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Dear AIG: I quit

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by Patriot_in_NY, Mar 25, 2009.

  1. Patriot_in_NY

    Patriot_in_NY Rookie

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    Just to be fair. Here's the other side of the coin.

    Since we now own this company and are by default, shareholders, I'd think it be in our best interest to see what's happening on the inside. We do, after all, want OUR company to succeed, right???????

    It's pretty easy to sh!t all over these guys, but this is a nice "other side of the fence" peek. I'd expect a pretty big hemorrhage of ANY talent left at AIG (or is it AIU now :rolleyes: ). Some will probably say good riddance, but not honoring one of the fundamental tenets of successful enterprise (legal and binding contracts), we might be doing more harm then good.

    Imagine if BB said to Brady "Look Tommy, the fans are annoyed that you failed to get out of the way of that block, so we're gonna have to knock about 7-8M off your pay for last year. Oh yeah, we're gonna tax the rest of it by 90%, okay? You cool with that?"

    Seriously, at it's base level, it's not much more complicated then that.
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2009
  2. Leave No Doubt

    Leave No Doubt PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    There was actually a Tour Bus that took people by the homes of AIG execs. People were demonstrating right outside their homes where there were likely kids there at the time (a Saturday IIRC).

    It's awful imo-out of control. Death threats,tour busses...stop the insanity already.

  3. ljuneau

    ljuneau Rookie

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    And here is the kicker, the bus was rented and the angry mob was paid by none other than ACORN.

    AIG ACORN bus tour mob touts socialist agenda… did they also violate Postal Code regulations?

    No 'Tea Party' in NY Times, But Room for Leftist 'Bus Tour' of AIG Homes

    Makes one wonder who is actually behind the protests.
  4. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Rookie

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    dude has every right to quit. I think we still live in a free country.

    The Tom Brady comparason is a bit of a stretch. Its more like a deckhand on the Titanic quitting after it hit the iceberg.

    This is starting to remind me of Enron as well. I feel bad for those who bought into the scam the execs were running, because the laws were rewritten to benefit them.

    "This whole thing SUCKS" - Rick Pitino
  5. BSR

    BSR Rookie

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    I don't blame him one bit. I wish Liddy would quit as well and let the politicians deal with their own grandstanding mess. There is no doubt that the old AIG execs screwed things up for themselves, but there is also no doubt that the politicians exacerbated the situation.
  6. Patriot_in_NY

    Patriot_in_NY Rookie

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    That shows your ignorance of the situation. :D

    These were legitimate, contractual retention pay-outs that were negotiated and satisfied in good faith by both parties. Any attempt to punish or EXTORT those that received money from binding and lawful contracts by elected officials is absolutely and completely WRONG. We don't have to like them, but like bad medicine, the shzit has to be swallowed.

    Had Treasury and the government done there due diligence BEFORE GIVING THEM BILLIONS in TARP money, they could have forced them to renegotiate these contracts as a condition to receiving any funds in the first place. That is perfectly acceptable. This bonus thing is completely the governments fault for not thinking the "bailout" through thoroughly.

    My Tom Brady analogy is DEAD ON. You can't go after him now and say "Gee, you only played 8 minutes last year, you don't deserve all that money we gave you, so were gonna try to recoup some of it".

    Cuomo is a disgrace for holding those guys hostage and extorting that money back. I got no love for AIG execs, but contracts are contracts.

    Besides, don't we own this fukcing company now, I'd think we'd want it to succeed. Part of that is not cajoling the head of apparently profitably division of the company to quit.
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2009
  7. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Rookie

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    EVERYONE knows that taxing these benefits is unconstitutional. These bonuses have not been forced back or taxed. The 90% will never pass the Senate, let alone stand up in a court. Sadly, the 90% tax was a grandstand by the democrats to force republicans to vote on a tax increase. They did.

    Tom Brady didn't quit the Patriots. Contracts in the NFL are not guarenteed, so drawing comparasons is truly odd. The Patriots are also not dragging down the entire NFL with their actions.....

    for a better referenceyou might wanna research Al Davis and Coach Shannahan....
  8. Patriot_in_NY

    Patriot_in_NY Rookie

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    Actually, they are being forced back. That is what Cuomo is attempting to do {read the link in my post}, He is essentially saying - give some or all of the bonus back or I release your names to the hounds.

    As for the NFL analogy, you are correct that the are not guaranteed in the sense that the future of them is dependent on performance, but they certainly ARE GUARANTEED in the sense for past performance. By that I mean, you can't retroactively take money away that has already been received because you are not happy with the results. Sure, you can cut them or deny them future money, but past money is spent, whether it be well spent or poorly spent.

    The AIG bonus is money that was already spent.

    However, your Al Davis analogy is pretty good too :D
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2009
  9. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Rookie

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    We will see how far Cuomo gets with this ... Threatening to make the names public might be the only legal thing one can do in this case. I think this guy is an idiot for quitting, if he has a contract stating he gets this money. Then to say he is giving it to charity makes me think this is bogus. If he is giving his money away....why is he being a litlle B!Tch?

    anytime we talk about failure, bringing Al Davis into the converation is never wrong. Ask any Raider fan.
  10. BSR

    BSR Rookie

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    I do have to question if you read the article. His whole point was that Liddy hung them out to dry and that they are in the crosshairs of public opinion for no good reason. I really would like to hear one good reason why these people deserve threats and disdain for collecting in a contract that they signed and executed in good faith..
  11. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Rookie

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    3rd paragraph:

    In response to this, I will now leave the company and donate my entire post-tax retention payment to those suffering from the global economic downturn. My intent is to keep none of the money myself.



