Center Dan Koppen re-signed for 2 years

[Armchair Quarterback]

If somebody is claiming that the idea of Koppen having trouble against bull rushes is somehow new -- that's ludicrous. It's been said around here by many people who want to get rid of him, and agreed to by plenty who want to keep him even so.

Connolly frequently had Waters tap him on the arm so that he'd know when to hike the ball. So that's an advantage for Koppen, unless Connolly can overcome it in the off-season.

Koppen's lack of position flexibility is not a big issue, given that Connolly does have flexibility.

That wasn't the claim. Koppen's struggles with the bull rush were obvious.

 

[Armchair Quarterback]

Koppen just signed for 3 million a year. That's obviously starter money.

If Koppen was "declining" so much before he broke his leg, then why was he the starter for the opening game?

Just b/c Connelly was able to not draw too much attn to himself in a reserve role does not automatically make him the new starter now.

It's funny how one guy can come in and not mess up for a game or two, and that suddenly means that he's the odds on favorite to take out a 10 yr vet with experience, chemistry with Brady and the team, and leadership.

Picking our way through a mock first round of NFL draft - The Boston Globe "The Patriots were indeed prepared to move on without Dan Koppen at center, it’s just that he got next to no interest on the free agent market. It’s not just the leg injury Koppen is coming off, either. Koppen’s tape wasn’t great, according to two league sources. His play slipped in 2010, and he didn’t have a very good training camp. Center is Dan Connolly’s to lose."

Looks like the Patriots (or league sources) don't agree with your assessment either. (According to Greg Bedard)

Know what your talking about first before going on the attack next time.

 

[Ring 6]

Picking our way through a mock first round of NFL draft - The Boston Globe "The Patriots were indeed prepared to move on without Dan Koppen at center, it’s just that he got next to no interest on the free agent market. It’s not just the leg injury Koppen is coming off, either. Koppen’s tape wasn’t great, according to two league sources. His play slipped in 2010, and he didn’t have a very good training camp. Center is Dan Connolly’s to lose."

Looks like the Patriots don't agree with your assessment either.

Know what your talking about first before going on the attack next time.

OIn fairness, that is not coming from the Patriots, it is a reporters opinion of what the Patriots are thinking. There is a big difference.

 

[Armchair Quarterback]

OIn fairness, that is not coming from the Patriots, it is a reporters opinion of what the Patriots are thinking. There is a big difference.

"The Patriots were indeed prepared to move on without Dan Koppen at center, it’s just that he got next to no interest on the free agent market." That doesn't sound like an opinion but a statement of fact coming from a reporter assigned to cover the team. He's reporting on what the Pats were prepared to do and that Koppen received no interest on the open market.

But in the interest of not going back and forth on this for the next three hours, I'll edit my post to according to Greg Bedard.

 

[Ring 6]

"The Patriots were indeed prepared to move on without Dan Koppen at center, it’s just that he got next to no interest on the free agent market." That doesn't sound like an opinion but a statement of fact coming from a reporter assigned to cover the team. He's reporting on what the Pats were prepared to do and that Koppen received no interest on the open market.

But in the interest of not going back and forth on this for the next three hours, I'll edit my post to according to Greg Bedard.

Well that is the point though, its not coming from the team.
Sure it is a good point to raise to further your position, but to say it is proof the Patriots disagree is a huge stretch.

 

[Armchair Quarterback]

Well that is the point though, its not coming from the team.
Sure it is a good point to raise to further your position, but to say it is proof the Patriots disagree is a huge stretch.

And so it begins....

How is it a huge stretch for a reporter to report that "The Patriots were indeed prepared to move on without Dan Koppen at center, it’s just that he got next to no interest on the free agent market?

He's reporting on what they were prepared to do and how much interest Koppen received on the FA market.

I even edited it to say according to Greg Bedard and league sources.

 

[Ring 6]

And so it begins....

How is it a huge stretch for a reporter to report that "The Patriots were indeed prepared to move on without Dan Koppen at center, it’s just that he got next to no interest on the free agent market?

