Defense - SD vs NE

[Flying Fungi]

unbiased? i believe all of my comments have been objective and supported with factual data (not skewed statistics). apparently it's too much for some patriot fans to handle. you guys can't take it when someone dominates you on a forum. you start reverting to name calling and getting all red in the face. maybe if you just read my posts you'd learn something constructive and you wouldn't be sitting on sunday in tears when you realize that the charger defense is a lot better than you thought it would be.

2 points--and then I'm out--you're a passionate fan and I'm just not into arguing this one. As I've stated, any other week than the one in which SD plays NE, I like the Chargers--my avatar is proof enough--old school AFL.

1--I believe that you believe in your logic 100%--to a fault. Take that at face value.

2--You are getting a little defensive from trying to argue so hard. You will get a very large number of Patsfans that will agree that SD is a VERY GOOD TEAM and that this weekend will be a VERY TOUGH GAME. No legitmate poster will say that SD is less than VERY GOOD--but we like NE's chances. In fact, repeating recent seasonal trends, these may well be the best 2 teams in the NFL. We can all agree to being passionate fans of 2 excellent teams, and looking forward to fun weekend of NFL Playoff Football, hopefully with friends.

Hurry Up Sunday!

 

[VJCPatriot]

Dip****, I only took the points from the 4 healthy games that your defense played ALL season and compared them to the entire seasons worth of offensive scoring average of those 4 opponents. And came up with the +5.8. If you actually could comprehend anything you would have understood that when I clearly said "in the games that you guys cherry picked".

I then compared that +5.8 to the Patriots entire season stats which came out to a +1.1 in your favor and then I compared them to the Pats 8 road games and it was a +1.5 in our favor.

You can't be this stupid?

LoL. Don't bother my friend. You can cite the facts all you want but the Trolls are incapable of understanding. The only thing they want to hear is for people to proclaim their team as the best team of all time.

Trying to talk to trolls is like trying to talk to chimpanzees, except the chimps on average are smarter. :singing: LoL. Trolls = 0wned!

 

[mgcolby]

does football outsiders account for the chargers being at full strength? those stats are inflated with games like cinn where merriman and phillips were both out (phillips got hurt). the chargers that NE is playing on sunday isn't the same team as those stats you're boasting. this charger team is dominating compared to that team. there's a reason why the chargers had the #1 defense towards the start of the season (pre-injuries).

Phillips had a strip sack at the beginning of the 4th quarter.

So they scored 38 of there 41 while Phillips was playing.

I'm "owned" again!

 

[mgcolby]

LoL. Don't bother my friend. You can cite the facts all you want but the Trolls are incapable of understanding. The only thing they want to hear is for people to proclaim their team as the best team of all time.

Trying to talk to trolls is like trying to talk to chimpanzees, except the chimps on average are smarter. :singing: LoL. Trolls = 0wned!

Yeah, but WTF! You only live once.

 

[jcdavey]

Yeah, but WTF! You only live once.

here's a fact that you can't dispute

pats suck vs the afc west

i'll be back sunday night to see you all eating crow after we murder your dynasty and finish the job denver started last year

 

[mgcolby]

here's a fact that you can't dispute

pats suck vs the afc west

i'll be back sunday night to see you all eating crow after we murder your dynasty and finish the job denver started last year

Yup, because how they have played against the AFC west in years past will truly have a huge affect on Sunday's game. Obviously that will matter more than any stat associated with this year's teams previous in this thread.

Good Job.

 

[Patriotic Fervor]

Let's get back to discussing cold hard facts much as our troll friends would like to distract us from them.

Bottom line - Points allowed is one of the most telling stats in football. Let's see how those Chargers stack up.

0, 7, 16, 13, 19, 30, 24, 25, 41, 27, 14, 21, 20, 9, 17, 20

They allowed these points against the 27th strength of schedule in the NFL. Not exactly the cream of the crop there. let's breakdown their games.

0-9 points allowed 3 games, excellent performance
10-19 points allowed 5 games, good performance
20-29 points allowed 6 games, average performance
30+ points allowed 2 games, poor performance

So on the season this Chargers defense has allowed less than 20 points a game only 8 times, in other words 50% of the time. They have given up 20 or more points in a game 8 times, in other words 50% of the time. Of those 8 times they have allowed over THIRTY points twice. In other words the Chargers have the same chance (50/50) of showing up as either an excellent to good defense as they are of putting out a middling to poor defensive performance.

