DE Will Smith Visiting Patriots April 1

[captain stone]

You're not being fair here. This team's #1 offseason need was CB, not DE or TE. Most of us assumed Talib would be back and didn't give it a lot of thought, but that was the must-have spot.

CB was a need because Talib signed elsewhere. DE & TE were - and are still - major needs because we had nobody whatsoever capable of sharing snaps with our overworked, exhausted DEs or of starting in place of our ever-injured TE with any degree of proficiency.

CB became the #1 need for about a week; DE & TE have been major needs for about a year.

 

[Deus Irae]

CB was a need because Talib signed elsewhere. DE & TE were - and are still - major needs because we had nobody whatsoever capable of sharing snaps with our overworked, exhausted DEs or of starting in place of our ever-injured TE with any degree of proficiency.

CB became the #1 need for about a week; DE & TE have been major needs for about a year.

CB was the #1 need the moment Talib's contract was up. The team has already got 2 starting DEs. It didn't have 2 starting CBs. You're elevating a sub into a higher position than a starter, when the 2 DE starters are serviceable or better. If you were to rank the offseason needs as last year (and its contracts) ended, it would look like this

CB
TE
IOL
LB
S
DE

You could haggle about IOL and LB, but the rest is pretty obviously a group that had bigger needs than that DE spot at the bottom. For that matter, I'm probably overrating the TE needs because of Gronk's recent health, and it should probably come after IOL and LB.

 

[Brady6]

I would rather sign Robert Ayers, Will Smith has not played since the 2012 season, and he will be 33 years old on opening day. He was on a decline prior to his knee injury and has not had more than 6.5 sacks in a season since 2009. If we were going to take a shot on a player coming off an injury I would go with Anthony Spencer over Smith and it is not even close.

I think we would be better off resigning Andre Carter than signing Smith.

 

[chasa]

I would rather sign Robert Ayers, Will Smith has not played since the 2012 season, and he will be 33 years old on opening day. He was on a decline prior to his knee injury and has not had more than 6.5 sacks in a season since 2009. If we were going to take a shot on a player coming off an injury I would go with Anthony Spencer over Smith and it is not even close.

I think we would be better off resigning Andre Carter than signing Smith.

the robert ayers that signed with the giants earlier this week?

 

[Ring 6]

Because Ayers is younger, healthier, had a career high in sacks last season, and can
"set the edge" better than Will Smith, who is old, broken-down, and washed-up.

All of this is of course a moot point since Bill allowed yet another UFA DE to slip through
his fingers, bringing the grand total of signings at our 2 biggest positions of need - DE &
TE - to a big, fat Zero.

Yeah, I'll stick with Ayers stinks. And to say Ayers sets the edge better than Smith is to say you have never watched either of them play.
Smith is a complete player, Ayers is a pass rusher who isn't really good at it.

Sure Smith missing a year with an injury is a potential concern but in 2012 he played better than Ayers could ever hope to.

Funny comment about positions where we have Gronk, Jones and Ninkovich being the biggest need.

 

[Brady6]

the robert ayers that signed with the giants earlier this week?

Apparently, I missed that, thank you for the information.

 

[Brady6]

Yeah, I'll stick with Ayers stinks. And to say Ayers sets the edge better than Smith is to say you have never watched either of them play.
Smith is a complete player, Ayers is a pass rusher who isn't really good at it.

Sure Smith missing a year with an injury is a potential concern but in 2012 he played better than Ayers could ever hope to.

Robert Ayers had 5.5 sacks, and was ninth against the run last season according to PFF (your favorite website, I know). I would not say he stinks and I would not say Smith played better than he could dream in 2012. Smith was a much better player in his career, I will say that, but at 33 and coming off a missed season/major injury, I am not sure that he is a better player than Ayers any longer.

Funny comment about positions where we have Gronk, Jones and Ninkovich being the biggest need.

I totally agree with you on this! We have the best TE in the world and one of the rising stars at DE in Jones but posters/fans view those positions as the biggest needs, it is odd.

 

[Ring 6]

Robert Ayers had 5.5 sacks, and was ninth against the run last season according to PFF (your favorite website, I know). I would not say he stinks and I would not say Smith played better than he could dream in 2012. Smith was a much better player in his career, I will say that, but at 33 and coming off a missed season/major injury, I am not sure that he is a better player than Ayers any longer.

