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Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by AndyJohnson, Feb 14, 2008.

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  1. AndyJohnson

    AndyJohnson PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I havent paid a whole lot of attention to this Spector bozo, but something I keep hearing is really annoying me.
    I keep hearing about 'confirmation that this goes back to 2000'.
    Yet, the only facts I have heard about that are that Goddell said Belichick thought it was legal IMPLYING he had done it all along.
    That has now turned into Spectacle saying that there was evidence about 2 games vs the Steelers.

    Isn't this a complete stretch and manipulation of fact? How does that guy really sleep at night?

    Likewise, it has been thoroughly reported that the Patriots turned over 6 tapes from 06 and pre-season 07. How does that lead to confirmation that it was done at any other time?

    I dont know that it really matters if, when or how often this was done. I could care less about it, its obvious that every team does whatever they can for a competitive advantage, there is no doubt that every team attempts to steal signs, whether done with video or not isn't a judgment on character but one of technolgical saavy.
    But why would an elected official CREATE a controversy over something he has no true authority over, only to come out and twist the facts to sensationalize and most likely overstate it?
    If it were a true magnimous gesture by a government official, wouldn't he walk out, and state the FACTS of what was said, rather than draw conclusions that support what he wants to cry about?

    I just dont get it.
  2. Disco Volante

    Disco Volante Rookie

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    I am a bit confused myself.

    What has been confirmed as fact, from yesterday?
  3. Joker

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    He's a lame duck,Andy...this is the end of the line for him so he's doing things like this because he can get away with it without repercussions to his future.The entire premise is ludicrous and grounds for censure IMO.
  4. BradyFTW!

    BradyFTW! PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #12 Jersey

    I could be way off on this, but I think that Goodell confirmed that Belichick had told him that he had been taping since 2000. Of course, he also said the Super Bowls weren't tainted, which means that either this wasnt actually said, or Goodell doesn't think that taping taints the Super Bowls. He's kinda backed himself into a corner with this one, I'd say.
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2008
  5. AndyJohnson

    AndyJohnson PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    As far as I have seen, the facts were that Goddell destroyed the tapes, he told Specacle what was on them, and told him that BB said he felt it was legal, which IMPLIED that it had been going on since 2000.
  6. lightningbolt

    lightningbolt Rookie

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    Goodell cannot punish the Patriots any further because that makes him look like he was holding back a more severe punishment until Congress got on his back and also because it would put into question the legitimacy of the Patriots 3 championships. Saying that they've been video taping other team's since 2000 is admitting that the Patriots have been cheating all of that time and have 3 super bowls that they won through cheating.
  7. Disco Volante

    Disco Volante Rookie

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    Yup, that's what I read in the first article.

    Then I saw the AP article which was reporting it was fact. I don't think Roger has said anything concering this since the meeting.
  8. reflexblue

    reflexblue PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #91 Jersey

    I beleive it would be legal until the memo of sep'06. if thats the case then Sphinctor is ignoring the fact that it was legal until 06 and running with this bull sh!t about taping since 2000 without saying that it WAS legal at the time. Real slimball stuff,what am I saying hes a typical politician
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2008
  9. AndyJohnson

    AndyJohnson PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I have not read that, and have read it stated in afew places, exactly as BB said he felt it was legal, and that IMPLIED he had been doing it since 2000.

    It doesnt add up with the prior stories either,because it has been communicated that:

    1) 6 tapes were turned over
    2) they were from 06 and the 07 preseason
    3) Goddell stated he was CONFIDENT everything was turned over, and firmly said if he believed there were any more, he would reopen the investigation. He was specifically asked if he felt he got everything, and he said yes, and he better have.

