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Could this be the Pats most talented team ever?


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2007 was the sickest team in NFL History.

I don't even need to get into the offense b/c it's just that obvious, but also consider who they had on defense......

Vince Wilfork, Richard Seymour, Asante Samuel, Rodney Harrison, Tedy Bruschi, Mike Vrabel, Roosevelt Colvin, Junior Seau, and Adalius Thomas. I mean c'mon, that's almost unfair.
 
I don't see Rodney Harrison or Ty Law walkin' through that door.

Invaluable clutch playmakers.. clearly this question was raised by someone who doesn't remember 03-04.
 
Invaluable clutch playmakers.. clearly this question was raised by someone who doesn't remember 03-04.

Haha, let me rephrase I meant most talented Pats team, not team ever.

Actually I do and I didnt say the most talented secondary ever, if you read my first part you would have noticed I said our secondary was easily the weakest, but much improvements to the pass rush and front seven really help out the secondary. And there will never be a secondary like the old pats ones because they wouldnt work in todays game with the rules that are in place. Rodney would get flagged more than James Harrison.
 
Does Chung have enough to develop into a Rodney down the line?

Not sure if McCourty will ever become a Law clone tho.

Do think that with the new players on the D, and some coming back healthy this season, they should be better than a 31 ranked defense.

TC will be a battle and they look to have improved their depth at least.

Only real question will be how much of an upgrade will Fanene, Scott,Gregory, Carpenter and Allen be...We all know a tree would be an improvement over Ocho at WR....and how much can the rookies Hightower,Bequette,Jones and Wilson contibute this year.

How many more days until their first exhibition game? Aug 9th ?
 
We forget that we had the #4 BEST nfl defense in 2007.

I agree with others that the 2004 team was also one of the best teams ever. Better is a matter of choice. Some will say 2007 cannot ever be considered because it didn't win a Super Bowl.

These two teams were two of the best teams in the history of the nfl.
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The 2012 team does not project to be close. The running game (including 3rd down running) COULD be as good as these teams, but it really isn't likely.

Even if the 2012 offense is as good as 2007, do we really think that the defense is as good as 4th in the nfl that we had in 2007?????

2007 was the sickest team in NFL History.

I don't even need to get into the offense b/c it's just that obvious, but also consider who they had on defense......

Vince Wilfork, Richard Seymour, Asante Samuel, Rodney Harrison, Tedy Bruschi, Mike Vrabel, Roosevelt Colvin, Junior Seau, and Adalius Thomas. I mean c'mon, that's almost unfair.
 
2004 might be the most complete team in Patriots history. Aren't you setting the bar pretty high? The Pats had a top defense and a top offense that year with very little or no real holes.

I see a more likely scenario (assuming the Pats are the quality of a team that went to the Super Bowl in the past) being closer to 2003 or 2007 with the Pats being dominant on one side of the ball and good on the other. On paper the offense is stacked and the defense should be improved. I don't see this team being balanced on both sides of the ball though. This will should be a top 1-2 offense and a top 10 defense if everything hits right including McCourty rebounding, Dowling staying healthy, at least one of the rookies making a near immediate impact, Solder making the seamless intergration to LT, etc.
At this point it's still 2004 for me. 2013 will be a better time to make a comparative assessment.
 
O maybe...but D...hell no
 
Does Chung have enough to develop into a Rodney down the line?

Not sure if McCourty will ever become a Law clone tho.

Do think that with the new players on the D, and some coming back healthy this season, they should be better than a 31 ranked defense.

TC will be a battle and they look to have improved their depth at least.

Only real question will be how much of an upgrade will Fanene, Scott,Gregory, Carpenter and Allen be...We all know a tree would be an improvement over Ocho at WR....and how much can the rookies Hightower,Bequette,Jones and Wilson contibute this year.

How many more days until their first exhibition game? Aug 9th ?
For mine, despite the absolute need for him Chung is the single most overrated player on the Patriots roster. I keep hoping he'll turn into something more than what he is. That says a lot about the state of our DB's.
 
For mine, despite the absolute need for him Chung is the single most overrated player on the Patriots roster. I keep hoping he'll turn into something more than what he is. That says a lot about the state of our DB's.

I couldn't agree more on the current state of Chung, Aus. I wasn't quite as optimistic as some in regards to his return, but he certainly does add something with his quickness and ability to thump. His coverage skills basically suck, or at the very best are mediocre, but there is certainly the possibility that he can make another step forward there too.

