
    Ratings:
    +25 / 0 / -0

    I didn't have a DVR to tape and rehash player performance before last year, so I'll just say Seymour is playing at or above the level he played in for each of the first 10 games last season. This is about the time he started coming to life and being the dominant player of legend.

    I believe he's been called out this year (and not just by Dr. Z in the media) because Ty Warren has used his off-season work to elevate his pass rush, mediots notice pass rushes and get confused by run stuffers who are usually on the bottom of a pile (look how many times a well known player standing next to the pile gets the credit from an announcer while his lesser known teammate is pulled from the bottom of the pile clutching the RB's drumstick). Ty has been dominant the way they expect Seymour to be and it gets noticed.

    Sey did get a late start off PUP in Training Camp, that plus the elbow has slowed him like the knee injury last year. I don't consider his play as bad as implied by Z and I'm not worried about it going forward - especially with a media blaze starting to flicker under his backside.
  16. PatsFan37

    PatsFan37 Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    1,494
    Likes Received:
    5
    Ratings:
    +6 / 0 / -0

    #37 Jersey

    Amazing that we're even talking about the DL. They're very very good. Warren's been good all year, Wilfork has been inconsistent, but the new turf might help him and Seymour is getting healthy. Plus, this is their time of year.

    Now what I'd like to see is better pass-blocking from the tackles against the good defenses. But that would be another thread, and for that sort of thing, I'll wait for the new server.
  17. PatsWickedPissah

    PatsWickedPissah PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2005
    Messages:
    22,515
    Likes Received:
    75
    Ratings:
    +86 / 0 / -0

    Disable Jersey

    You neglected to mention that Ty Warren has been and continues to be a dominant part of the run stuffing D. Case in point, the Jets game where Warren was out and the Jets ran up the middle for 1st down yardage all day, despite Wilfork et. al. I often watch the DL closely and excepting Sunday's game and one other I watched closely, Sey's game has been below his par this season.
  18. RayClay

    RayClay Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2005
    Messages:
    17,518
    Likes Received:
    40
    Ratings:
    +49 / 0 / -1

    #75 Jersey

    I would guess it was because he was a former tight end.
  19. RayClay

    RayClay Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2005
    Messages:
    17,518
    Likes Received:
    40
    Ratings:
    +49 / 0 / -1

    #75 Jersey

    Banks isn't bad. I like Pat Kirwan a lot.

    I guess some people like Z because he supposedly breaks down tape on individual players.

    I really don't know, but I tend to find his exhaustive film study less credible based on his lack of knowledge of the current teams and players.

    It would be difficult to search for articles to prove my point, but he's no different from most of these writers or announcers.

    If he's too busy analyzing the footwork of the Lions third string center to pay attention to the current season,and that's your thing, I apologize.
  20. PatsSteve1

    PatsSteve1 Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2004
    Messages:
    2,795
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    * maybe teams will start double teaming Warren and leave Seymour singled.
  21. NYCPatsFan

    NYCPatsFan Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2006
    Messages:
    2,402
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    I didn't bother to find out if his wife's good looking.

    Equivalent. Except for the fact he's a famous writer and I'm not.:D[/QUOTE]

    Amusing quips :)
  22. NYCPatsFan

    NYCPatsFan Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2006
    Messages:
    2,402
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    If that is what he did, I agree with your assessment that he did a pathetic job on this report. (note that I qualified it for just this report :))

    Glad that you took my first posting in the stride. After seeing the extreme reactions of many regular posters to even the smallest criticism either against the tone of their posting or against the Pats, I was bracing myself for a similar retort. :)
  23. RayClay

    RayClay Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2005
    Messages:
    17,518
    Likes Received:
    40
    Ratings:
    +49 / 0 / -1

    #75 Jersey

    Hey I slam the writers when I find them lacking because they're pros, I figure it goes with the territory and I don't really expect them to be reading this.

    I know some people worship Z because of his individual player breakdowns, so maybe I'm trying to be controversial.

    He really doesn't keep up on teams during the season then writes opinion pieces based on his memories from the year before. I've caught him at this and I don't like it.

    Even though I'm not so much into the individual breakdowns, he's certainly better than most of the writers. The only one I really respect and enjoy is Kirwan, but I've never tried to keep up on all 32 teams either, it's harder than it seems I'm sure.

    Yeah My E-feelings don't get hurt very easily.

    And I'd probably do his wife, but i have pretty low standards so that's not saying much.:D
  24. Fanfrom1960

    Fanfrom1960 Rookie

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2005
    Messages:
    3,179
    Likes Received:
    2
    Ratings:
    +2 / 0 / -0

    Zimmerman has a hot wife? Isn't he about a hundred?
  25. HEY BRO! WHAT UP?

    HEY BRO! WHAT UP? Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2006
    Messages:
    4,370
    Likes Received:
    3
    Ratings:
    +3 / 0 / -0

    When the Pats lost to the Jets, I knew after looking at the field conditions it was an absolute fluke. I gave the Pats the benefit of the doubt and was not worry what so ever. If they had lost again in Green Bay, I would be worried. Look, the 3 losses at home against Denver, Indy and the Jets were partially due to the field conditions. Not to take away anything from the Colts and Broncos, they are really good teams and outplayed the Pats. But the Jets game had horrendous field conditions! I will give the Jets some credit because they did come out to play, but the Jets are not a better football team and it will show come season's end. As for Seymour, I'm a firm believer that he creates more havoc when he is inside on passing downs. I'm sure the Pats already do this but if not, when it gets to third and long the Pats should utilize a four man front more with Seymour inside and Jarvis Green on the outside. Lastly, Colvin needs to be blitzing a lot more on early downs instead of being in pass coverage.

