Danny Woodhead

[Bella*chick]

Re: Great SI Article on Danny Woodhead

Mangini drafted Woodhead out of Chaldron State. Nice tripbute to BB but it is a bit funny that Mangini was way ahead of BB with this one - BB only liked the kid after he played pre-season for Mangini. Nice try with the BB adoration!!!

Who gave Mangini his chance to make something of himself in the league?
:singing:

It all goes back to the Master.

 

[Palm Beach Pats Fan]

Re: Great SI Article on Danny Woodhead

Mangini drafted Woodhead out of Chaldron State. Nice tripbute to BB but it is a bit funny that Mangini was way ahead of BB with this one - BB only liked the kid after he played pre-season for Mangini. Nice try with the BB adoration!!!

No, he was UNDRAFTED. Mangini invited him to camp as an UDFA. Perhaps other teams did too, but he went to the most talent-bare situation, the Jets. I hope he didn't mind the smell too much.

Then the Jets decided to turn him into a wide receiver when he had been a running back his whole life. Stupid. Then they valued taller receivers and a bust draft pick (McKnight) over a guy who clearly beat the others out.

Belichick realized he was ideal 3rd down back when the Jets did not even try him in that role. The Browns with Mangenious & many other teams did not want him either, or they could have claimed him on waivers ahead of the Patriots.

This actually reminds me of the Welker situation, where the Dolphins gave him 3 starts in 3 years and thought of him only as a special teamer too small to be a legit WR. Bill saw him as the perfect slot receiver.

Give credit to the master...

 

[Coog548]

Re: Great SI Article on Danny Woodhead

Mangini drafted Woodhead out of Chaldron State. Nice tripbute to BB but it is a bit funny that Mangini was way ahead of BB with this one - BB only liked the kid after he played pre-season for Mangini. Nice try with the BB adoration!!!

Correction woodhead was undrafted. Did you watch that draft with a camera focused on him the while time

 

[patchick]

Re: Great SI Article on Danny Woodhead

This actually reminds me of the Welker situation, where the Dolphins gave him 3 starts in 3 years and thought of him only as a special teamer too small to be a legit WR. Bill saw him as the perfect slot receiver.

Give credit to the master...

To be fair, Welker had 67 catches his last season with the Dolphins! Belichick only picked him up after he had begun tearing up the league. The Dolphins were the ones who gave Welker a job after San Diego cut him, so they deserve the props for recognizing the raw potential.

Their mistake was in thinking $3 million/year was a ridiculous price for that kind of player.

 

[TheGodInAGreyHoodie]

Re: Great SI Article on Danny Woodhead

So it's easy to understand how he could let Woodhead slip from his grasp, even as he must have known it was a mistake.

While it might be fun to place the blame at Rex's feet. If you listen to what Ryan said at the end of training camp it was pretty clear, Rex would have rather kept Woodhead and cut McKnight, but was overruled by Tanny. Rex does not have full control of the roster like BB.

 

[Palm Beach Pats Fan]

Re: Great SI Article on Danny Woodhead

To be fair, Welker had 67 catches his last season with the Dolphins! Belichick only picked him up after he had begun tearing up the league. The Dolphins were the ones who gave Welker a job after San Diego cut him, so they deserve the props for recognizing the raw potential.

Their mistake was in thinking $3 million/year was a ridiculous price for that kind of player.

It's true that Wes piled up catches late in that year. I live in Dolphins country, and they viewed those 67 catches (wrongly) as an artifact of playing late in a lost season with the WRs ahead of him in the depth chart being injured. As I said, he started only 3 games in 3 years. He also had a fumbling problem (12 fumbles) that apparently the NE coaches helped him fix. Dolphins fans were fine with getting a 2nd rounder as compensation for losing him in free agency, then when the Pats stepped forward and gave them even MORE in a trade (7th rounder too) they were convinced that they were getting a great deal, since they viewed him as a special teamer too tiny to be an every down WR.

The similaity I saw with Woodhead is that Woody was being made a WR in New York, Welker was not used much in the slot in Miami, and BB saw each as a perfect fit for an every down role (in Welker's case) or at least a big role (Woody) that was quite a bit different from the role filled with the previous team.

We are lucky also to have an organization that will recognize a player for what he is and what he can do rather than where he was drafted. When teams hold onto drafted players like McKnight over better players like Woodhead, they avoid the inital criticism of having wasted the pick but actually double up on the mistake by forcing a second bad decision.

 

[patchick]

Re: Great SI Article on Danny Woodhead

The similaity I saw with Woodhead is that Woody was being made a WR in New York, Welker was not used much in the slot in Miami, and BB saw each as a perfect fit for an every down role (in Welker's case) or at least a big role (Woody) that was quite a bit different from the role filled with the previous team.