Robert Ayers stinks. 5.5 sacks as a career best stinks. He is a terrible run defender and you could tell me PFF ranked him 1st or 1,344,333th and either would be entirley meaningless.
Smith was a better player in 2012 than Ayers ever has been or ever will be.
Its not even close.

I totally agree with you on this! We have the best TE in the world and one of the rising stars at DE in Jones but posters/fans view those positions as the biggest needs, it is odd.

Somehow the Patriots are supposed to have allpro backups at all positions or the world is going to end.

 

[Brady6]

Robert Ayers stinks. 5.5 sacks as a career best stinks. He is a terrible run defender and you could tell me PFF ranked him 1st or 1,344,333th and either would be entirley meaningless.
Smith was a better player in 2012 than Ayers ever has been or ever will be.
Its not even close.

He signed with the Giants anyway so it does not really matter. I am not against Smith, he has always been solid against the run and at least adds a veteran presence, I just question what he has left.

Somehow the Patriots are supposed to have allpro backups at all positions or the world is going to end.

Personally, I think there is too big of a focus on trying to rebuild the 2-TE offense of 2011. That ship has sailed with the Hernandez debacle and the team has considerable investments in Amendola, Edelman, LaFell, Dobson, and Boyce at the WR position now, the need for a 2-TE offense is not nearly as great. I am all for drafting a traditional TE who can block and give us something in the passing game, a player like C.J. Fiedorowicz in round three would be perfect. Those who want to go all in with a player like Jace Amaro at #29 I disagree with, you make an investment like that and you are going to be running with Gronkowski and Amaro 60-80% of the time, that is going to keep the players I mentioned earlier on the sidelines and limit their opportunities.

I think it would be best to draft C.J. Fiedorowicz, he will give us a blocking TE who can contribute in the passing game, but when they are looking to spread out, they should go with 3-4 WRs with a mix of Edelman, Amendola, LaFell, Dobson, and Boyce, along with Gronkowski and/or Vereen.

 

[crownontherocks]

Barely seven months removed from a torn ACL, veteran defensive end Will Smith has drawn interest from the Patriots. For now, the Pats are viewed as the leaders to sign him, eventually.

That could change over time, but Smith seems to be willing to take a one-year deal in the hopes of pursuing another championship that would bookend his Super Bowl ring from the 2009 season in New Orleans.

That same year, he had a career-high 13 sacks. Since then, he hasn’t had more than 6.5 sacks in any given year.

Still, if/when the knee is healed, he’s regarded as having some gas left in the tank. The Patriots could be the recipients of whatever Smith has left.

PFT

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Barely seven months removed from a torn ACL, veteran defensive end Will Smith has drawn interest from the Patriots. For now, the Pats are viewed as the leaders to sign him, eventually.

That could change over time, but Smith seems to be willing to take a one-year deal in the hopes of pursuing another championship that would bookend his Super Bowl ring from the 2009 season in New Orleans.

That same year, he had a career-high 13 sacks. Since then, he hasn’t had more than 6.5 sacks in any given year.

Still, if/when the knee is healed, he’s regarded as having some gas left in the tank. The Patriots could be the recipients of whatever Smith has left.

PFT

Pats remain the favorites to sign Will Smith, eventually | ProFootballTalk

 

[ausbacker]

Pats remain the favorites to sign Will Smith, eventually | ProFootballTalk

6.5 sacks is more than any of the Patriots depth guys are going to provide. Sacks are so overrated it isn't funny. It's a nice stat but I want to see pressures combined with numbers.

 

[50-yard-line]

Somehow the Patriots are supposed to have allpro backups at all positions or the world is going to end.

Not all pro, but I really don't want Nink and Jones playing 98% of the snaps. There's a burnout factor, as well as increasing the risk of injury. Particularly on the D-line, with today's hurry-up offenses, I prefer a rotation.

Having said that, you don't need all-pro's. Maybe the answer is right there with Armstead and Buchanon. Or with Collins or Hightower moving up to the line.

As for LB, we've got 1 really good one, another (Hightower) who I think will be really good if they can keep him where he belongs, and a 3rd in Collins who probably has a very high ceiling. In the NFL, 4-3 teams don't average 3 linebackers on the field per play anymore (unless you count the DE's as LBs). I think the Pats averaged something like 2.13 LBs per snap. So maybe the idea that we need quality depth there is a bit overrated, as well.

