Did BB make a mistake bypassing Dunlap for Cunningham last year...

[Sfpat]

After seeing Cunningham all of last year, and this pre-season...

I will come right out and say it. YES, BB made a huge mistake passing Dunlap for Cunningham.

I watched most of the Bengals past two preseason games and never saw Dunlap on the field. What's the story?

 

[PatsFanStnfrd]

Nine games into the 2011-12 season, Cunningham has disappeared from the football field. Hard to remember the hopes some here pinned on this 2nd round draft pick. Now, Mike Reiss who speaks softly and chooses his words with care so as NOT to offend says:

"On Cunningham, I'm starting to wonder if he's just not very good. With Andre Carter playing that RDE spot, I don't expect to see much of him." (empahsis added)

That is a devastating verdict. One I hope can be reversed for the sake of the Pats.

Dunlap meanwhile is having a highly productive season. Maybe, BB should have trusted his ability to "mold" a player who had a reputation of having of-field issues.

 

[PatsFanStnfrd]

Never hurts to keep track of "prized" draft picks. We know Cunningham is now on injured reserve. Thought this Q & A with Jeff Howe speaks volumes about how big a disappointment Cunningham has been.

"What has happened to Jermaine Cunningham? Is he in Belichick's doghouse and why? He was counted on to improve in his second year, and there's been no sighting.
--Steve (Miami Lakes, Fla.)

That's a heck of a question, Steve, and to be honest, it's one of the greatest mysteries of the season. I thought he was their best edge-setter in run defense last season when he converted to outside linebacker, and it seemed like it would make sense for him to get a boost this season while getting back to defensive end in a four-man front, which is where he played at Florida. Yet there's been nothing, and Belichick has been quiet when faced with questions about Cunningham, which makes it sound like he's not overly happy with his progression this season.

Let's look at the depth chart, too. Andre Carter has been brilliant, and Rob Ninkovich has really come on this season, both as an outside linebacker and a defensive end in certain packages. Mark Anderson has been a pretty good pass rusher, and Brandon Deaderick showed a really good spark for a stretch midway through the season. Shaun Ellis has been a disappointment and seems to get a comparable amount of reps to Cunningham now.

I didn't expect Cunningham to emerge this season as a great pass rusher or anything, but I'm surprised he hasn't been used a little more on a rotational basis. Maybe it's that he just doesn't give them enough from a pass-rushing standpoint, and he can't separate himself from Deaderick and Ninkovich in those packages. Either way, it's certainly been one of the team's most disappointing storylines of the season."
Patriots Mailbag: DeSean Jackson, Dwayne Bowe Unlikely to Be Good Free-Agent Fits in New England - New England Patriots - NESN.com

Why is this relevant? Because BB chose Cunningham over Carlos Dunlap (whose performance is universally praised in Cincinnati). Did he do so because, Dunlap had a bad rap off the field or because Cunningham had superior technique. If the former, BB made a bad mistake. If the latter, it was a misjudgment.

 

[patsfaninpa]

Never hurts to keep track of "prized" draft picks. We know Cunningham is now on injured reserve. Thought this Q & A with Jeff Howe speaks volumes about how big a disappointment Cunningham has been.

"What has happened to Jermaine Cunningham? Is he in Belichick's doghouse and why? He was counted on to improve in his second year, and there's been no sighting.
--Steve (Miami Lakes, Fla.)

That's a heck of a question, Steve, and to be honest, it's one of the greatest mysteries of the season. I thought he was their best edge-setter in run defense last season when he converted to outside linebacker, and it seemed like it would make sense for him to get a boost this season while getting back to defensive end in a four-man front, which is where he played at Florida. Yet there's been nothing, and Belichick has been quiet when faced with questions about Cunningham, which makes it sound like he's not overly happy with his progression this season.

Let's look at the depth chart, too. Andre Carter has been brilliant, and Rob Ninkovich has really come on this season, both as an outside linebacker and a defensive end in certain packages. Mark Anderson has been a pretty good pass rusher, and Brandon Deaderick showed a really good spark for a stretch midway through the season. Shaun Ellis has been a disappointment and seems to get a comparable amount of reps to Cunningham now.

I didn't expect Cunningham to emerge this season as a great pass rusher or anything, but I'm surprised he hasn't been used a little more on a rotational basis. Maybe it's that he just doesn't give them enough from a pass-rushing standpoint, and he can't separate himself from Deaderick and Ninkovich in those packages. Either way, it's certainly been one of the team's most disappointing storylines of the season."
Patriots Mailbag: DeSean Jackson, Dwayne Bowe Unlikely to Be Good Free-Agent Fits in New England - New England Patriots - NESN.com

Why is this relevant? Because BB chose Cunningham over Carlos Dunlap (whose performance is universally praised in Cincinnati). Did he do so because, Dunlap had a bad rap off the field or because Cunningham had superior technique. If the former, BB made a bad mistake. If the latter, it was a misjudgment.

