Comparing Cutler, Cassel trades

[Deus Irae]

Two completely different sets of circumstances. New England took less than could have been gotten for Cassel, but it was still "enough". Denver got a great deal from Chicago and, as of now, it looks as if the Broncos will join with the Patriots as the major players for the draft's first 100 picks.

 

[PatsFanSince74]

You're missing what I'm trying to say or I'm not saying it well. The Bears did this to purely from their own business standpoint. They see it as a good business move because they can pocket some cash, appease the fans and give the appearance of moving forward. That doesn't mean that it is actually a good NFL business move. It's ownership acting like Ralph Wilson and just doing enough to maintain the franchise and still have a happy fan base. We may see more teams in pure survival mode given the economy and the CBA issue. Do you understand what I'm trying say?

Fine. There's a difference between saying that this was "a good business move" (which you said earlier) vs. saying that the Bears "see it as a good business move" (which you say above). Clearly the Bears thought it was a good business move or they wouldn't have made it. Kind of tautological. I'm just arguing that the simple fact that the Bears thought it was a good business move doesn't make it such. You haven't said anything that convinces me otherwise.

 

[PatsFanSince74]

Two completely different sets of circumstances. New England took less than could have been gotten for Cassel, but it was still "enough". Denver got a great deal from Chicago and, as of now, it looks as if the Broncos will join with the Patriots as the major players for the draft's first 100 picks.

Agree completely.

 

[tanked_as_usual]

Two completely different sets of circumstances. New England took less than could have been gotten for Cassel, but it was still "enough". Denver got a great deal from Chicago and, as of now, it looks as if the Broncos will join with the Patriots as the major players for the draft's first 100 picks.

correct.........

the bears overpaid...........but denver's roster is chock full of holes, and the one guy who kept them being a 3 win team last year is gone.......he was the only reason the broncos won 3 games while giving up 30 or more points

 

[Boston Jay]

Two completely different sets of circumstances. New England took less than could have been gotten for Cassel, but it was still "enough". Denver got a great deal from Chicago and, as of now, it looks as if the Broncos will join with the Patriots as the major players for the draft's first 100 picks.

Pretty much sums up my thoughts.

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

Uhhhh tanked

How exactly do you know this? Crystal ball, time machine?

Too much psychic hotline?

You might want to review FA activity and Denver. What's the connection between "holes to fill" and FA signings?

 

[tanked_as_usual]

Uhhhh tanked

How exactly do you know this? Crystal ball, time machine?

Too much psychic hotline?

You might want to review FA activity and Denver. What's the connection between "holes to fill" and FA signings?

uhhhhhhh.........uhhhhhh.............uhhhhhhhh

just looking at their current roster........doesn't take much to see that

the best thing is that they're young on offense.....as for the rest, their defense is brutally bad........and mike nolan ain't exactly known for turning defense around too fast, and this is the motliest crew hes had to work with yet......

 

[PatriotsDaily.com]

Big topic on Dennis and Callahan this morning. Apparently.

D&C Bash Belichick. Again

 

[rabthepat]

What we should have gotten.

 

[mtbykr]

Let’s not confuse Cutler and Cassel. Cutler was an established probowler and Cassel had a good year on a great team. I think Cassel has the ability to be better but all the reports from other teams scouting him don’t believe he was a ‘frachise qb’. He can become one, where those same teams consider Cutler a franchise qb. Just look at what happened: as soon as Cutler went on the market officially a couple nights ago they had half the NFL coming after him….that pats only had 1 offer on the table and then some other teams that were willing to trade if it was a 3 way in which they would get cutler. (tampa and Detroit wanted Cutler, not Cassel) There was never a #1 proposed in any, way, shape, or form without Cutler as part of the deal!

 

[JoeSixPat]

Two completely different sets of circumstances. New England took less than could have been gotten for Cassel, but it was still "enough". Denver got a great deal from Chicago and, as of now, it looks as if the Broncos will join with the Patriots as the major players for the draft's first 100 picks.

Yes - furthermore, Cutler is already signed to a 3 year very affordable deal (and rumors of an even longer term extension with the Bears). That alone makes him worth more in trade than a player for whom there's no guarantee the Chiefs will have for more than one season.

And while a dozen teams quickly and immediately expressed their interest in Cutler, at best one can say there were 3 teams "immediately" interested in Cassel (apparently some more immediate than others).

And if there were any further doubt that Cassel and Cutler have different values, the team that MOST wanted Cassel has enough questions (presumably about whether he'll be as good a QB without Moss and Welker as WRs) that they have yet to sign him to a long term deal, apparently willing to go with the existing franchise arrangement.

So should we be surprised that a player on one year contract, that teams still have questions about, didn't garner an offer of two first round picks and a third?

