Welcome to PatsFans.com

Disingenuous BS

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by patfanken, Jun 26, 2007.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. patfanken

    patfanken On the Roster

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2005
    Messages:
    5,762
    Likes Received:
    326
    Ratings:
    +571 / 16 / -8

    #91 Jersey

    Once again the Herald is acting as player agent in any pay contraversy the Pats or any professional athlete has with his team. What suck ups. Here Meion Branch offers his musings on the the Samuel negotiations.

    http://patriots.bostonherald.com/pat...format=&page=1

    I just found it so phoney with all his talk about the love of his former teammates and the insinuation that he wasn't treated fairly by the Pats. He never mentions the VERY Generous offer (in fact too generous) the Pats DID make to him, or the fact he never bothered to counter the Pats original offer.

    Some how, just because the Pats refused to make Meion the 3rd highest paid WR in the league (at the time), they now can be viewed as under valuing their players.

    The same holds true about the Samuel negotiation. No where do they make notice of the VERY fair offer the Pats have already made Samuel. It was slightly larger than the so call "Dre Bly deal", and significantly larger than the Nathan Vasher deal, who has better creds than Samuel.

    JUST ONCE I'd like to hear a former player just say the truth. "Yeah the Pats made a nice offer, but the one I got from the Seahawks just blew me away. I wanted out of NE and did what I had to, to make it happen. It worked out well for me, and NE seems to have landed on its feet as well"

    Please note this post is less about the pros and cons of the Samuel negotiation and more about the DISINGENOUSNESS (I love that word) of the media in its biased reporting, and Branch who once again proves his actions and words have nothing in common.
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2007
  2. Pats726

    Pats726 Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    9,800
    Likes Received:
    8
    Ratings:
    +8 / 0 / -0

    Could not get the link to work...but I agree..WOuld like to hear Branchs words..his take and the BS he is peddling.
  3. T-ShirtDynasty

    T-ShirtDynasty Moderator

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2005
    Messages:
    3,562
    Likes Received:
    8
    Ratings:
    +8 / 0 / -0

  4. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    41,428
    Likes Received:
    138
    Ratings:
    +265 / 10 / -26

    Started to read it and then thought since when has Branch become a credible expert on negotiations... same old BS, try to create some controversy..
  5. Grizzafted

    Grizzafted Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2006
    Messages:
    999
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    "explosive Seattle offense"

    ?!?!?!

    edit: I don't think Deion said anything too incendiary in that article. The sad part is that he feels like if there had been better and more straightforward communication early in the process he'd have a contract and (I think) be wearing another ring. No matter how you look at it, someone, anyone, is going to have to step up big for a multi-year period to replace him.
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2007
  6. Va_Pats_Fan

    Va_Pats_Fan Rookie

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2006
    Messages:
    1,252
    Likes Received:
    21
    Ratings:
    +48 / 0 / -0

    #95 Jersey

    How do you know what Samuel was offered? Were you in the room @ the negotiations? Branch's negotiations?

    The same media you blast for doing this is the one that "supplied" those numbers. If they, as you claim, have an agenda, how can they be trusted to be accurate on one account, but not the other?

    Media gets paid to sell ads. Lower your expectations, and you won't be so disappointed :)

    http://patriots.bostonherald.com/patriots/view.bg?articleid=1008299

    is a correct link to the article...
  7. Grizzafted

    Grizzafted Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2006
    Messages:
    999
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    My question is, if the front office could go back and change things, you think they'd offer him a better contract?

    How about this. Which WR corps would you realistically rather have starting against the Jets this year:

    Option A

    Moss
    Stallworth
    Welker
    Caldwell
    Gaffney
    CJ/Brown/Washington

    OR, Option B. Let's say...