He's reporting on what they were prepared to do and how much interest Koppen received on the FA market.

I even edited it to say according to Greg Bedard and league sources.

Its not a stretch for the reporter to comment.
It is a stretch for you to say his comment is proof tha tthe Patriots agree with you and disagree with the poster who feels Koppen will start.

 

[Armchair Quarterback]

Its not a stretch for the reporter to comment.
It is a stretch for you to say his comment is proof tha tthe Patriots agree with you and disagree with the poster who feels Koppen will start.

The assumption is that Bedard had spoken to the Patriots or a knowledgeable source regarding the Koppen situation and that he wasn't simply pulling it out of thin air and it wasn't simply his opinion. He was speaking as to what the Patriots mindset and plans were.

It is highly unlikely that the Patriots would release a statement announcing that they were indeed prepared to move on without Dan Koppen at center, it’s just that he got next to no interest on the free agent market. In the absence of a press release from the Patriots regarding the situation, we'll have to rely on a person with knowledge of the situation, who Bedard presumably is.

He is reporting it as a fact, the only judgement you need to make is to whether or not Bedard is a trustworthy source, I happen to believe he is.

 

[Ring 6]

The assumption is that Bedard had spoken to the Patriots or a knowledgeable source regarding the Koppen situation and that he wasn't simply pulling it out of thin air and it wasn't simply his opinion. He was speaking as to what the Patriots mindset and plans were.

Note the highlighted word. That is why your argument that this is proof that the Patriots disagree with the other posters comment that he expect Koppen to start is inaccurate.

It is highly unlikely that the Patriots would release a statement announcing that they were indeed prepared to move on without Dan Koppen at center, it’s just that he got next to no interest on the free agent market. In the absence of a press release from the Patriots regarding the situation, we'll have to rely on a person with knowledge of the situation, who Bedard presumably is.

It is highly unlikely that the Patriots would share their feelings about a player the competition for a starting position and that 'a position is someones to lose' with a reporter.
We do not have to RELY on anyone. We can accept Bedards opinion as a piece of potential evidence. We cannot say accurately that if Bedard puts it in a column it is proof of the Patriots internal opinion.

He is reporting it as a fact, the only judgement you need to make is to whether or not Bedard is a trustworthy source, I happen to believe he is.

No he really isn't reporting it as a fact. He gives no source. He is drawing conclusion based upon the action on the player in FA and what other 'NFL source' said about his film.
If he said, "A high ranking Patriot official told me that they didn't care if Koppen came back, and they have handed the job to Connolly, so its his job to lose and Koppen will be his back up" then he would be reporting it as fact.

 

[Armchair Quarterback]

At 1.26 PM

I wrote:

But in the interest of not going back and forth on this for the next three hours, I'll edit my post to according to Greg Bedard.

Which I did.


Why are you still arguing this at 4.43?

 

[Ring 6]

At 1.26 PM

I wrote:

But in the interest of not going back and forth on this for the next three hours, I'll edit my post to according to Greg Bedard.

Which I did.


Why are you still arguing this at 4.43?

I don't know, why are you? All I am doing is responding to your comments, which seem to have been contradicting what you wrote here.

 

[supafly]

I don't even know why you'd bring it up again, besides the obvious choice of trying to start sh!t...

I agreed that Koppen would have to compete, just the same as anyone else did on the team.

My main point/debate against you was your ridiculous comments that "Koppen wouldn't make the team." I disagreed, and said you are entitled to your own opinion.

3 days later you now go back to my comment from the very beginning of the debate???

Didn't we move way past that?

As pointed out, you're quoting a speculation piece by a reporter's opinion anyway. Another viewpoint is that Connelly may be now freed up to move to the interior if/when needed, due to the situations with some of our offensive line. It could be speculated both ways.

 

[Armchair Quarterback]

I don't even know why you'd bring it up again, besides the obvious choice of trying to start sh!t...

I agreed that Koppen would have to compete, just the same as anyone else did on the team.

My main point/debate against you was your ridiculous comments that "Koppen wouldn't make the team." I disagreed, and said you are entitled to your own opinion.