We are lucky also to have an organization that will recognize a player for what he is and what he can do rather than where he was drafted. When teams hold onto drafted players like McKnight over better players like Woodhead, they avoid the inital criticism of having wasted the pick but actually double up on the mistake by forcing a second bad decision.

I totally agree on this, and oddly, it all seems to come around to Leon Washington again. I picked out Washington earlier as the best physical comparison for Woodhead, it's odd that a team that used Washington so well wouldn't see him as a similar sort of player.

Everybody seemed to think the Seahawks got a steal by picking up Washington for just a 5th-round pick, but he's been a non-factor this year. Tannenbaum was apparently right to deal him...but then traded up to pick McKnight to take over his role. Committing to McKnight made the Leon Washington-type they already had expendable.

If you project Woodhead's numbers for the Patriots over a 16-game season, they compare favorably to Washington's very best years. (With the exception that he's making tackles on kickoffs, rather than returning them!)

ATT YDS AVG TD REC YDS AVG TD

Woodhead (projected)
106 568 5.4 5 45 534 11.9 2

Washington, 2008
76 448 5.9 6 47 355 7.6 2

 

[TheGodInAGreyHoodie]

Re: Great SI Article on Danny Woodhead

I don't know if this has been posted here already or not....but his is awesome....

YouTube - Thank You Rex and the Jets .... for Danny Woodhead!

 

[KoolAid]

Re: Great SI Article on Danny Woodhead

I really love this kid's attitude and his play on the field. And what he said about being a father was very wise and inspirational for someone who has never pro-created. It tells me that he was probably raised the right way and you can never have too many people like that around you in the locker room or life in general. I take his words there to heart because I want my boys to think of me the same way...as Dad first and foremost.

It is human nature to underestimate people of smaller stature in profesional sports. Yes, there are a handful of others who overcome the stigma and they are great, some of the best at their craft, but it is a very small percent of the some 1400+ NFL players active on gameday. And just watching the events of the NFL combine reinforces the weight that is put on "measurable". So, the Woodheads and Maurice Jones Drews of the world are not unprecedented, but I regard Woodhead and other smaller sized players as remarkable because they overcame that stigma with authority and I can use that as a teaching tool for my kids when they feel they are too short to play ball or lead others. And my kids can watch him with their own eyes and see that if a little guy like that can do it, then why can't I. He is a keeper for sure, and I wish him the best of luck! Bring on da Bears!

 

[Kasmir]

Re: Great SI Article on Danny Woodhead

While it might be fun to place the blame at Rex's feet. If you listen to what Ryan said at the end of training camp it was pretty clear, Rex would have rather kept Woodhead and cut McKnight, but was overruled by Tanny. Rex does not have full control of the roster like BB.

As I said, I have no doubt Ryan feared letting Woodhead go was a mistake. But as head coach, he hardly can escape from blame. Tannenbaum of course had the final say, but Ryan is critically involved in all important personnel decisions. He may have been uncomfortable with the decision, but not enough to contest it. More important, he failed to find a way to exploit Woodhead's considerable talents on the field, which should have made keeping Woodhead obvious.

The key with Belichick is not so much that he is great at college personnel evaluations: after all, the Patriots draft also passed on Welker and Woodhead and almost didn't draft Brady. There was necessarily lots of uncertainty about all three players coming out of college. What Belichick did was rapidly adjust his evaluations once he had NFL tape on them. The Dolphins didn't really know what they had with Welker. Sitting Bledsoe for Brady once Bledsoe was healthy was very controversial at the time. The Jets had no idea how to use Woodhead. Belichick should get credit for his ruthless disregard for reputation and pedigree, i.e. conventional NFL wisdom. He is constantly re-evaluating his players and your players. He'll drop a Kosar or a Bledsoe or a Milloy shockingly early -- and he'll trade for a Welker and feature a Benny or a Danny. He took Randy in when everyone thought he was done and let him go when everyone thought he was essential. He certainly doesn't care what the press and public thinks, and he only cares about what the competition thinks about personnel so that he can exploit the errors that they make. The guy is brilliantly iconoclastic.

 

[West Philly Patriot]

Re: Great SI Article on Danny Woodhead

As I said, I have no doubt Ryan feared letting Woodhead go was a mistake. But as head coach, he hardly can escape from blame. Tannenbaum of course had the final say, but Ryan is critically involved in all important personnel decisions. He may have been uncomfortable with the decision, but not enough to contest it. More important, he failed to find a way to exploit Woodhead's considerable talents on the field, which should have made keeping Woodhead obvious.