    Branch
    Caldwell
    Welker
    Gaffney
    Brown
    CJ/Washington

    My own personal opinion, for what it's worth is Option B.
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2007
  8. Pats726

    Pats726 Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    9,800
    Likes Received:
    8
    Ratings:
    +8 / 0 / -0

    “I didn’t want to get traded,” he said. “That was never, ever what I wanted, but I wasn’t going to just bend over and fold and let someone run me over.”
    Didn't wish to get traded....I have to ask this question..what did you DO Deion so you would NOT be traded???
    Like failing to negotiate for 3-4 months with a counter offer??? Like demand a no franchise tag if you came to camp?? Like holding out and threatening to sit out to Game 10??
    If he REALLY did not wish to get traded he is as dumb as a rock...NONE of his actions and stances in anyway indicated that he wished to stay with the team in any way at all. Yes Deion you didn't want to give an inch on anything..you didn't wish to get run over...you showed what a lying phony you were..you basically pushed the Patriots into a corner and then you are surprised you are gone??? Either pretty dumb or totally disingenuous. The team was quite fair with you and you were not. Nice to say you didn't WANT to be traded but your actions fail to go along with that statement.
  9. Rob0729

    Rob0729 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2006
    Messages:
    30,061
    Likes Received:
    330
    Ratings:
    +838 / 5 / -3

    I couldn't get any of the links to open. The Herald has had problems with their site for days.

    Although I am commenting without reading the article, it was logical to expect that someone was going to get Deion's take on the Samuel situation. Everyone is comparing the two situations. I think plenty of writers were looking for the scoop on Deion's take on the situation. I think every local guy was looking for that story.

    Again, I am commenting without knowing the content of the piece or the angle the reporter used.
  10. p8ryts

    p8ryts Rookie

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2005
    Messages:
    1,197
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +6 / 0 / -0

    I thought it was a good read. It only purported to give Branch's perspective and it did that.

    At least the Herald had a topical story. It seems most sports writers only report material presented by club publicists.

    At this time of the year there is no news because writers have to figure out what to write about and do some work on their own.

    I still support the position the Patriots took with Branch and I will support whatever approach they take with Samuel.

    I don't pay any attention to negotiating postures by club or player/agent.

    I can't wait for some real football. I hope to get to TC this year, missed it the last couple, kind of hard to get there from VA.
  11. patsgo

    patsgo Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2006
    Messages:
    1,466
    Likes Received:
    3
    Ratings:
    +3 / 0 / -0

    moss and stalworth are much more dangeruos than branch and caldwell not even close
  12. sieglo

    sieglo Rookie

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2006
    Messages:
    4,243
    Likes Received:
    7
    Ratings:
    +13 / 0 / -0

    I would say given the way he and his agent raped the Seahawks, he is a credible expert on negotiations. :rocker:
  13. patfanken

    patfanken On the Roster

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2005
    Messages:
    5,762
    Likes Received:
    326
    Ratings:
    +571 / 16 / -8

    #91 Jersey

    You WIN the Deion Branch Memorial Disingenuous Description AWARD.

    You hit all the important points and did it better than I. Thank you. ;)
  14. stinkypete

    stinkypete Rookie

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2004
    Messages:
    2,269
    Likes Received:
    15
    Ratings:
    +33 / 0 / -1

    #24 Jersey


    Do you really prefer Deion Branch over Randy Moss AND Donte Stallworth? Better question, do you think we would have traded a 2nd rounder for Welker if Branch were still on the team?
  15. spacecrime

    spacecrime Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    8,329
    Likes Received:
    17
    Ratings:
    +17 / 0 / -0

    David Givens basically said that. He said he liked the Pats and thanked them forhte opportunity, but as a 7th round pick made very little money and he felt it was important for him to take the highest offer.

    Law and Milloy also were pretty upfront about money being the most important factor in deciding where to play.

    Weasels like Vinatieri, Branch, etc try to make it out that they want to play for NE, but are getting the respect, when what they mean is that they would gladly play for New England if only New England would offer more money than anyone else.

    However, I don't think they are being deceitful. Listening to them I really believe they equate money with respect. A low offer means they are not being respected, worse they are being disrespected. For all their ability and vigor and fitness and fame, they behave as though they have no inner esteem. Pretty weird when you think about it.
  16. Grizzafted

    Grizzafted Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2006
    Messages:
    999
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    Yes, I do think they'd have made the run at Welker with Branch still on the team. We would have needed a slot guy no matter what.

