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Dillon's 1600 yard season vs. Moss' 23 TD season

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by signbabybrady, Jul 9, 2008.

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Which was more fun/ better Moss' 23 TDs vs Dillon's 1600 yards

  1. Corey Dillon rushes for 1600+ a Patriot single season record

    16 vote(s)
    21.1%
  2. Randy Moss catches 23 TDs a NFL record

    60 vote(s)
    78.9%
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  1. signbabybrady

    signbabybrady Rookie

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    #24 Jersey

    Both players came in and some very special individual performances. Corey's 1600 yard season and Moss' 23 TD season. I ask that you don't consider the fact that Corey's patriots finished the deal as this poll is about their individual accomplishments.

    What was more fun for you to watch/ what do you think was better?
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2008
  2. hambone1818

    hambone1818 Rookie

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    Re: Dillon's 1600 yards vs Moss' 23 TD

    I really don't think there's a reason to compare the two, and I would never lessen Dillon's impact on that team. However, you're talking about a receiver setting an NFL record, turning a good offense into one of the most prolific attacks in history, turning an already great quarterback into a statistically dominant passer. Dillon was ground and pound, he was absolutely a joy to watch but there was never a sense of "Oh my god...I've never seen something like that before". And that's where there's no comparison: some of Moss' TD catches were highlight reel, best-of-all-time receptions. Even some of his regular receptions...remember the across the middle, one-handed, how-the-hell-did-he-do-that against the Colts?

    I will say this: Dillon absolutely carried the team in the 2nd half of some of those games...he was a one-man wrecking crew who kept opposing offensives off the field and bled the game clock. But Moss did what no one else could: he dominated the scoreboard...instead of having to bleed the clock, he simply caught touchdowns, basically saying "you ain't gonna outscore us".
  3. signbabybrady

    signbabybrady Rookie

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    #24 Jersey

    Re: Dillon's 1600 yards vs Moss' 23 TD

    That is kinda why I wanted to compare the two to see what was better the finess of Moss or the Smash mouth of Dillon. I chose Dillon becuase IMO Smash mouth runnning is more entertaining (maybe I should have used that word instead of better).
  4. patsox23

    patsox23 Rookie

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    Re: Dillon's 1600 yards vs Moss' 23 TD

    Wow. Is this even a question? LOL - who the Hell's voting for the Dillon thing? I mean, that was a great season and I'm sure I open myself up to "Well, Dillon's achievement led us to a Super Bowl win!" but that's a sort of weasely response since it's not really what we're talking about.

    Moss's contribution isn't JUST the 23 TDs, it's how he (along with others) transformed the offense, which became the most dynamic, prolific in the history of the universe. Corey Dillon's 1600 yards? Really?
  5. hambone1818

    hambone1818 Rookie

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    Re: Dillon's 1600 yards vs Moss' 23 TD

    To further fuel your argument, it was mentioned in the first post that we were to ignore the fact that Dillon's team won it all...this is merely a discussion of the players' impact to the team and the level of enjoyment/excitement that player created.

    I've already stated my argument so I won't say any more, just wanted to clarify.
  6. Fixit

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    Re: Dillon's 1600 yards vs. Moss' 23 TD

    I love me some Dillon, but come on.
  7. Crowpointer

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    Re: Dillon's 1600 yards vs. Moss' 23 TD

    This question just got Mossed :cool:
  8. hambone1818

    hambone1818 Rookie

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    Re: Dillon's 1600 yards vs. Moss' 23 TD

    Just adding a little something to the argument (yeah, I'm that bored):

    In 2004, the top-10 running backs averaged 1466.2 yards; Dillon ran for 1635, or 11.5% more than the average of the 10 best runners in the league. In addition, the top 10 in TD's that year ran for an average of 13.5, with Dillon garnering 12 TD's - or 8.9% less than the average.

    In 2007, the top 10 receivers averaged 1341.4 yards. Moss had 1493 yards, or 11.3% above average. And finally, the tiebreaker to end all tiebreakers: the top-10 receivers averaged 13.2 TD's last season; Randy Moss' 23 were far and away the most, 74.2% higher than the average of the ten best.
  9. signbabybrady

    signbabybrady Rookie

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    #24 Jersey

    Re: Dillon's 1600 yards vs. Moss' 23 TD

    touche....couldn't you have waited a little longer before offering up this data.


    I guess in my mind my love for smash mouth running out weighed how much more dominant Moss' season was.
  10. VJCPatriot

    VJCPatriot Rookie

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    Re: Dillon's 1600 yards vs. Moss' 23 TD

    Had to go with Moss. Record breaking, eye popping catches. I love a good running game too, but Dillon was no Barry Sanders. He was very workmanlike though.
  11. BadMoFo

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    Re: Dillon's 1600 yards vs. Moss' 23 TD

    As much as people are told to forget about the outcomes of each season, I don't think the four people who voted for Dillon did that. Actually, it's tough to do that. I don't blame them.
  12. hambone1818

    hambone1818 Rookie

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    Re: Dillon's 1600 yards vs. Moss' 23 TD

    haha...well the TD's were the obvious factor, and that's what everyone will remember Moss' 2007 season for. But I was actually a bit surprised to see the yardage numbers come out the way they did. Dillon was as impressive a runner that year as anyone in the league, and the Pats were a completely different team because of his contributions. I'm still keeping my vote and I don't think anything in the world would make me change it, but I can see the love for Dillon and the old-school, punch-him-in-the-face style he brought to the team that season.