The key with Belichick is not so much that he is great at college personnel evaluations: after all, the Patriots draft also passed on Welker and Woodhead and almost didn't draft Brady. There was necessarily lots of uncertainty about all three players coming out of college. What Belichick did was rapidly adjust his evaluations once he had NFL tape on them. The Dolphins didn't really know what they had with Welker. Sitting Bledsoe for Brady once Bledsoe was healthy was very controversial at the time. The Jets had no idea how to use Woodhead. Belichick should get credit for his ruthless disregard for reputation and pedigree, i.e. conventional NFL wisdom. He is constantly re-evaluating his players and your players. He'll drop a Kosar or a Bledsoe or a Milloy shockingly early -- and he'll trade for a Welker and feature a Benny or a Danny. He took Randy in when everyone thought he was done and let him go when everyone thought he was essential. He certainly doesn't care what the press and public thinks, and he only cares about what the competition thinks about personnel so that he can exploit the errors that they make. The guy is brilliantly iconoclastic.

This my friend, is an excellent post!!

 

[TheGodInAGreyHoodie]

Re: Great SI Article on Danny Woodhead

As I said, I have no doubt Ryan feared letting Woodhead go was a mistake. But as head coach, he hardly can escape from blame. Tannenbaum of course had the final say, but Ryan is critically involved in all important personnel decisions. He may have been uncomfortable with the decision, but not enough to contest it.

Of course he contested it. He told the Jets press corp that he wanted to cut McKnight but was overruled so he will be staying on the 53 man roster but doesn't see him making game day roster anytime soon.

I really doubt he told the Jets press corp that unless there was a pretty ugly preceding argument with Tanny over the issue and Rex didn't get his way.

Rex has some flaws. An inability to be blunt with others and stand his ground is not one of his flaws.

 

[tasmlab]

Re: Great SI Article on Danny Woodhead

These kind of stories make you wonder how many other players never get the break they need. It's possible that Brady might never have gotten his chance if not for Bledsoe's bad luck and Belichick's wisdom. There's more luck in both success and failure than we like to acknowledge. So much hinges on so little sometimes. The ongoing Matt Cassell saga is another case in point: I can't imagine the scene where Pete Carroll told him he was going to start the (now) obviously vastly less talented Leinart over him, which nearly destroyed Cassell's career.

Or imagine if Danny *had* walked on to Nebraska: with his talent and Nebraska's 5 or 6 creampuff games a year Danny might have gotten his NCAA record 19+ 200+ yard games there -- and actually have been drafted in the fourth round or something

In the 2008 Arizona game, I loved when the announcer explained that Lienart was being payed more for just that game to sit on the bench than Cassel would make the entire year as starter for the Patriots. Unreal. And then Arizona was decimated, and then a few games later gets to play in the superbowl.

What a waste, it seems, of four years of NFL career for both Cassel and Leinart, since Cassel eventually got millions and is doing well and Leinart gets fired without ever playing much. Maybe Arizona should've taken Cassel from the start and saved themselves some money and frustration.

(this type of thinking undermines the value of the four year apprenticeship Cassel had with the greatest QB to ever walk the Earth)

 

[tasmlab]

Re: Great SI Article on Danny Woodhead

Woody would seem to be great if we ripped off that play from Cleveland where the lineman remain standing and the little guy hides during the snap. Although that's the type of play that someone could only pull about once every season or two as a surprise.

They could also make a human tunnel with Gronk, Volmer and some of the other tall guys and have Woodhead run through their legs, protected, as if in a giant spanking machine.

(OK, back to work)

 

[Palm Beach Pats Fan]

Re: Great SI Article on Danny Woodhead

Of course he contested it. He told the Jets press corp that he wanted to cut McKnight but was overruled so he will be staying on the 53 man roster but doesn't see him making game day roster anytime soon.

link?

I googled this and came up with zip, other than message boards saying that Ryan SHOULD have done that. I can't find any story written near the time we picked Woodhead up where Ryan actually says he wanted to keep Woodhead but was overruled. Jabba might say that now with 20-20 hindsight, but I would like to see evidence that he felt that way back then.


Here's all he said later:

"Do I regret cutting him? Yeah, absolutely, right now I do," the New York Jets' coach said. http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/jets/post/_/id/3211/rex-second-guesses-woodhead-decision

I see nothing saying he felt that way at the time.

 

[TheGodInAGreyHoodie]

Re: Great SI Article on Danny Woodhead

link?

I googled this and came up with zip, other than message boards saying that Ryan SHOULD have done that. I can't find any story written near the time we picked Woodhead up where Ryan actually says he wanted to keep Woodhead but was overruled. Jabba might say that now with 20-20 hindsight, but I would like to see evidence that he felt that way back then.


Here's all he said later:

"Do I regret cutting him? Yeah, absolutely, right now I do," the New York Jets' coach said. Rex second-guesses Woodhead decision - Jets Blog - ESPN New York

I see nothing saying he felt that way at the time.