    I've seen Moss in action, I know what he's capable of. He and Stallworth both have essentially one-year contracts. It's by no means a given that either of them are going to mesh well with Brady. They obviously have that potential, and if it happens with one or both I'm going to be ecstatic, but Branch was a known quantity. How will Stallworth or Moss perform in a conference championship game on the road? It's anyone's guess until they prove something.

    The upside of Moss is far higher than Branch. But we won 2 super bowls with Branch, during one of which he came up with 11 balls, running routes that Moss isn't well known for. If, IF, everything falls into place, this is the best WR corps in the Brady era, but a lot needs to happen first, and I'll be surprised if everybody is on the same page, clicking well by October.

    There are going to be games where the long ball is not going to be a major factor, and it remains to be seen how those two function in the short passing game. Apparently Stallworth was dropping balls in minicamp, and Moss isn't known for running across the middle. Will the passing game work with Stallworth and Moss running fly and out routes and Welker and Watson picking up the slack between the hash marks? I hope so. I have to see it first. I'd still rather have the known quantity, all things considered.
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2007
  17. Oswlek

    Oswlek Rookie

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2006
    Messages:
    4,172
    Likes Received:
    5
    Ratings:
    +5 / 0 / -0

    If you are a high school math teacher in your 12th year making $47,000 a year and your college buddy is a math teacher in the neighboring district and he makes $63,000 per year...

    You'd damn well feel disrespected yourself. I have no problem with them equating money with respect, particularly when their earning years are so short. What I have a problem with is guys acting as if they shared no culpability in the communication breakdown. If Deion really wanted to stay here, he could have gotten much of what Seattle gave him by just countering. NE even offered him the same contract if he would just fire Chayut.
  18. Rob0729

    Rob0729 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2006
    Messages:
    30,061
    Likes Received:
    330
    Ratings:
    +838 / 5 / -3

    Although it is all conjecture what we would or wouldn't have done if we resigned Branch, I think Branch is a better fit for the Pats' system than either Moss or Stallworth. It is yet to be known if either guy will make a good fit here.

    Also, the Pats did try to trade for Stallworth last year, but the Saints were looking for LB help which we couldn't offer. There is a strong possibility Stallworth would have been here with or without Branch.

    Also, there is a possibility that Welker would still be here since we obviously know that the Pats weren't high on this draft because they did everything to trade out of it. They still might have thought Welker was a better bet than anything you could get in the second round.

    I believe the Pats were right in not giving Branch what he was looking for. I also agree that not all the WRs we added would not be here today, but I could see one or two of the group of Welker, Stallworth, and Moss being on this team whether Branch was here or not.
  19. TomBrady'sGoat

    TomBrady'sGoat Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2006
    Messages:
    1,769
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    Grizzafted, do you think NE should have simply torn up the final year of Deion's rookie contract?

    THAT was the issue. NE was willing to pay Deion $6M for each year they extended him. Even if that wouldn't get it done, it would have been close enough to negotiate from.

    The problem was that Deion insisted his final 1 year / $1.5M of his rookie contract not be figured into any extension. The contract NE offered accounted for it, bringing the average over the life of the deal to below $6M.

    Deion's camp didn't counter-offer because tearing up that year was non-negotiable to them, and NE had made it clear that wasn't going to happen.

    So if you wanted NE to do that, and have every single player on his rookie contract have a precedent to site when they want the same treatment, then yes they should have just re-signed Branch.

    As for my personal feelings on Branch, he's gone so I don't really care. I have a negative view of him but don't want to bother thinking about him. He's gone, and other guys are here. Let's focus on them.
  20. TomBrady'sGoat

    TomBrady'sGoat Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2006
    Messages:
    1,769
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    Branch may fit better, but he's half the player Moss is. I'm still not sold on Moss in NE but let's not pretend to two compare as WRs. If Moss behaves and absorbs the system he can do things Deion Branch can only dream about.
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page

unset ($sidebar_block_show); ?>