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Depite local news reports, Black Friday sales stunk!

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by PatriotsReign, Nov 29, 2010.

  1. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign On the Roster

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    ON all local news in New England, reporters were covering Black Friday like it was something vital to Americans (it's not). They reported the sales beginning Thanksgiving day as if people were waiting to hear how sales were going (we aren't).

    And WHAT they reported made it seem as if sales were "through the roof" (they weren't). The reality is that retailers discounted deeper than ever, opened their doors earlier than ever and advertised their sales more than ever.

    Wall Street has the early results of Black Friday sales at +.3%

    Yes, I said "Plus 3 tenths of one percent"...

    So, the reality is, sales were flat vs. last year.

    So, can anyone tell us why the news stations report as if they have a pre-determined interest in Black Friday sales?

    Aren't they supposed to just report what is happening and NOT what they WANT to happen? To me, it was as if they were trying to spur people to "get out and shop".

    And that is NOT ok!

    Black Friday Sales Rise Only Slightly

    "Black Friday sales in the U.S. rose only slightly from a year ago even though more shoppers visited stores, setting the stage for another uncertain holiday season for retailers.

    Sales increased 0.3% to $10.7 billion, according to ShopperTrak, which installs monitoring devices in stores to gauge traffic. Traffic rose 2.2%, ShopperTrak said."


    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB100...545086658.html?mod=rss_whats_news_us_business
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2010
  2. mcgraw_wv

    mcgraw_wv Rookie

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    I agree with your theme, however on the pure numbers, they also said general shopping in the month of November was up 6% from last year as many retailers cannibalized their black Friday sales by offering deep discounts starting a few weeks ago.
  3. reflexblue

    reflexblue PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #91 Jersey

    Why do you continue to post any bad economic news you can find? Do you hate America and WANT it to fail? There have been many times that there has been good news but you never start a thread on that.
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2010
  4. PatriotsReign

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    But discounting will only "Bring sales forward" mcgraw. Just because people began their holiday shopping earlier does not mean they'll spend more for the season.

    If all retailers discounted deeply in May, it would result in increased sales for May, but sales for June & July would fall.

    Discounts don't get people to spend MORE, they just change WHEN people spend. Especially during this, the deepest recession in our history. So, people won't spend more just because sales started ealier. And with significant increases in November sales, a decline in December sales is very likely.
  5. PatriotsReign

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    Hope you had a great holiday Flex!

    What I want in the end Flex is for Wall Street, our gov't and news stations to stop lying to us about the condition of our economy. I don't want people to spend money they don't have (is that anti-American?). I don't want any more "bubble economics" that give Americans the illusion of prosperity.

    It's ok for all of us to admit "times are very tough and it's going to stay this way for a while" because that is the truth.

    When times seemed good, all we heard about was how good the economy is. Now that times are bad, all we hear are lies about it's getting better. We are entitled to know the entire bleak picture and we should want to know.

    Or do you prefer to read & hear lies?

    Personally, I would prefer middle-class Americans don't spend their money unless they need to. Otherwise, we're just contributing more to "the Wealthiest Americans Club". So let's keep our hard-earned money Flex for our own benefit.

    P.S. There is NOTHING good happening economically Flex...There have not been times of good news like you wrote above. Europe is teetering upon collapse, yet Black Friday lies seemed more important to our local news stations. We're all adults and we should want the truth. Not only that, but we should be able to handle it as well.
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2010
  6. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    My observations are only anecdotal, but have you even been to an "Apple Store".. pretty amazing the crowds and how much stuff is leaving the store, and they are not buying adaptors..

    Another anecdotal observation in early November beloved and I went to an event in downtown Providence, got there early.. figured we would go to high scale for change.. this all occurred @ 5:00 PM, early in the evening.. we were dressed appropriately.. could not get into Capitol Grille, Ruth and Chris Steakhouse, Flemings Steak House and McCormick and Shiff.. they were all booked and had wait times of 90 minutes.. we then went off to the "Cuban Revolution" for a sandwich.

    An opposing view of your gloom and doom thread..

    Black Friday sales soar for eBay, others | Silicon Valley / San Jose Business Journal


  7. reflexblue

    reflexblue PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #91 Jersey

    HMM why should i believe you? And i want you to reply to me like your talking to an economist, and quikely. No cut and past.
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2010
  8. PatriotsReign

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    Of course some businesses can do well even during this recession. But unfortunately, the only thing that matters is how much people are spending in total.