I am not going to hunt for the link. And don't search on Woodhead. Let me clarify he never discussed Woodhead. He discussed the decision to keep McKnight. He wanted to cut McKnight. It is just a reasonable inference that he would have kept Woodhead if he had one less RB on the team and an available roster spot. But you can go to jets.com and watch the pressers there, I think it was the presser 1 day after the last pre-season game but I could be off by a day or two.

 

[Kasmir]

Re: Great SI Article on Danny Woodhead

I am not going to hunt for the link. And don't search on Woodhead. Let me clarify he never discussed Woodhead. He discussed the decision to keep McKnight. He wanted to cut McKnight. It is just a reasonable inference that he would have kept Woodhead if he had one less RB on the team and an available roster spot. But you can go to jets.com and watch the pressers there, I think it was the presser 1 day after the last pre-season game but I could be off by a day or two.

The Jets cutting Woodhead is a major embarrassment. Perhaps the most obvious difference between Ryan and Belichick is that Ryan is an attention hound and cares far too much about what the press says about him. For a head coach to talk to the press and even hint that it wasn't his fault that a particular player was kept or cut is bizarre to the point of being despicable. No wonder Revis was washing his hands of Monday night's debacle. Ryan's clown act will be seen as exactly that if he doesn't deliver.

 

[Palm Beach Pats Fan]

Re: Great SI Article on Danny Woodhead

He discussed the decision to keep McKnight. He wanted to cut McKnight.

I found where he blasted McKnight after a preseaon game and made it clear that McKnight had no chance to be on the active roster unless he improved, but also Ryan said he wouldn't cut him (just that he would not play)

Jets' Rex Ryan rips fumble-prone rookie RB Joe McKnight - The Huddle: Football News from the NFL - USATODAY.com

Rex Ryan turned his anger on rookie RB Joe McKnight Thursday night. The New York Jets coach ripped McKnight after the USC product lost a fumble for the third consecutive game in Thursday's preseason win at Philadelphia. Ryan said he's completely lost trust in McKnight. "Joe McKnight's got to hold on to the football,'' Ryan said, via the Newark Star-Ledger. "That was disappointing. Here's a guy that's on the bubble of making the active roster and I don't have confidence in him. I don't see how he can make the active roster. That's how I feel about it." Ryan clarified that he won't cut McKnight. "He's going to make the team," Ryan said. "But we're not going to play him until we have more confidence in him."

 

[TheGodInAGreyHoodie]

Re: Great SI Article on Danny Woodhead

The Jets cutting Woodhead is a major embarrassment. Perhaps the most obvious difference between Ryan and Belichick is that Ryan is an attention hound and cares far too much about what the press says about him. For a head coach to talk to the press and even hint that it wasn't his fault that a particular player was kept or cut is bizarre to the point of being despicable. No wonder Revis was washing his hands of Monday night's debacle. Ryan's clown act will be seen as exactly that if he doesn't deliver.

I agree with that. Totally unprofessional for him to tell the press that he opposed the decision of the GM to keep McKnight when he wanted to cut him.

But at the same token being he did tell the Jets press corp all that. It would be very disingenuous for me to call Rex Ryan and idiot for keeping McKnight over Woodhead.

Rex Ryan = unprofessional
Tanny = bonehead at deciding what running back to keep.

If you have seen some of the thread I have posted you know I have no problem berating Wrecks Crying. I am just gonna stick to doing it honestly.

 

[Kasmir]

Re: Great SI Article on Danny Woodhead

I agree with that. Totally unprofessional for him to tell the press that he opposed the decision of the GM to keep McKnight when he wanted to cut him.

But at the same token being he did tell the Jets press corp all that. It would be very disingenuous for me to call Rex Ryan and idiot for keeping McKnight over Woodhead.

Rex Ryan = unprofessional
Tanny = bonehead at deciding what running back to keep.

If you have seen some of the thread I have posted you know I have no problem berating Wrecks Crying. I am just gonna stick to doing it honestly.

Actually, if Ryan said what you said he said, that's far worse than making the mistake about Woodhead. Lots of folks made mistakes about Woodhead. It's instead to Belichick's credit that he again recognized a mistake of a competitor and exploited it. That's much more a positive about Belichick than a negative about Tannebaum -- who's a pretty damn good GM. But for a head coach to point fingers publicly at his GM to avoid embarrassment is unbelievably irresponsible as it undermines the whole organization. If players and assistant coaches read about the head coach dissing the GM, what does that tell them about how they should behave? Indeed, as much as I dislike Ryan's attention wh*ring, I don't believe he actually said what you said he said unless you can show a quote.