    One good reason why people can do this and ARE doing it is because this is still a free country. People can get riled up, pi$$ed off and assemble. People do this outside of abortion clinics, and outside of the white house....its what makes our country great. However, if they become violent and cross the line...thats F-ed up.


    My man Stan Lee says:

    "With great power comes great responsibility"
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2009
  12. Bigdogx

    Bigdogx Rookie

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    Plain and simple AIG should of been left to fail, you know what would of happened, a stronger and more secure company would of replaced them!

    I don't think it is right to just strip bonus checks, but it also sure as hell is not right giving them out when the company is bankrupt and running on tax payer dollars!
  13. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Comment from M Steyn on this letter:

  14. PressCoverage

    PressCoverage Banned

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    The rescinding of the bonuses aside, did you just make an analogy that relates Brady's knee injury to global monetary malfeasance? One was a no-fault accident, the other a rather coordinated choice.

    For a guy who has "no love" for AIG executives, this thread sure seems sympathetic to the plight of multi-millionaires.
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2009
  15. Patriot_in_NY

    Patriot_in_NY Rookie

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    Only for the short sighted among us.

    I would have addressed the bonuses before we gave them umpteen-hundred billion dollars, not after. This guy headed a very profitable division of AIG, and reduced his salary to $1 like the boss did. He was, by all accounts, one of the bright spots in the company.

    since we now own this POS company, are you telling me, you are happy to see him go? Well as a fellow owner, I'm telling you............ you are full of shyte. It's people like him that we need to RUN OUR BUSINESS, not leave it.

    Or is the fact that we now own it and are now heavily invested in the company's success lost on you?
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2009
  16. PatsFanInVa

    PatsFanInVa PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Dude... "should HAVE been left to fail"; "You know what would HAVE happened."

    Your premise is wrong. Those owed the 2.6 trillion bucks outstanding from the AIG swaps would HAVE gone under as well, full stop. Right now our level of liquidity is like I dunno, a dry dessert that can only support lizards and cactuses. You let AIG go under, you're talking lunar surface lack of liquidity.

    PFnV
  17. PressCoverage

    PressCoverage Banned

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    Uh huh...

    anyhow, i think my post question was clear...

    did you equate Brady's injury with the actions of AIG executives? or just this guy?

    on a side note... i wonder, how did this guy's "letter" to his superior get out to the NYT?
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2009
  18. Patriot_in_NY

    Patriot_in_NY Rookie

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    Hahahaha, you already know the answer to that and just twisting it your way as is typical. Go back, read the analogy again, and then decide if this really is a legitimate question. Brady's injury isn't the subject, and neither is the actions of AIG exec's. But you already knew that, didn't you? ;)

    As for the leak, that's obvious............. the guy probably leaked it himself. I don't have a problem. He was making a statement. He has that right.

    Since your demanding I answer a question, can I?

    You said "uh huh" to that, right? Why on earth would you want a guy that ran a very profitable part of this company gone? He was by all accounts a solid business asset that had already agreed to taking $1 a year along with his retention bonus.

    We own this business now.
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2009
  19. Patriot_in_NY

    Patriot_in_NY Rookie

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    More good news.......

    Again, this is not about how you personally feel about AIG, it's employees, execs and the bonuses in general.

    It's about projecting a "political model" into what should be a "business model" in a company that we now own 80% of and are extraordinarily INVESTED in it's success and return to profitability.

    ..... and not for nothing, DeSantos was involved in commodities and equity, not the credit default swaps (which ultimately sunk AIG). Separate work, different outcomes (his division was profitable), and was only moved to financial products division to wind it down safely and in a controlled way that would blunt the losses already incurred. He was making $1 and was essentially working only for the retention in a job that was working himself out of (they were closing that division). The only incentive for him to stay in the first place was that bonus. Otherwise, he has no incentive to stay, and thus leaves the job to a less qualified person if he bolt's. It's not that difficult to understand.

    You guys are aware of what RETENTION bonuses are, correct? It seems some of you do not.
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2009
  20. PressCoverage

    PressCoverage Banned

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    Oh, it's quite legit.... You're leaning on affect, and completely ignoring cause in your little fantasy scenario. That's not my fault, that's your own.

    It was a piss poor analogy, just admit it. Going after bonuses of corrupt bank executives is not comparable to going after the salary of an injured athlete.

    I don't care how clean this guy "claims" to have been. They're an institution that has engaged in corrupt practices, and contributed to the ruin of western economies. Period.

    Considering you did an end-around on my real question? Sure, why not?

    Ironic that you mentioned something earlier about "twisting it your way."

    My "uh huh" wasn't in reference to your hypothetical, but I'm sure you knew that. Ah well.

    Anyhow, fine. I'll follow your contrived tangent. It's interesting that you're completely convinced this guy was "one of the good ones" on nothing more than his OWN letter to his superior that HE made public. I wonder how many millions he had already socked away up until his conscience "got the best of him" at the same time his private company is collapsing. The fact that he didn't keep his little ethical inner conflict private between himself and his boss suggests another motive altogether. But whatever... Something tells me this guy isn't suffering financially at all, even as his company topples and the life savings of thousands goes bye-bye. They ALL should resign.

    Just like every Bush League appointment should have been axed back in January. Start clean, remove the taint, teach those that follow an important lesson of NO MORE.

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