Humm somehow the Chargers' defensive performance doesn't seem all that intimidating now that we break down the numbers. And also when you consider that they were facing the 27th weakest schedule in the league. Well it makes you wonder...


Now to be fair let's break down the Pats defensive performances this season.

17, 17, 17, 13, 10, 6, 7, 27, 17, 0, 13, 21, 21, 7, 21, 23

0-9 points allowed 4 times, excellent performance
10-19 points allowed 7 times, good performance
20-29 points allowed 5 times, average performance
30+ points allowed 0 times, poor performance

The Patriots defense had excellent to good performances 11 times this season or 69% of the time. The Patriots defense only had middling or average performances 5 times this season or 31% of the time. The Patriots NEVER allowed over 30 points this season. AND all this while playing the 8th toughest schedule in the league.

What does this tell us? The Chargers defense will put out only an average to poor performance about 50% of the time. Whereas the Patriots defense will put out an excellent to good performance about 69% of the time. The other portion of the time the defense will at least be competitive and give an average performance. The Pats D have yet to put out a poor performance unlike the Chargers who have given up 30 or more points TWICE already.

These are the COLD HARD FACTS. Overall the Pats defense has played better and more CONSISTENTLY this season while facing a tougher strength of schedule than the Chargers defense. Case Closed. I hope we have all learned a little from this stat breakdown. :rocker:

Yes! The lesson is, if you want to be iron, you must face iron.

That, my San Diego friends, is the way it is. It's as simple as that.

 

[Patriotic Fervor]

Based on what? Three early season games against the Raiders, Titans and Chiefs?? You're making an argument based on nothing. That's what makes it not so simple to understand. That's fine if that's your BELIEF. You BELIEVE that your defense, when healthy, is the best in the NFL, but nothing proves that as it hasn't been healthy long enough to show that.

Just don't come on a rival team's board expecting rival fans to take your belief as fact, that's silly. Your cherry picked stats don't prove anything.

The fact is that both teams have good defenses. Depending on which side of the fence you stand, you're going to claim one or the other is better, and both sides will have stats to back up their claims.

Obviously, your offense has performed better than ours this season, but whether that will hold true this weekend still has yet to be seen. Stop getting all huffy when we won't accept that your team is the greatest ever BEFORE the game has even been played.

If you'd come here respectfully and had football conversations without all the trolling bluster, then you can be assured that if the Chargers win, when you came back you'd have been greeted with respectful congrats. But all this 'crowning them before they've won' crap is winning you nothing here.

Now, if the Bolts lose I'm sure we'll never hear from you again. And if they win, I'm sure you'll come back with your disrespectful posts until you end up banned. Can't you think of anything more productive to do with your time?

Oh, we'll never hear from them again after Sunday. That is a given.

While I have nothing against rah-rah spirit for you team, they've moved way past that. The have no respect because they don't know what it is. While a few make attempts at "intelligent" football-type discussions, most of them seem to be here on a 6th grade homework assignment about "How To Win Friends And Influence People", knowing they are going to fail the assignment. Quite really, they bring nothing of substance to the table, rather endeavoring to do their best rendition of 13-year-old girls telling everyone why the universe should revolve around them.

They are starting to bore me, but kinda like the massive train wreck that's about to happen and you know you really shouldn't watch, you just have the damnedest time not looking.

I think that's the nicest thing I can say about them.

 

[Patriotic Fervor]

fortunately for you, i can guarantee you that BB agrees with me. as much as you want to pound your chest like a gorilla, you're wrong.

Exactly what is it you maintain BB would agree with you about, viz-a-viz these posts?

This isn't the first post you replied to using this line. I think it's time for you to take your meds.

 

[Patriotic Fervor]

Pointing out that some of our losses were to teams with more losses does not change the fact that over all the Patriots schedule was a much tougher schedule than the Chargers. That is a fact.

We had the 8th toughest, you had the 16th toughest. We lost two additional games because we had a schedule twice as hard. Big whoop, all of that goes out the window this weekend.