    What we are to believe from these stories, other than that Goddell has lied to protect the Patriots (curious behavor considering the penalties levied) that Goddell 'caught' the Patriots, BB handed over 6 recent tapes, told him he had been doing it for 7 years, but that he destroyed 6 1/2 years of work for no reason, and Goddell whole heartedly believed it. This is foolish when you consider that NFL teams keep EVERYTHING, that technology would nowhave that film on a disc or harddrive, and would be categorized by HC, DC, and the coaches that new coordinators or coaches worked under.
    If this was a scheme to gain a competitive advantage, knowing how BB uses film study, prior to the SB, he would have pulled out every game ever against a Coughlin or Spagnola team, AND any game against any coaches they ever coached under and had someone looking for trends.
    Hey, back in 2001 and 2002, the Eagles used a shoulder rub to indicate a blitz. The Jags under Couglin used a tug on the pant leg for 4 years. Lets watch for those in the game, and if we see them and its a blitz, we have the key.

    One thing is certain. If bill Belichick had 7 years of film, he wouldn't have erased it because he saw no vaue in it. It would have sat around until one day he thought it could help.
  10. Joker

    Joker PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    you make an amazing amount of leaps in logic...

    1)all teams videotape...did you seriously NOT know this?

    2)the Pats have been videotaping like everybody has been videotaping yet ONLY the Pats are "cheating" by videotaping? Only the Pats get an advantage because they have the supersecret videotapes that, by your way of thinking, absolutely and positively are the SOLE reason they win...not game planning,not coaching, not the players....all you need is a videotape and you win the Super Bowl. Yeah,pretty logical....like one of those S.D. iceheads on a weeklong binge picking scabholes in their arms and legs.

    3) and of course, the F-A-C-T that this "rule" the Patriots infracted only came into being in 2006 really lends a ton of credence to your "see!!!! cheating!!!back to 2000!!!". Obviously you are a very shallow little fan with nothing more than a passing knowledge of NFL football. Perhaps you'd do better writing critiques of in-line skating or trying to break the "awesome dewd!" stoned out Mission Beach surfbum mushroom eating record.
  11. lightningbolt

    lightningbolt Rookie

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    All teams might cheat but the Patriots got caught. If you cheated on a school test, would you say that everyone else was cheating so it was ok? The fact remains that the team that gets caught is the team that is punished and Belichick clearly got caught cheating or breaking an NFL rule if you want to view it that way.

    Also, the Patriots not only video taped teams during games but during their practices which in my opinion is much worse since the plays they run in practice are the same plays they use during the game.
  12. mgm79

    mgm79 Rookie

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    If this is such a big deal, why is no one asking was this going on when he was coaching in Cleveland? His record wasn't exactly stellar there, if he was "illegally taping defensive signals" while coaching in Cleveland it would seem that it doesn't have the effect that the media and Specter are claiming. And its not like BB invented this, from what we are hearing this has been going for ages, which makes me wonder where he picked it up. With the Colts? Or the Lions? Maybe it was while he was the DC for the Giants while they won their Super bowls? Maybe those Super bowls should be tainted like people are saying ours are?
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2008
  13. mgm79

    mgm79 Rookie

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    Can you back that up at all?
  14. BradyFTW!

    BradyFTW! PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #12 Jersey

    First off, there has never been any proof that the Pats videotaped practices. Secondly, there are a lot of ways that you can figure out which plays a team runs. That's what game film is for.
  15. lightningbolt

    lightningbolt Rookie

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    If what a former Patriots employee says is true then yeah:

  16. lightningbolt

    lightningbolt Rookie

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    Teams don't run the same plays in every game though. If you have video tape of their practices then you can see which plays they will run that week and then prepare your team for those plays.
  17. Joker

    Joker PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    You're a liar...and a bad one at that

    That loss in the playoffs has left you emotionally disfigured...maybe you should take up a mentally less challenging pastime, like following the bowling tour.
  18. Disco Volante

    Disco Volante Rookie

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    According to a source

    Who? Oh you don't know? Alright.
  19. mgm79

    mgm79 Rookie

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    Thats some solid evidence you are basing your opinion on, an article that quotes an unnamed source that came out the day before the Super bowl. Nicely done!
  20. nittanylions52

    nittanylions52 Banned

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    I feel as though I've read in most of those articles that Belichick turned over notes to Goodell. From the notes, Goodell concluded that Belichick had actually taped other games onto those 6 tapes, but taped over them in the following years. That's what I remember reading - that Goodell got the idea from written notes. I could be wrong on that, though.
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2008
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