For the 800th time. It wasn't a bad rap. Do you know how to use google? He got a DUI on Tuesday morning before the biggest game of his college career on the upcoming Saturday. Undefeated and top ranked Florida was schedule to meet Alabama for the SEC Championship. Mr. Dunlap thought it might be a good idea to be out until 2-3 in the morning and get a DUI. And, get suspended. Quit bleeping sugarcoating it. It was a stupid mistake. And, it warrented taking him off of your draft board. You can say the Cunningham pick was a bad one. It certainly looks that way. But, quit comparing the two players.

 

[NinjaZX6R]

For the 800th time. It wasn't a bad rap. Do you know how to use google? He got a DUI on Tuesday morning before the biggest game of his college career on the upcoming Saturday. Undefeated and top ranked Florida was schedule to meet Alabama for the SEC Championship. Mr. Dunlap thought it might be a good idea to be out until 2-3 in the morning and get a DUI. And, get suspended. Quit bleeping sugarcoating it. It was a stupid mistake. And, it warrented taking him off of your draft board. You can say the Cunningham pick was a bad one. It certainly looks that way. But, quit comparing the two players.

Yep. Passed out wasted in the middle of an intersection on campus w. the car on drive. Priorities.

Also, Dunlap fit well in a 43 not in a 34. Not sure why people can't get that in their damn head.

 

[PatsFanStnfrd]

For the 800th time. It wasn't a bad rap. Do you know how to use google? He got a DUI on Tuesday morning before the biggest game of his college career on the upcoming Saturday. Undefeated and top ranked Florida was schedule to meet Alabama for the SEC Championship. Mr. Dunlap thought it might be a good idea to be out until 2-3 in the morning and get a DUI. And, get suspended. Quit bleeping sugarcoating it. It was a stupid mistake. And, it warrented taking him off of your draft board. You can say the Cunningham pick was a bad one. It certainly looks that way. But, quit comparing the two players.

So, let me get this right. Assuming the kid has football talent to be high on a draft board, you think one DUI is reason enough to completely take him off the board. You believe in a one-strike law. Wow! Look college football players are young kids. Some drink. We all know the temptations kids have. You have to assess the total circumstances. Did the kid learn? was he remorseful?

If you believed in your standard, you would not have taken Hernandez in 2010 or Mallett in 2011. And don't tell me that is OK because they fell to the fourth and third round respectively. Those picks are as nearly as precious as a second round pick.

More important, the Pats have a strong locker room. Draft the best talent. Then have confidence first in the coaching staff, and second, in the veterans like Wilfork, Mayo, Light, Brady to initiate and help the rookies. Other teams do it. The Ravens. The Steelers. The Cowboys.

When you talk of schemes, you are still talking of projection. BB relies on for the physical measurables of a player and his projections, which we know are fallible. Both Shawn Crable and Cunningham had the measurables -- yet one did not play and the other is an admitted disappointment. You don't allow that you could be wrong in your assumption that Dunlap could not play in the Pats scheme. Many experts felt otherwise deeming him to be a better "fit". Dunlap was the higher rated talent -- with Cunningham expected to fall to the 4th or 5th rounds.

Finally, ask yourself this question: Knowing what you know now, would BB have passed over Dunlap?

Bottomline, if you can get a top talent who is also a high character guy (like Andrew Luck) don't hesitate. But that may not always be possible. You may often have to take someone talented but flawed, with the confidence that you can coach them and your locker room can help to maintain a team-first attitude.

 

[NinjaZX6R]

Nice..Comparing marijuana use to driving drunk that puts the rest of the public at risk.

 

[patsfaninpa]

Nice..Comparing marijuana use to driving drunk that puts the rest of the public at risk.

Me thinks he didn't go to Stanford.

 

[patsfaninpa]

So, let me get this right. Assuming the kid has football talent to be high on a draft board, you think one DUI is reason enough to completely take him off the board. You believe in a one-strike law. Wow! Look college football players are young kids. Some drink. We all know the temptations kids have. You have to assess the total circumstances. Did the kid learn? was he remorseful?

If you believed in your standard, you would not have taken Hernandez in 2010 or Mallett in 2011. And don't tell me that is OK because they fell to the fourth and third round respectively. Those picks are as nearly as precious as a second round pick.

More important, the Pats have a strong locker room. Draft the best talent. Then have confidence first in the coaching staff, and second, in the veterans like Wilfork, Mayo, Light, Brady to initiate and help the rookies. Other teams do it. The Ravens. The Steelers. The Cowboys.

