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CNN Money Suggest Italy move away from Socialism

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by PatriotsReign, Sep 21, 2011.

  1. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign Rookie

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    And that's a good thing! Just ask Mr Italy, Real World!

    "While Italy isn't as bad as Greece, it could very well fall into the same trap that has ensnared its Mediterranean neighbor. To avoid this outcome, Italy needs to make real structural changes to its economy, starting with reformation of its labor laws, which makes it very difficult to hire and fire workers.

    The country could also boost growth by reducing public ownership in some of its largest corporations to encourage foreign direct investment. Italy would also be wise to steer its economy away from manufacturing and toward services. This structural shift, which the U.S. undertook painfully 30 years ago, should include higher spending on technology and other 21st century economic growth engines."


    Italy's best hope after downgrade - Sep. 20, 2011
  2. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    In the 1990s, when I lived in the Sweden, Sweden faced an economic crisis. The American right-wing gleefully predicted the collapse of the social welfare state and used Sweden as an example of why socialism failed. They were wrong.

    Sweden did make some changes (cut spending, sold some state industries, diversified, did more in the tech sector, etc.), but kept its social welfare state intact. As the economy improved, Sweden strengthened its social welfare state. It's economy, from what I can see, is doing better than ours these days, but faces risks.
  3. wistahpatsfan

    wistahpatsfan Rookie

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    Don't put a lot of stock in what Cyrus Sanati writes. He's a cub reporter forthe NYT financial section and seems to have a very light resume (eg; no Wiki entry and few hits on Google) but that doesn't mean he's wrong. What makes him wrong is that, in addition to austerity programs and reduction of government-owned industry, he's calling for more growth, which is a knee-jerk reaction many iinvesters are making right now. Of course he wants more growth! He's a Wall Street wonk! There are many reasons to believe that we are approaching our limit of economic growth in the developed world. Growth cannot be infinite.
  4. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign Rookie

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    I am neither "right wing" nor did I state that Italy's socialism would collapse. I merely posted this article from CNN Money.
  5. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign Rookie

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    Thank you Titus....oh, it's Wistah! You had me confused there for a bit.
  6. wistahpatsfan

    wistahpatsfan Rookie

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    Do you think economic growth is limitless? I don't. Especially since our fuel source is finite, expensive, filthy and primitive.
  7. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I didn't mean to suggest you are right-wing, which I know you're not, but you do see the idea of moving away from socialism as a good thing. (That doesn't make you right-wing, of course.)
  8. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    That system they have over there is priceless. MY cousin, who's in his 50's, has been laid off for 3 or 4 years now. Since it's Italy, he's been getting paid somewhere a long the lines of 80% of his pay. He told me he can collect for another 2-3 years before he has to find a job. The only reason he has to eventually find a job, is because he can't collect until he's into his pension year at 60. What a system. Why would you go back to work if you're getting 80% pay, for 6+ years, to stay home? Then people wonder why that system is on the verge of collapse.
  9. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    It sounds like your cousin is scamming the system or bs'ing you. (After all, you are right: why would anyone work if benefits were so generous.) The Wikipedia article states that unemployment insurance is guaranteed by their constitution, so if your cousin isn't bs'ing you, I would guess he's claiming some sort of long-term disability or something like that, because in general Italy's unemployment system doesn't seem like anything remarkable:

    Unemployment benefits in Italy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    To obtain up to 40% of the previous wages (for a maximum of around 1000 € monthly in 2007) for up to seven months, a worker must have been previously employed and enrolled for the insurance, and depositing contributions for at least 52 weeks in two years.
  10. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    It's much more complicated than googling for a link and posting some generic information from wiki. In Italy workers are contracted. It's an entirely different animal than here at home. In southern Italy, if you're a contracted employee (I think any employment beyond 6 months requires a contract), and are laid off, you collect for up to 5 or 6 years. I think you're only required to accept a job if it offers the same pay as your job prior. My cousin isn't "bs'ing" or "gaming the system". This is the system there. He got laid off a few years ago (two cousins from the same factory got laid off), and he can't find a job he says. The south, where I'm from, has massively high unemployment. Here in the states it used to be 27 weeks or something that you could collect. Now it's 3 years I think, if not 99 weeks.

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