As far as the DB's go, I think that we're going to see something a lot better this year. I'm high on the versatility angle, which will allow Belichick to have the option of switching things up if/when the time comes. I think that will go a long way.

Although Moore may not be quite what some make him out to be, I also believe that he is the kind of guy who offers a lot as far as finding the ball and attempting to make a play on it. It also helps that he can switch back and forth between secondary positions if needed. Should McCourty falter again at CB, we'll be seeing him in other areas, so they should be able to play more to his strengths in that regard.

Arrington did well in the slot, so I expect him to be there, barring injuries of course.

If Gregory or Wilson are not cutting it as one of the quicker, roaming safeties, then we'll see a change there too; there seem to be a lot more options this year, as long as the majority can stay healthy of course.

Allen and even possibly Dennard may end up showing us something too.

If we can luck out in the injury dept, it could be a much more talented and deeper unit altogether.
 
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O maybe...but D...hell no

Great point, but with the ability to put more pts on the board coupled with the ability to shave a couple/few off of last yr's average on defense, this 2012 team could have a greater margin of leads; thus equaling the spread for most of the 2007 games.

Scoring 30+ and holding teams to 20 or so is fine with me, as long as they are winning. That gives us the ability to win many games by double digit scores, which is pretty impressive most of the time.

To answer the question you are right though, defensively the team is not as good as 2007, although they may not need to be.
 
I couldn't agree more on the current state of Chung, Aus. I wasn't quite as optimistic as some in regards to his return, but he certainly does add something with his quickness and ability to thump. His coverage skills basically suck, or at the very best are mediocre, but there is certainly the possibility that he can make another step forward there too.

As far as the DB's go, I think that we're going to see something a lot better this year. I'm high on the versatility angle, which will allow Belichick to have the option of switching things up if/when the time comes. I think that will go a long way.

Although Moore may not be quite what some make him out to be, I also believe that he is the kind of guy who offers a lot as far as finding the ball and attempting to make a play on it. It also helps that he can switch back and forth between secondary positions if needed. Should McCourty falter again at CB, we'll be seeing him in other areas, so they should be able to play more to his strengths in that regard.

Arrington did well in the slot, so I expect him to be there, barring injuries of course.

If Gregory or Wilson are not cutting it as one of the quicker, roaming safeties, then we'll see a change there too; there seem to be a lot more options this year, as long as the majority can stay healthy of course.

Allen and even possibly Dennard may end up showing us something too.

If we can luck out in the injury dept, it could be a much more talented and deeper unit altogether.
I agree with you supa. The problem I've had with Chung is his decision making and skill/speed execution. Unfortunately the two plays the define Chung right now are the Superbowl catch (which he should have been across quicker to help) and the Jets playoff audible. Both big plays, both negative outcomes for the Patriots. It's unfair to single him out, but until he shows an ability beyond mediocre, I won't be pumping his tires.

For the record, I sure hope you're on the money when it comes to the DB's. As much as I enjoy high scoring and offensive records I continually find myself drawn to the defensive side of the ball. What I'd do for the Patriots to rank top 5 in the important D stats.
 
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The 2001 team was one of the least talented Super Bowl winners ever. I rather have the least talented team and win it all, instead of the most talented team that loses the SB (see 2007).
 
only time will tell on that one but on paper they dont have Seymour Wilfork and Warren in there Prime on the DL or Dillion in the back field so i would say no they are not the most talented team ever
 
Outside of starting QB, there isn't a single position grouping that doesn't have multiple question marks.

I've got a good feeling on this team right now, but there's just way too much left to shake out before we start comparing this team to any other.
 
This team has lots of potential, but given the change in the game itself in 2006, the only team we could be trying to top is 2007.

Offense should diversify by using the backs in the passing game more, has riches at TE/WR as well. I think we'll be able to run about 5 more plays a game then last year, and finish about 5-7th all time in points scored per game.

Risks: OL cannot sustain as many injuries as last year.

Defense is stronger in and more athletic in the front 7 then last year easily. But we are not deep at NT/DT. BB is going to start toying with safety alignments (IE I feel SS's are going to be more of a package position) and 2 CB's, 3 CB/FS clones are going to be the base defense for most teams in a few years. Dowling could be a prototype. It's critical he works out.

For the worriers we were 15th in scoring and getting better in the 2nd half with a patch quilt of players. We should end up inside the top 10 in scoring allowed - partially helped by the offense sucking more clock.

Risks: Heaven forfend an injury to Wilfork.

Summary: The scoring a hair short of 2007. Defense more big play oriented then 2007. A 17-2 record, and a title.
 
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