Colts fans...back to earth now, time to pay your players

[fgssand]

Any of the above will be enough to send them heading for an early exit from next years playoffs.

They will get weaker, barring another outstanding draft......

 

[jczxohn1]

So--would you sign a Stokely if he became available?

Was looking at potential FA #3 slot receivers and wondered about Stokely. He was resigned in the summer of '05 and has had multiple injuries since. Out for most of '06 with Achilles partial tear and came back and had a shoulder injury (or vice versa). Has a good attitude and Stokely of '04 would be a no-brainer, IMO. If he tests out OK, I'd definitely make him a vet tender offer, maybe with some incentives. The one I'd really like to see us pick up, tho, is Welker, who is a FA.

 

[Double G]

I'm 100% with Gumby on this one; it's a bitter pill to swallow, but I am a realist and the fycking Colts are here to stay, so get used to it. They will find a way to get it done, bottom line is Manning has become far and away the best QB in the league, he takes what the defense gives him rather than forcing the ball in like he used to. He no longer worries about scoring touchdowns on every drive, has Adam to bang out FG's like he did vs the Ravens and in the Super Bowl. When has a Colts team ever played for FG's like they did in two of their four playoff games. When they needed to crank up the offense in the AFC Championship game, they did. Their offensive line is the best in the NFL, holding on every play or not.

As long as they have him, they are and will continue to be a threat, already installed as 6-1 favorites to repeat next year. It jerks a knot in my ***** to admit this, but it is what it is (where have I heard that before)...............

 

[BelichickFan]

We let Thorton, Peterson, and Washington go. Then we won a Super Bowl. June is none of those three.

Oooooh, big talk from a team that the refs hand delivered to Miami.

 

[Kdo5]

I'd laugh like crazy if they were struggling to sign just one of their draft picks by re signing Freeney.

Its cool to think that we are what? 27 million under the cap. And the Colts are what? 6 million under the cap?

 

[pats63]

If they go over the cap,what would happen The rules are rules,but Indy has been able to change the rules....Makes DB play like girlie men....It is going to be real interesting to see this coming season....Is there any player the pats might be interested in.....Rhodes,Harper or any OL I wonder if Indy will play that can play or just cream puffs....I am really happy how our PATS run our team......

 

[mgteich]

Yup. The colts are in cap he$$, will never be able to sign their key players, and never win anothe playoff game.

This post and thread are posted a hundred times each season, for the last several seasons. The fact is that the colts are almost as good as cap management as we are.

I'd laugh like crazy if they were struggling to sign just one of their draft picks by re signing Freeney.

Its cool to think that we are what? 27 million under the cap. And the Colts are what? 6 million under the cap?

 

[ATippett56]

As long as they have him, they are and will continue to be a threat, already installed as 6-1 favorites to repeat next year. It jerks a knot in my ***** to admit this, but it is what it is (where have I heard that before)...............

Keep dreaming! After the Colts lose half their starting defense to free agency even Manning won't be able to keep up with the debacle.

 

[SeanBruschi54]

Manning just freed up 8 million in money for next year i found out as an internet rumor.

 

[chunkypony]

Manning just freed up 8 million in money for next year i found out as an internet rumor.

I was just going to say something to the effect of:

"Dont you think Peyton will restructure his contract to let the team sign some of these guys back?"

Cmon guys. I know it is nice to laugh at the Colts misery, but to be honest, I think they are in better shape than we give them credit for.

 

[JoeinIndy]

I would honestly be SHOCKED if Peyton Manning didn't convert his $10M roster bonus into a signing bonus. That would free up $8M of cap room.

Let's be realistic... he'll still get his money and I don't think he has any past due bills waiting to get it right now. The Colts are in pretty decent shape to be competitive again next season. If you can trust anyone in sports in my experience, trust Vegas, who favors the Colts as of right now to make a run at a repeat.

 

[Jimke]

Rather than speculate about the Colts being able to re-sign their

players, worry about whether the Patriots are willing to spend their

27 million on re-signing their own players or signing a couple of good free

agents. Hope they don't spend 10-15 million on LTBE bonuses and carry the

money over into 2008.