    Oh yeah and this Dr. Z character can kiss it! This is a guy who bables in his column about what team's bandwagon he is jumping on this week then finishes it off with predicting three games or so out of all the games for the weekend. I don't know why SI still has him writing columns on their site and magazine, I could care less about what he writes about. Peter King is way better at what he does than Dr.Z. What the hell is he a Dr of anyway? I used to be a person that read a lot of articles daily to see what experts thought about the Pats and now I know why organizations don't want their players to read it. It's a bunch of crap! Who cares what these so called experts think about the Pats, they don't know ****! A few years ago, I used to be a stat junkie and read way too much into stats. The only stat you need to know is whether your team has a win or a loss. I could care less about how many td's Brady has compared to Manning or where our defense ranks in the NFL. Stats can be misleading. I'm done ranting now.
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2006
  26. RayClay

    RayClay Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2005
    Messages:
    17,518
    Likes Received:
    40
    Ratings:
    +49 / 0 / -1

    #75 Jersey

    Z mentions his red headed wife most every column. It's part of his shtick, like the other guy with his whipped cream frappucinos from Starbucks.

    I took exception to Z's questioning Seymour's effort and took liberties with my imagination and his 90-100, (only an estimate) year old wife.

    In the tradition of Kramer and Mel Gibson, I hereby sincerely apologize.:p
  27. RayClay

    RayClay Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2005
    Messages:
    17,518
    Likes Received:
    40
    Ratings:
    +49 / 0 / -1

    #75 Jersey

    Also in my defense, when some wine connoisseurs reach a certain age, they start to care less about the vintage, type of grape or year and just want to catch a buzz.

    If the good DR. is not in this category again, my apologies.:p
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2006
  28. Brady'sButtBoy

    Brady'sButtBoy Rookie

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2005
    Messages:
    1,747
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    Dr. Z has been watching the game a long time, takes time to carefully watch line play and is not at all full of himself. His comments regarding Seymour (who Z has praised on several former occasions) would never have been offered lightly, given the kind of respect Z expresses for the game.

    Too many people here instantly dismiss disparaging views of anything Patriots without bothering to genuinely consider the source. Z would be the first person to admit that he could be wrong and that covering the NFL is extremely difficult given the size of the league and the number of players now. On the other hand, we crave coverage of our team, the more the better most often. We enjoy reading about our guys and because the new sources understand this appetite they insist that their writers fill up pages with their coverage, ranking, insights, etc. Z and his 'frappacino' friend, Peter King, continue to be tow of the most diligent and well informed writers on the national scene. Neither would be working if we didn't demand more content, don't forget.

    As for Seymour's play, I side with those a bit disappointed with his output. King Richard was just steamrolled on more than one play during the Jets game. He could have been hurt, and while I admire his drive to be on the field, if his injury was preventing better play then sitting him down made sense for the Pats. I realize it is hard to fully appreciate Seymour's dominance because it takes place in such tight quarters and often away from the ball. But I continue to expect a more obvious impact from our best D-lineman.
  29. RayClay

    RayClay Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2005
    Messages:
    17,518
    Likes Received:
    40
    Ratings:
    +49 / 0 / -1

    #75 Jersey

    I agree with most of what you say. But if you admit, (as Z does), that you don't know what you're talking about, then write about something else.

    We heard the same crap with Dillon last year. Off year, doesn't have it too old.

    Amazing how much younger he is this year.

    I'm sorry, sitting on your tush and criticizing guys running on one leg or trying to take on double teams with one arm is total bullsh*t.

    We say how great it is to play hurt, but you have to play 100% with one freaking arm or leg!

    If you play hurt, you get crucified!!!!

    Makes me understand the Tyrone Poole's of the world.
  30. njpatsfan

    njpatsfan Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2004
    Messages:
    816
    Likes Received:
    2
    Ratings:
    +2 / 0 / -0

    "Dr. Z's" wine long ago turned to vinegar.

    Once, in the pre-internet days, he had a lock on a lot of inside information - and could therefore write some pretty insightful articles. Sport stats bureaus were the exclusive province of large media organizations.

    Now, with the quantity and speed of information delivery nowadays, that advantage is long gone. Today, you have to master all the online sources, work streets/locker rooms AND do at at light speed because the news cycle is so fast. Sadly, Zimmerman doesn't even maintain the pretense of trying to keep up. I have read him for years, and I think he has been mailing it in for a long time now.

    He must have written 50 articles in the last 5 years bemoaning 'parity' in a pathetic display of pre-inoculating the reader against any failure of his 'predictions'. It's almost embarrassing.

    At least when Peter King is getting a coffee, it's usually on the way to a game/practice.

    For me, the Z in "Dr. Z" is for laZy.

    R
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page