    Regarding your night out in Providence, I went to the Capitol Grill 2 weeks ago without a reservation and had no problem getting a table. Didn't even have to wait 5 minutes. Maybe there was a conference or some event in Providence the week you went.

    Like I wrote, I don't "Want" gloom & doom. But I do want to read and hear the "Truth" from our news sources. I don't want or need them to try to help the economy by lying or slanting the truth. If "Doom & Gloom" are what's happening, then I want to read about it. Not some wished for fairy-tale of recovery.
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2010
  9. DarrylS

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    Perhaps there were coincidentally a lot of people out that night, and all of this is anecdotal, my point is when you are out it does not look that bad.. if you choose to seek out information that says it is bad you can find it. So I guess the other story should be completely discounted about how internet sales have increased significantly..

    The way people buy is changing, ask any UPS driver..
  10. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign On the Roster

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    If people spend more on internet purchases, then they're spending less in stores. In case you forgot, people have budgets.

    So, if our future is internet sales, then that's HORRIBLE for our economy. More internet sales means fewer jobs as it takes MUCH less to staff an internet sales company than a retail sales organization. It also means fewer retail stores and that means more commercial vacancies.

    You can't just look at an economic sector in a vacuum and say, "Hey, this channel of trade is doing well!". We always have to look the entire picture to gauge economic conditions.
  11. PatriotsReign

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    "YOU" want me to reply....oh really Flex?:p

    I am not a source of information. I got the Black Friday results from the Wall Street Journal. So you don't have to believe me at all.

    But what you can't deny is that Americans are in a deep debt and they aren't going to spend like idiots. People like you and I should be hoping we don't spend more than we can afford. We should be hoping people are buying with cash and not adding to the debt by using credit cards.

    That is what good Americans are hoping for Flex. A reasonable and responsible American middle-class. If I use a credit card, I pay it off each month. I no longer use credit or carry a balance. The more Americans that do that, the better off we'll all be.
  12. DarrylS

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    From where I sit, internet sales are the future of our economy.. take it or leave it. Their overhead is less.. and bottom line is better, isn't that how the business world rates success???

    The business world is changing before your eyes..

    Watch out for "Cyber Monday"...
  13. reflexblue

    reflexblue PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #91 Jersey

    when you first showed up here you said you were an Economist. I pm'd you, i said at one time i was working on a MA in economics and that i looked forward to talking economics with you. i concluded years ago that your a FRAUD. Happy Holidays
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2010
  14. PatriotsReign

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    Whether or not it's the future, time will tell. If it is, then they'll be a LOT fewer jobs in retail sales. If you want to cheer for that, by all means, be my guest.

    But since we're talking about "Black Friday" sales, it's not really relevant. By December 31, we'll know the final tally on holiday sales. We'll see then what the real trends are.

    All holiday consumer polls show people plan to spend no more this year than last year.
  15. PatriotsReign

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    "YOU" concluded "years ago" that I'm a fraud...very cute Flex!

    So far, all you've posted in this thread are unwarrented personal attacks upon the thread originator. What's up with you today Flex?

    If you were pursuing your masters in economics, why haven't you ever attempted to engage me in a discussion on economics?

    Why is it that you have failed to address a single point I've made in this thread?

    So, who's the fraud mon frere?
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2010
  16. reflexblue

    reflexblue PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #91 Jersey

    Because i became lazy and didn't care. So hit me with some economics, real economics, text book economic theory. It will jog my memory. Besides I Never claimed i was an Economist.
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2010
  17. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    No one is cheering for anything, 50 years ago Route 1 up and down the eastern seaboard was loaded with strip malls and mom and pop stores, there were a few Sears, Grant's and K Mart's, but not too many other "big" stores. Then the shopping plaza's came along, followed by the mega malls.. things change, there is not much anyone can do to really stop it..

    There are many contributing factors, but this is an offshoot of the internet.. whether it will be good or bad is difficult to discern at this time.
  18. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    #24 Jersey

    So, are you or are you not, an economist?

    And if so, why get your info from WSJ which is, as we all know, a highly biased source of "information?"
  19. mcgraw_wv

    mcgraw_wv Rookie

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    Overall, I think a good consumer correction is in Order. The "Keeping up with the Joneses" phenomenon that the baby boomer generation gave us is wrong, and unneeded as a society.

    So although it will be painful, have the consumers pull back, and not be so frivolous is a good thing.

    Slow consistent growth based on needs not wants is a good loan for this country, even though the pain during transition will be tough.
  20. The Brandon Five

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    #75 Jersey

    Yeah, stick to impartial arbiters like the New York Times.

    :p

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