When you talk of schemes, you are still talking of projection. BB relies on for the physical measurables of a player and his projections, which we know are fallible. Both Shawn Crable and Cunningham had the measurables -- yet one did not play and the other is an admitted disappointment. You don't allow that you could be wrong in your assumption that Dunlap could not play in the Pats scheme. Many experts felt otherwise deeming him to be a better "fit". Dunlap was the higher rated talent -- with Cunningham expected to fall to the 4th or 5th rounds.

Finally, ask yourself this question: Knowing what you know now, would BB have passed over Dunlap?

Bottomline, if you can get a top talent who is also a high character guy (like Andrew Luck) don't hesitate. But that may not always be possible. You may often have to take someone talented but flawed, with the confidence that you can coach them and your locker room can help to maintain a team-first attitude.

No problem drafting someone who made a mistake. But, do you think someone who's only 21 is drunk at 2am on a Tuesday morning might have a bigger problem? Celebrating on a Sat night is one thing. His actions lead me to believe he had a problem. And, teams take players off of their boards because of problems. I have no problem not drafting Dunlap.

 

[State]

I'm not sure about the question, but it's obvious it was a mistake even drafting Cunningham.

The man's too slow. It's there for anyone to see. BB made a blunder drafting him that high.

 

[patsfaninpa]

I'm not sure about the question, but it's obvious it was a mistake even drafting Cunningham.

The man's too slow. It's there for anyone to see. BB made a blunder drafting him that high.

Everyone agrees Cunningham wasn't a good pick. It also wasn't a "prized" draft pick. He was a late 2nd. Where it's hit/miss. The debate though is whether BB should have picked Dunlap instead of Cunningham. I'm guessing Dunlap was not on the board because of character concerns.

 

[State]

The best value in the draft is in the rounds where Belichick has often not performed admirably, such as the third.

Hell, even the first round is hit or miss. Half the guys don't pan out.

I'm not sure who the Pats should have gone for instead of Cunningham. Prolly dreadlocks Dundie, but not sure.

 

[NinjaZX6R]

The best value in the draft is in the rounds where Belichick has often not performed admirably, such as the third.

Hell, even the first round is hit or miss. Half the guys don't pan out.

I'm not sure who the Pats should have gone for instead of Cunningham. Prolly dreadlocks Dundie, but not sure.

WUT?

01-Richard
02-Daniel Graham-
03-Ty Warren
04-Vince
05-Watson
06-Lo Mo aka DDR
07-Meri
08 May0
10-DMC
11-Solder.

Of those, only Meri and DDR are question marks. But even then they performed decent.

 

[State]

I was talkin third, not first.

First round--in general it's 50/50, but with the salary cap that can be very counterproductive when a team does a Vince Young.

 

[NinjaZX6R]

I was talkin third, not first.

First round--in general it's 50/50, but with the salary cap that can be very counterproductive when a team does a Vince Young.

I agree on 3rd rounds but 3rd rounds are where you take projected 2nd-3rd round picks who are projects.
As for the 1st round, our success rate has been really good. Only iffy picks are Meri and Lo Mo but they contributed well for 3 seasons.

 

[State]

Agreed. Let's keep it going.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

WUT?

01-Richard
02-Daniel Graham-
03-Ty Warren
04-Vince
05-Watson
06-Lo Mo aka DDR
07-Meri
08 May0
10-DMC
11-Solder.

Of those, only Meri and DDR are question marks. But even then they performed decent.

This is a pretty impressive list.

1 ROY, 3 All Pros, 6 Pro bowlers if you count Mankins. (maybe 7 one day, I think Solder is heading that way as well in the near future; health permitting)

For all the griping about BB the GM, his first round grade is A+++ in my book.

PS: We don;t need anybody posting his 3rd round draft classs over the years, that round is an F- for B.

PSS: I am all for trading our 1st 1st rounder and our 3rd in order to move up and draft Upshaw, depending on the combine results.

 

[Snake Eyes]

.

I'm not sure who the Pats should have gone for instead of Cunningham. Prolly dreadlocks Dundie, but not sure.

I wanted this guy

 

[Patriot Missile]

I wanted this guy

"With the 53rd pick in the 2010 nfl draft, the New England Patriots select University of Florida DE.............." as Mayoclinic is coming out of his chair ready to jump up and down and cheer like a 10 year old cheer leader. Rest is history, this coupled with the passing on Barwin twice has put Mayo in a straight jacket never to be seen again on this board.

 

[Snake Eyes]

"With the 53rd pick in the 2010 nfl draft, the New England Patriots select University of Florida DE.............." as Mayoclinic is coming out of his chair ready to jump up and down and cheer like a 10 year old cheer leader. Rest is history, this coupled with the passing on Barwin twice has put Mayo in a straight jacket never to be seen again on this board.

I'm a fan of MayoClinic, and I still long for Connor Barwin.