In the playoffs the Pats are 1-0 and the Bolts are 0-0. Here we come.

Here's another take on their dismissing the relative strength of the schedules.

When the schedules first came out, and I saw the Pats were playing Denver in the 3rd week, my first thought was, "too bad that wasn't scheduled for week 10 or so".

If (ah, there's that word again) it had been scheduled in week 10 or so, I'd really have to say the Pats would have taken that game.

Conversely, had San Diego played the Broncos in the early-on (say, week 3!), I'd really have to wonder if San Diego beats them.

That's just how I view it. It obviously has no basis in reality, but I think it's interesting conjecture.

 

[richpjr]

This thread is pretty funny.

You have Charger trolls fighting Pat fans on a Pat forum, both trying to dazzle each other with stats. Neither side will ever convince the other that their stats are wrong and that the other defense could not possibly better than the teams!

The Charger fans should not overlook that the Pats do have a very, very good defense. Their defense is tough to run on. They play very tough in the redzone. They don't allow a lot of points. They have a great system that doesn't drop off much as they played through a ton of injuries. They have a great coaching staff and have played in a ton of big games before.

The Patriot fans should not overlook the Chargers defense either. With all their players back on the field, they are very tough to run on and have the best pass rush in the league. Their secondary is not nearly as bad as some are making it out to be (they only allow 0.6 yards per game more passing than the Patriots did). They have allowed more points than the Patriots have, but a midseason slump when the injuries mounted led to a few shootouts and skew the results. The points allowed is further skewed by other teams constantly trying to keep up with an offense that outscored the next closest team by 65 points. They also have an excellent defensive coordinator.

All of the above means nothing come Sunday. We can use the stats as a predictor of what could happen - but watching the Colts shut down the Chiefs running attack proves how useless that is. Each team is capable of doing some damage to the other team's offense. If the Chargers jump out to an early lead or shut down the run, it could be tough sledding for Brady if their defensive line and linebackers can pin back their ears and attack. If the Patriots slow down LT and though a bunch of different coverages at Rivers that lead to turnovers, it could be a tough day for the Chargers offense.

This game will probably come down to what almost every game does - controlling the line of scrimmage and turnovers.

Relax guys - it's just a game!

 

[abyzmul]

Yardage is irrelevant. POINTS ALLOWED is the only defensive stat that matters.

WRONG once again! the only stat that matters is your WIN-LOSS RECORD! GET A CLUE!! WELCOME TO MY SIG!

 

[abyzmul]

Yup, because how they have played against the AFC west in years past will truly have a huge affect on Sunday's game. Obviously that will matter more than any stat associated with this year's teams previous in this thread.

Good Job.

hypocrits unite! haha.. ZING!

 

[abyzmul]

so it's become apparent that patriot "fans" aren't able to comprehend something as simple as the charger defense being at full strength following a bye week. since that's too complex for you guys, i'm going to stop dominating you in this thread.

as i said before, it's a good thing for you that BB agrees with me. he's not nearly as clueless as you guys appear to be.. pulling up bogus skewed statistics that aren't reflective of the team that's playing on sunday.

if lt, gates, and rivers weren't playing on sunday would it be fair to use their offensive stats from the regular season to predict the final score? simply, no. but apparently you guys think the opposite since you're trying to use defensive stats from players who won't be playing on sunday.

time for you guys to grow up. leave this forum to the adults, you kids are getting embarrassed. DOMINATED! THAT's WHY YOU'RE IN MY SIG!

 

[patsfan13]

so it's become apparent that patriot "fans" aren't able to comprehend something as simple as the charger defense being at full strength following a bye week. since that's too complex for you guys, i'm going to stop dominating you in this thread.

as i said before, it's a good thing for you that BB agrees with me. he's not nearly as clueless as you guys appear to be.. pulling up bogus skewed statistics that aren't reflective of the team that's playing on sunday.

if lt, gates, and rivers weren't playing on sunday would it be fair to use their offensive stats from the regular season to predict the final score? simply, no. but apparently you guys think the opposite since you're trying to use defensive stats from players who won't be playing on sunday.

time for you guys to grow up. leave this forum to the adults, you kids are getting embarrassed. DOMINATED! THAT's WHY YOU'RE IN MY SIG!