    To play a little more devils advocate:), if we're being honest with these votes, then the postseason (not necessarily the wins and losses, just the individual contributions) needs to be considered, and Moss just didn't get it done: 94 yards on 7 receptions and just 1 TD the entire postseason. Meanwhile, you have Dillon with 292 postseason yards (4.5 YPC) and 2 TD...that team absolutely wouldn't have won it without him.
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2008
  13. signbabybrady

    signbabybrady Rookie

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    #24 Jersey

    Re: Dillon's 1600 yards vs. Moss' 23 TD

    Bringing in the Playoffs is dangerous to the premise of my thread here as it leads to the SB which I wanted left out. But Your point is well taken and It is why I selected Corey over Moss it wasn't just the numbers when You talk about Corey. The attitude he ran with and sheer will won some games for us. I am sure you all remember Corey's run vs the dolphins where he ran over like 5 people in the last 5 yards to take it in, it was the most physical run I ever saw live (only a hand full of runs compare too and they were from greats like Cambell and Brown).

    But You can say the same about Moss unstoppabilty having serious outcome on the score of the game and not just his 23 TDs. He opened tings up for everyone.
  14. Rob0729

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    Re: Dillon's 1600 yards vs. Moss' 23 TD

    Which was more fun to watch? Watching Moss catch a one handed catch on 40 yard bomb in the endzone or Dillon run through three defenders to pick up a crucial first down on 3rd and 1? Do you really have to ask?

    If you are talking about which is more fun to watch, a receiver making TDs is almost always more fun than a RB rushing. Add the fact that Moss made some amazing endzone catches, it doesn't make it remotely close.

    Even if you say which was more impressive, Moss still wins. Moss broke a record that has stood for two decades. Dillon didn't even finish first in rushing that year although if he didn't miss the Steelers' game he probably would have.
  15. signbabybrady

    signbabybrady Rookie

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    #24 Jersey

    Re: Dillon's 1600 yards vs. Moss' 23 TD

    apples to oranges. You compared a TD bomb to a rushing first down. How bout comparing a big catch for a TD to a big TD run from more than 5 yards away.

    You still may chose the catch but IMO the run is more fun to watch becuase it is a more physical play and contact is what I love.
  16. hambone1818

    hambone1818 Rookie

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    Re: Dillon's 1600 yards vs. Moss' 23 TD

    I know you said almost always, but I'd still say 'Barry Sanders'. I'd rather watch him lose 3 yards after going sideline to sideline than see an acrobatic TD catch. Granted, this discussion is Moss vs. Dillon--one of the most athletic, freak receivers ever vs. a north-south bruiser--but RB's can absolutely be far more entertaining than receivers, and more often that not I'd take the slashing, exciting RB over the great-hands, leaping receiver any day of the week.
  17. Rob0729

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    Re: Dillon's 1600 yards vs. Moss' 23 TD

    But the original premise is comparing apples to oranges. Why would I change the argument to compare apples to apples? They original poster wanted to compare Moss' TD catches to all of Dillon's runs, not just the 12 TDs Dillon got that season. So the original poster wants us to compare the Moss TD catches to Dillon's short yardage runs that may have been key, but not really exciting to watch.

    If you want to compare Moss' TDs in 2007 to Dillon's TDs in 2004, that is a different argument. I would still give it to Moss in a landslide since some of those TD catches were mindblowing.
  18. Rob0729

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    Re: Dillon's 1600 yards vs. Moss' 23 TD

    Some RBs can be far more entertaining, but Dillon was a smashmouth bruiser. He might have had some plays with some amazing stiff arms or running through defenders that he knocks them on their arses, but most of his runs were efficient, but not very flashy or remarkable. Not that the Pats were looking for anything else from him. Dillon was a workhorse back.
  19. signbabybrady

    signbabybrady Rookie

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    #24 Jersey

    Re: Dillon's 1600 yards vs. Moss' 23 TD

    I was the OP.

    And I was comparing a whole body of work to a whole body of work. Than You compared Moss TD Bomb catches to Dillons tough yardage first down runs. Than I countered saying it would be better to compare Moss good TD plays to Dillons good TD plays. In this argument (which I conceded may be a Moss win) I don't see any fault in comparing ones plays to the others but lets at least choose some that are on similar planes
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2008
  20. Rob0729

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    Re: Dillon's 1600 yards vs. Moss' 23 TD

    Sorry, I didn't realize that you were the OP. But my point was that you are comparing only Moss' TD catches to every run by Dillon. So I picked the extreme to prove my point that Moss was clearly more fun to watch.