 

[BradyManny]

The Colts likely aren't going anywhere anytime soon, but I don't see them improving.

They are going to fight to keep 1 of their 3 key FAs aboard, and they aren't going to be able to pick up any FA replacements. They are great at getting reinforcements through the draft - as good as we are - so they will get some contributors there. But all in all, I just don't see the Colts being as good as they were this year.

The team that worries me in the future is San Diego. They have as much cap space as we do, and every contirbuting player signed on for next season.

 

[AzPatsFan]

The Colts have a history of this. They do not pay LB's. Why would they give June big money now when they wouldn't with the better players I listed above?

Harper is a good player but if he has to go, so be it. Marlin Jackson can fill the role.

Yeah the Colts have three CBs. Cut one, you only need two...Right? (Chant Kumbaja ..Injuries happen to other guys.... Injuries happen to other guys...Injuries ha...)

BTW, Ryan congratulations.

The Colts won their Championship. I'm sure you are ecstatic. Isn't it fun?

 

[Water Boy]

The Colts likely aren't going anywhere anytime soon, but I don't see them improving.

They are going to fight to keep 1 of their 3 key FAs aboard, and they aren't going to be able to pick up any FA replacements. They are great at getting reinforcements through the draft - as good as we are - so they will get some contributors there. But all in all, I just don't see the Colts being as good as they were this year.

The team that worries me in the future is San Diego. They have as much cap space as we do, and every contirbuting player signed on for next season.

I agree. The Colts have been able to succeed by plugging no-names into their defense. They'll take a small step back next year, but they'll recover.

 

[Miguel]

Thought someone here, maybe Miguel,posted the Colts as $4.7 under or thereabouts last week, but someone over on Indy Star said today that Clayton now has them at just $2.5M under, which could mean they had some NLTBE's earned or incentives tied to the Superbowl.

It was indeed me that posted the link. That link said that its numbers were good as of 1/3/2007. What probably happened is that the Colts signed players to futures contracts and not players reaching incentives.

Just gets them through another year, but that is the Polian way. What he has to believe is the new CBA won't be voided in 2008 which many believe it will be, because if that happens his hands will be tied again via a new extension or restructure of Manning deal because the expiring CBA rules will raise their ugly head again.

If the new CBA is voided in 2008, IIRC, 2009 would be the last capped year and 2010 would be uncapped.

 

[Miguel]

How can the Colts pay their players??
1.) Convert PM's 10 million roster bonus into a signing bonus thereby saving $8.33 million on the cap. Cap savings - $8.33 million.
2.) Extend Tarik Glenn's contract by a year. Let's say that he ends up with a $2.5 million salary and a $2 million signing bonus. Savings - $1 million.
3.) Get Stokely to agree to lower his new money take from $2.6 million to $1.2 million with the opportunity to earn back the money with incentives.
Savings - $1.4 million. If he does not agree to the deal, release him for about the same amount of cap savings.
4.) Convert $2.5 million of Booger McFarland's $5.5 million salary into a signing bonus - Savings - $1.25 million.
5.) I have no clue what the Colts are going to do with Corey Simon but they could save $3.955 million on the cap by releasing him on 6/2. That 3.955 million is pretty close to what the Colts would need to sign their draft picks, pay for players 52,53 and have about $1.25 million in reserve.
6.) Convert $2 million of Robert Mathis' $3.9 million roster bonus into a signing bonus - Savings - $1.6 million.

Five simple moves that takes the Colts from $2.5 million under the cap to about $16 million under. There are other moves available to the Colts.

What will be the 2007 cap numbers for the Colts' free agents??
What will be the net cap hit?? Remember since the Colts already have more than 51 players for the 2007 season that the Rule of 51 applies. If the free agent’s cap number is among the 51-highest on the team, the base salary of the player whose cap number had been 51st-highest no longer counts against the cap. In most cases, then, the effect of signing a free agent will either be $285,000 or $360,000 less than his cap number for 2007.