3 days later you now go back to my comment from the very beginning of the debate???

Didn't we move way past that?

As pointed out, you're quoting a speculation piece by a reporter's opinion anyway. Another viewpoint is that Connelly may be now freed up to move to the interior if/when needed, due to the situations with some of our offensive line. It could be speculated both ways.

Except that "ridiculous comment" wasn't one I ever made, I never once said Koppen wouldn't make the team. I said he'd have to earn a spot.

 

[supafly]

Except that "ridiculous comment" wasn't one I ever made, I never once said Koppen wouldn't make the team. I said he'd have to earn a spot.

I really don't think it matters too much at this point, as it's been exhausted in many ways.

The debate was whether or not Koppen would be cut from the team, that's pretty much what we talked about.

Your opinion was that he may not make the team, while mine was (correctly or incorrectly) that he was pretty much a lock.

I believe that there are only 2 real options (without him becoming injured in TC, or something unforseen):

1. He backs up Connelly or possibly another reserve role, giving the team depth and a sense of preperation regarding the uncertainty of Light/Mankins etc

2. He goes back to center and allows Connelly to play guard, where he is likely better than Koppen

I'm just not seeing a too much reasoning in the possibility of a cut, as I think that they just would've moved on, personally. However that's just my personal opinion and I recognize your points too.

 

[jmt57]

The contract the Pats signed Koppen to is interesting; I figured the cap number would have been higher than it is.

Mac's Football Blog: Two-Years, $3.05M For Dan Koppen

Looking closer at Koppen deal - New England Patriots Blog - espnBoston

2012
Signing bonus -- $350,000
Base salary -- $850,000
Roster bonus -- $12,500 per game
Workout bonus -- $150,000
Salary cap charge -- $1.187 million

2013
Base salary -- $1.1 million
Roster bonus -- $12,500 per game
Workout bonus -- $200,000
Salary cap charge -- $1.487 million​

 

[Marqui]

That cap number is more in line to what I expected given that Koppen didn't seem to have any real in free agency.

 

[crowell33]

The contract the Pats signed Koppen to is interesting; I figured the cap number would have been higher than it is.

Mac's Football Blog: Two-Years, $3.05M For Dan Koppen

Looking closer at Koppen deal - New England Patriots Blog - espnBoston

2012
Signing bonus -- $350,000
Base salary -- $850,000
Roster bonus -- $12,500 per game
Workout bonus -- $150,000
Salary cap charge -- $1.187 million

2013
Base salary -- $1.1 million
Roster bonus -- $12,500 per game
Workout bonus -- $200,000
Salary cap charge -- $1.487 million​

Connolly signing bonus $3,250,000. Koppen signing bonus $350,000.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Like Bedard says, it's Connolly's job to lose even if he is tapped to fill in for Mankins for a bit. Koppen is here as insurance.

 

[Urgent]

That deal is significantly different than what was reported a week ago.
There were reports that it was two years $6mm.
A $1mm cap hit in year one is a totally different story.

This makes Koppen appear the clear back-up, at a very affordable rate.
There shouldn't be any downside to this deal.

Good for the Patriots.

This still creates the opportunity to trade a Wendell during the draft if there is an opportunity to get a late-round selection.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

That deal is significantly different than what was reported a week ago.
There were reports that it was two years $6mm.
A $1mm cap hit in year one is a totally different story.

This makes Koppen appear the clear back-up, at a very affordable rate.
There shouldn't be any downside to this deal.

Good for the Patriots.

This still creates the opportunity to trade a Wendell during the draft if there is an opportunity to get a late-round selection.

Those reports were agent spin and part of the problem with taking initial reports at face value. That said, the deal COULD be worth $6.6M if he remains on the roster for all two years... The cap hits WILL adjust if and when he earns his weekly roster bonuses, so it could end up costing $3.3M against the cap this season...although if it's looking that way they could always combine them and convert them to signing bonus to split the $2M cap hit into two $1M cap hits. Next season likely just exists for spin purposes and flexibility and in the event of a really dire post 2013 FA and draft emergency.