    If you talked about comparing each player's entire season performance, I would still stick with Moss but it would be closer. Moss is a dynamic WR and Dillon is a workhorse back, when it comes to who is more fun to watch the dynamic WR will win every time in my book.
  21. KontradictioN

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    #24 Jersey

    Re: Dillon's 1600 yards vs. Moss' 23 TD

    I loved watching Dillon run over people time and time again, but it's no question: Randy's season was much more entertaining.
  22. signbabybrady

    signbabybrady Rookie

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    #24 Jersey

    Re: Dillon's 1600 yards vs. Moss' 23 TD

    I guess I needed to put the words season in there for everyone to know what I meant:D I went back and changed oopps
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2008
  23. Sicilian

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    I just voted for Dillon. I know we're not supposed to count the super bowl results, so I won't... but I WILL argue that having Clock-Killin' Corey Dillon at the end of games made me INFINITELY more comfortable with our late game closing abilities.

    Sometimes it's fun to sweat out a close game, but it was just amazing how calm I was for the entire 2004 season. I had no doubts in the playoffs that year. None. Even this year, being undefeated, I was nervous about games.

    Dillon took a team that was good in 2003 and made it unbeatable (when it mattered) in 2004. Again, I know we're not supposed to judge it based on the Super Bowl, but that's how we judged Tom Brady for YEARS. He was better than Manning because he won. Right now, Dillon was more fun for me than Moss because we won. End of story.
  24. Deus Irae

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    Moss broke an NFL record and helped the team to an undefeated regular season. Dillon broke a team record and fell more than 400 yards short of the NFL record. To me, it's no contest. Moss' season wins in a landslide.

    Now, asking about Moss' 23 tds vs. Brady's 50 tds makes things a lot harder to decide.
  25. memento

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    running backs in general are more amusing for me to watch, i can focus on them. they get the ball, what are they gonna do with it?

    of course you get that with moss, too, but not as much with dillon.

    great thing about dillon during that season was his cutbacks.

    by the time the recievers get the ball, i'm already happy. when the running back gets the ball, i have to wait a few seconds to see if ill be happy with the play or not. suspense.
  26. VJCPatriot

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    Umm isn't it more Maroney's fault that the Pats couldn't 'clock kill' to close out games rather than Moss' fault? After all Maroney did account for the majority of the Patriots' running game in 2008.
  27. dhamz

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    Of course week in week out the spectacular WR is more fun to watch than the RB.

    That said, nothing Randy Moss has done to date in a Pats uniform is even in the stadium with the enjoyment I had watching Corey Dillon in the second half of the divisional playoff game against the Colts.
  28. Rob0729

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    Re: Dillon's 1600 yards vs. Moss' 23 TD

    Ok, sorry to be so literal. It doesn't change my vote, but it makes it a bit closer.
  29. ctpatsfan77

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    In many cases it's that they just didn't bother trying. The results weren't too shabby when they did try:

    1-10/NE 13 (9:13) L.Maroney left end pushed ob at NE 25 for 12 yards (A.Cromartie).
    1-10/NE 25 (8:40) T.Brady sacked at NE 17 for -8 yards (sack split by I.Olshansky and S.Cooper).
    2-18/NE 17 (8:04) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short right to K.Faulk to NE 24 for 7 yards (D.Florence).
    3-11/NE 24 (7:16) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short right to K.Faulk to NE 35 for 11 yards (C.Hart).
    1-10/NE 35 (6:30) L.Maroney right end to NE 36 for 1 yard (C.Hart, R.Bingham).
    Timeout #2 by SD at 05:49.
    2-9/NE 36 (5:49) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short left to D.Stallworth pushed ob at NE 42 for 6 yards (E.Weddle).
    3-3/NE 42 (5:17) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short middle to K.Faulk to SD 44 for 14 yards (E.Weddle).
    1-10/SD 44 (4:28) L.Maroney left end to SD 42 for 2 yards (I.Olshansky, J.Williams).
    NE 39-Maroney 2nd consecutive 100-yard playoff game, 2nd career.
    2-8/SD 42 (3:43) L.Maroney right guard to SD 36 for 6 yards (J.Tucker, I.Olshansky).
    Timeout #3 by SD at 03:36.
    3-2/SD 36 (3:36) L.Maroney left tackle to SD 31 for 5 yards (S.Cooper).
    1-10/SD 31 (2:50) L.Maroney up the middle to SD 27 for 4 yards (M.Wilhelm, J.Williams).
    2-6/SD 27 (2:08) L.Maroney left tackle to SD 25 for 2 yards (S.Phillips, R.Bingham).
    Two-Minute Warning
    3-4/SD 25 (2:00) L.Maroney left tackle to SD 20 for 5 yards (Q.Jammer).
    1-10/SD 20 (1:15) T.Brady kneels to SD 21 for -1 yards.
    2-11/SD 21 :)39) T.Brady kneels to SD 22 for -1 yards.
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2008
  30. Patjew

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    #18 Jersey

    I think that was my favorite game that I attended of all time. The crowd chanting "Corey, Corey" gave me goosebumps. An awesome moment.
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