With TE, CJ or Niklas (3rd or 4th round?) would help a lot. A big TE who can block and make a few catches would be nice as Gronk works his way back in.
I hope they don't spend pick 29 on a TE. Trade back unless there's someone there they really love.

The truth is, this team could take the field as is and compete to the end. All we're talking about are depth additions.

 

[VJCPatriot]

Two words -- Noisy Cricket

Be afraid, be very afraid!

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

The CEO of one high tech company I worked for was named Will Smith. Dumpy older white guy with a mustache about 5' 7" tall. Told me stuff like this would happen to him. He's on a cruise ship and some black lady calls his room wanting to meet him. She wouldn't take no for an answer. Had to work hard to convince her he was not the MIB Will Smith.

 

[Sicilian]

The CEO of one high tech company I worked for was named Will Smith. Dumpy older white guy with a mustache about 5' 7" tall. Told me stuff like this would happen to him. He's on a cruise ship and some black lady calls his room wanting to meet him. She wouldn't take no for an answer. Had to work hard to convince her he was not the MIB Will Smith.

My dad has a similar story. He has a name very close to that of a television evangelist, and by sheer coincidence happened to stay in the same hotel room right after him. So he had phone calls coming to his room all night, people asking him to pray for their loved ones and such. I think eventually he just started telling them, "Will do, God bless..."

 

[TonyTucker]

Hey, at least it's not Gerry/Jerry Sandusky (Baltimore announcer dude).

 

[Deus Irae]

The CEO of one high tech company I worked for was named Will Smith. Dumpy older white guy with a mustache about 5' 7" tall. Told me stuff like this would happen to him. He's on a cruise ship and some black lady calls his room wanting to meet him. She wouldn't take no for an answer. Had to work hard to convince her he was not the MIB Will Smith.

That's a tall moustache.

 

[Ring 6]

Not all pro, but I really don't want Nink and Jones playing 98% of the snaps. There's a burnout factor, as well as increasing the risk of injury. Particularly on the D-line, with today's hurry-up offenses, I prefer a rotation.

Of course, but that doesnt mean you sign Jared Allen for 8 mill a year for that role. (Or Peppers or the other probowl caliber guys people are acting like we should have gone after)

Having said that, you don't need all-pro's. Maybe the answer is right there with Armstead and Buchanon. Or with Collins or Hightower moving up to the line.

I dont see any of those players other than Buchanan as DEs. Although Hightower is intriguing.

As for LB, we've got 1 really good one, another (Hightower) who I think will be really good if they can keep him where he belongs, and a 3rd in Collins who probably has a very high ceiling. In the NFL, 4-3 teams don't average 3 linebackers on the field per play anymore (unless you count the DE's as LBs). I think the Pats averaged something like 2.13 LBs per snap. So maybe the idea that we need quality depth there is a bit overrated, as well.

Oh, we need depth, but depth implies backup quality, not probowl quality, which was my point.

With TE, CJ or Niklas (3rd or 4th round?) would help a lot. A big TE who can block and make a few catches would be nice as Gronk works his way back in.
I hope they don't spend pick 29 on a TE. Trade back unless there's someone there they really love.

I consider a top level 2nd TE a luxury. If we can find one, we can implement a 2 TE base offense, if not, we do not need to have a 2TE base offense.
I do not agree that we need a Gronk 2.0 just in case Gronk gets hurt again.

The truth is, this team could take the field as is and compete to the end. All we're talking about are depth additions.

Agree 100%, although I could live with an upgrade along the interior OL, andat Safety.

 

[primetime]

Don't see anything wrong with bringing in Smith. Buchanan flashed ability but the Seahawks showed that you can never have enough quality depth at defensive end. The Patriots have two solid, entrenched starters at the position so all they really need is a combination of guys who can play maybe a quarter of all defensive snaps without a big drop-off in production.

That's why I thought people angling for a big splash at DE like Jared Allen were crazy, but someone like Smith or one of the other veteran defensive ends such as Jason Hunter or Adam Carriker who are still available are perfectly reasonable signings.

Safety and interior defensive and offensive line seem like the only places where you could reasonably expect an upgrade to the expected starter currently on the roster.