No we just don't try to make excuses for our teams problems. We leave the whinging for losers.

 

[abyzmul]

No we just don't try to make excuses for our teams problems. We leave the whinging for losers.

what's whinging?

 

[patsfan13]

YTypo i was refering to your WHINING.

 

[Brownfan80]

so it's become apparent that patriot "fans" aren't able to comprehend something as simple as the charger defense being at full strength following a bye week. since that's too complex for you guys, i'm going to stop dominating you in this thread.

as i said before, it's a good thing for you that BB agrees with me. he's not nearly as clueless as you guys appear to be.. pulling up bogus skewed statistics that aren't reflective of the team that's playing on sunday.

if lt, gates, and rivers weren't playing on sunday would it be fair to use their offensive stats from the regular season to predict the final score? simply, no. but apparently you guys think the opposite since you're trying to use defensive stats from players who won't be playing on sunday.

time for you guys to grow up. leave this forum to the adults, you kids are getting embarrassed. DOMINATED! THAT's WHY YOU'RE IN MY SIG!

The fact that you're so obsessed with 'dominating' and 'winning' arguments simply shows me that you've probably never won anything or accomplished anything of true value in your daily life.

That's why you take your act on the road, where you know for sure that the opposing position will be the polar opposite of yours. Logic isn't logic in the realm of FANATIC, and you know that. Try to win a real debate, where emotion isn't what rules the day, and I'm sure you'd end up flat on your silly face.

As stated earlier, we can both find reasons to say why our defense is better, and different stats will support both claims. That you're trying to infer that you 'won' the argument as some sort of accomplishment is pathetic, as it's clear that both teams did better at certain things than the other, but that both are great.

Plenty of the Patriots fans in this thread have said as much. It's you that simply wants to toot your own horn and proclaim your team's greatness before the game has even been played.

Well, wise up, wise ass: You can now 'debate' all by yourself. I'm sure you're accustomed to it.

 

[Patriotic Fervor]

WRONG once again! the only stat that matters is your WIN-LOSS RECORD! GET A CLUE!! WELCOME TO MY SIG!

Won-loss is indeed the only TEAM statistic that matters, but when breaking it down, on the defensive side of the ball, points allowed is the most significant and important statistic. Defenses are built to prevent the opposition from scoring.

They are ½ the equation of a football team.

The offense, who's job it is to put the ball in the end zone, is the other half.

Now, when you put the two together, Voilà! - you have a * football team *, who's most important statistic is the won/loss record!

Now that we have given you the benefit of this free education, it's time for us to offer you this -

GET A CLUE!

 

[csfoster]

This thread is pretty funny.

You have Charger trolls fighting Pat fans on a Pat forum, both trying to dazzle each other with stats. Neither side will ever convince the other that their stats are wrong and that the other defense could not possibly better than the teams!

The Charger fans should not overlook that the Pats do have a very, very good defense. Their defense is tough to run on. They play very tough in the redzone. They don't allow a lot of points. They have a great system that doesn't drop off much as they played through a ton of injuries. They have a great coaching staff and have played in a ton of big games before.

The Patriot fans should not overlook the Chargers defense either. With all their players back on the field, they are very tough to run on and have the best pass rush in the league. Their secondary is not nearly as bad as some are making it out to be (they only allow 0.6 yards per game more passing than the Patriots did). They have allowed more points than the Patriots have, but a midseason slump when the injuries mounted led to a few shootouts and skew the results. The points allowed is further skewed by other teams constantly trying to keep up with an offense that outscored the next closest team by 65 points. They also have an excellent defensive coordinator.

All of the above means nothing come Sunday. We can use the stats as a predictor of what could happen - but watching the Colts shut down the Chiefs running attack proves how useless that is. Each team is capable of doing some damage to the other team's offense. If the Chargers jump out to an early lead or shut down the run, it could be tough sledding for Brady if their defensive line and linebackers can pin back their ears and attack. If the Patriots slow down LT and though a bunch of different coverages at Rivers that lead to turnovers, it could be a tough day for the Chargers offense.

This game will probably come down to what almost every game does - controlling the line of scrimmage and turnovers.

Relax guys - it's just a game!

Nothing left to be said!