As much as some seem to like Peppers, would anyone recommend giving up two first rounders and a third for him on only a 1 year contract?

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

We both scored.

The Pats have the #34 pick obtained via trade for a guy that hadn't started since high school and who would have been cut by 90% of this board.

Just a nit. There was a widly responded Poll and it was 75% of this board who vehemently and stridently wanted Cassel cut.

Good post.

 

[TruthSeeker]

I wanted more for Cassel, but the circumstances dictated what was reasonable compensation. When you consider:

- Patriots had little to no interest in keeping Cassel on the books
- The salary cap hit at the start of free agency was preventing a number of free agent deals the Patriots were interested in pursueing
- The Patriots traded Cassel without a long-term contract agreed to

The third point is really decisive, IMO. How many franchised players have been traded without agreeing to a long-term contract? I don't follow it that closely, but I don't remember any. Kansas City assumed a lot of risk in making this trade; Cassel isn't worth 14.6 million and the #34 pick of the draft for a 1 year commitment. To say that the Patriots didn't get enough when you consider the risk that KC is taking is simply wrong. But to get Cassel to agree to a long-term contract was going to potentially take a lot of time that BB felt wasn't worth the risk. I agree with him.

So, I'm answering the question based on the circumstances, not based on some hypothetical trade value. Based on the circumstances, Patriots did fine and Denver got more than fair value. We'll see in 3 or 4 years if it really works out that way, but I fully expect it will.

 

[JoeSixPat]

I'm not sure what Cutler's actual final contract is over the next three years...

I know he's got a few roster bonuses that aren't guranteed until he reaches them - and I think I recall that his cap hit is less than $2 million this year.

So with that in mind, fans who think that the Patriots got jobbed with "just" a 2nd round pick might want to ask themselves who is worth more in terms of trade value

Player A - 1 year $15 million contract, counting $15 million on this year's cap, and only 1 decent year as a starter or

Player B - 3 year contract worth maybe $17 total with more starting experience and a Pro bowl under his belt.

 

[bagwell368]

We didn't get enough and the Bears finally getting a franchise QB is to me, worth the seemingly ridiculous amount of compensation.

You are wrong. Did you consider that one QB was franchised for a good deal more then he was worth, and the other guy is signed for 3 years? Did you forget that BB couldn't hold up the deal very long because the FA's were signing like crazy and we had no cap space? Considering the team he played for (great), and how totally crappy (80% of his passes over 20 yards looked like crap) - you are in dream land to claim that he is fully mature starter.

The same to the rest of you, it was a fine deal, and getting rid of an aging injured OLB and his cap space was also a wise move as this season will prove.

 

[PatsFanSince74]

Just a nit. There was a widly responded Poll and it was 75% of this board who vehemently and stridently wanted Cassel cut.

Good post.

I agree with you both on the "nit" and the quality of the post. The "Dump Cassel" era wasn't this Board's proudest moment...and it sure felt like 90% at the time...there were threads that just made you cringe if you knew anything about the game.

 

[OldNEPatsFan]

The Patriots coach conceded he did get interest from other teams in the minutes before the Chiefs deal was consummated. But by that point, he was not pulling out of the Kansas City trade to consider new scenarios

.

Belichick: Pats never got a first-round trade offer for Cassel - The Huddle - USATODAY.com



Sorry but if other teams called 30 seconds before he called back Pioli to agree to the deal he should have listened to the other teams offers. Yes people even Bill makes a mistake every once in a while.

 

[Boston Boxer]

Jesus...10 pages of crap. Look, Denver got two #1s because Cutler is a PRO BOWL QB and we got a 2nd rounder because Cassel had a very good year...plain and simple. We did not get ripped off, we got a 2nd rounder for a guy we drafted in the 7th round.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

.

Belichick: Pats never got a first-round trade offer for Cassel - The Huddle - USATODAY.com



Sorry but if other teams called 30 seconds before he called back Pioli to agree to the deal he should have listened to the other teams offers. Yes people even Bill makes a mistake every once in a while.

Way to quote out of context.

The Patriots coach conceded he did get interest from other teams in the minutes before the Chiefs deal was consummated. But by that point, he was not pulling out of the Kansas City trade to consider new scenarios.

"The bottom line is it was never really there, presented," Belichick said. "It was like, 'yeah, maybe this could happen,' but it was never presented like here's a firm offer."

 

[JMarr]

Are you kidding me?

Denver made out like bandits, given that Cutler's staying with the Broncos was no longer an option. McDaniels (or his owner and GM) just saved his job. As others have said, this trade may end up being a little Hershal Walker-esque for the Broncs and Bears.

And given all the circumstances, NE made a great trade for Cassel. Cassel will be an average QB at best playing for a team like KC.