Please note that it appears from
http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=558630
that Ricky Proehl and Matt Ulrich had phony LTBE incentives added to the contracts so the Colts' adjusted cap number is probably be higher than $109 million which can only help the Colts.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

It was indeed me that posted the link. That link said that its numbers were good as of 1/3/2007. What probably happened is that the Colts signed players to futures contracts and not players reaching incentives.

If the new CBA is voided in 2008, IIRC, 2009 would be the last capped year and 2010 would be uncapped.

Somehow I can't fathom Tom not having those incentive clauses in Peyton's deal though. Can you? And if the CBA is voided in 2008 they won't be able to redo Manning's deal in 2008 with all that prior amortization gumming up the works. And even with a new stadium coming on line, Irsay can't afford to play ball in an uncapped league. He has no other source of income beyond the Colts. And they remain with or without luxury boxes a small market team.

And even this year they will be competing for limited FA's and to retain their own players with almost half a league full of teams that have $20-30M+ in cap space BEFORE they even have to bother with restructures to free up more space that just push more money forward onto the ensuing years.

I know they aren't going in the cap crapper as some like to opine, but it could be tough sleding. And who's to say that now that Freeney has his ring he will even agree to play for the tag. He'd get more than twice that in bonus money on a long term deal in this flush market, so it's not out of the question that while Polian says I'll franchise him, Freeney's agent may say no can do.

 

[Miguel]

Somehow I can't fathom Tom not having those incentive clauses in Peyton's deal though. Can you?

We have already heard that Grossman got $500,000 from the Bears for getting to the Super Bowl. I would think that if Manning had a Super Bowl incentive we would have heard about it.

If you wish to believe that the reason that the Colts went from 4 million to 2.5 million from 1/3 to 2/4, go ahead. I believe that it is because they signed players to future contracts.

And if the CBA is voided in 2008 they won't be able to redo Manning's deal in 2008 with all that prior amortization gumming up the works.

Please explain why.

And even with a new stadium coming on line, Irsay can't afford to play ball in an uncapped league.

What odds will you give me that there will not be an uncapped year??

He has no other source of income beyond the Colts. And they remain with or without luxury boxes a small market team.

A small market team that just won the Super Bowl. Fans tend to buy Super Bowl apparel.

And even this year they will be competing for limited FA's and to retain their own players with almost half a league full of teams that have $20-30M+ in cap space BEFORE they even have to bother with restructures to free up more space that just push more money forward onto the ensuing years.
I know they aren't going in the cap crapper as some like to opine,

Bingo. Cap space is just one tool in building a Super Bowl team. Good coaching is one. Do the Colts have it?? Yes. Good talent is another. Do the Colts have it?? Good drafting acumen. Do the Colts have it??Yes. The ability to win close games and to perform well in the 2nd half of games. Do the Colts have it?? Yes. Do the Colts have a lot of cap space?? No. But some people like to focus on what they do not have as opposed to what they do have. It does not matter how much space you have. It matters more on you acquire with it. Talent makes plays, not cap space. Would all those who complain that the Pats are cheap be happier if the Pats have given Gabriel and Sullivan $2.5 million roster bonuses??I think not.

 

[everlong]

Polian was on Mike & Mike (espn radio) yesterday morning and he said Freeney is going no where. The team is going to start talking to him this week and will franchise him if need be. Frankly I've always been in the camp that he's vastly over-rated so I'm very happy to hear this. Everybody talks about the Jets or some other team offering up a poison pill contract to Samuel well here's hoping the Titans or some other team in that division do that with Freeney and that Pollian falls in love with a player that finally helped get him over the top or that they eat the franchise tag.

The Colts of 2006 were not as good as the Colts of 2005 or 2004, it's just that the Patriots of 2006 weren't as good as the Patriots of 2004 or 2003. Both teams are going to have to reload and the Patriots have more draft choices and more salary cap to do so. I'm not saying the Colts are going to fall off the map as some would contend but I think everybody has to admit they are in a tough spot to maneuver.

If they don't re-tool teams like SD, Cincy and others are going to eventually figure out how to win with their talent.