Cassel vs. other NEP QBs

[TheGodInAGreyHoodie]

The OP is comparing his stats to TB. I am simply demonstrating that his stats, upon further review are not great. Not even in the top half of the league. Can you argue against that?

Actually my point wasn't to compare MC to TB. My point was to compare MC to every other QB that has played for the NEP not named Tom Brady. And if you do that he comes out pretty decent.

I would rather have the Cassel than Eason or Grogan or Bledsoe or plenty of other QB that have started for my team.

MC's biggest problem is he followed Brady. In many ways the same problem Rodgers has over in GB.

 

[mgcolby]

The OP is comparing his stats to TB. I am simply demonstrating that his stats, upon further review are not great. Not even in the top half of the league. Can you argue against that?

He is comparing them in accordance with the stats at this point in their careers, as well as every other Pats QB. You are comparing him to the rest of the league, IMO it is two seperate comparisons.

In your context, no I cannot argue against your statement. But at the same time, I understand he will be up and down and given the circumstances he has played fairly well.

His reads need to improve, his accuracy needs to improve and his pocket presence needs to improve. The only way to do that is with experience.

 

[fumbrunner]

Actually my point wasn't to compare MC to TB. My point was to compare MC to every other QB that has played for the NEP not named Tom Brady. And if you do that he comes out pretty decent.

I would rather have the Cassel than Eason or Grogan or Bledsoe or plenty of other QB that have started for my team.

MC's biggest problem is he followed Brady. In many ways the same problem Rodgers has over in GB.

I suspect that if you compare him to the other NEP qbs based on the categories I provided, he would likely be middle of the pack. He is 7th in the league in pass completion percentage, but 22nd/23rd in som of those other key areas. Its relatively easy to have a high passing percentage when you continuously throw short balls, even on third and long.

Edit: Further to this, upon checking: Grogan avg per completion 7.5, Bledsoe 6.6, Eason 7.1. All close or above Cassel. No stats for passes for first downs. Also, Bledsoe had between 30 and 50 passes completed over 20 yards. At the current rate, Cassel would be around 25-30.

 

[TheGodInAGreyHoodie]

He is comparing them in accordance with the stats at this point in their careers, as well as every other QB. You are comparing him to the rest of the league, IMO it is two seperate comparisons.

Actually that is not correct, in each case I am comparing career stats as a Patriot. Some of those QBs had experience before they came some went and played elsewhere after they left. But the stats are total as a Pat.

 

[mgcolby]

Actually that is not correct, in each case I am comparing career stats as a Patriot. Some of those QBs had experience before they came some went and played elsewhere after they left. But the stats are total as a Pat.

Fair enough.

Edited: For anyone who read my previous response it is clear that I have a reading comprehension problem.....

 

[PatsFanSince74]

thanks for a litttle perspective. we can argue all day about "Passer Ratings," especially when we compare today to QB's who played in the days when the Secondary could mug receivers and rushers could decapitate QB's at will...

but you remind all of us that this guy isn't an incompetent. and you also remind us that he hasn't been playing with a running game, that he's been playing behind an O-line that seems to have been inhabited by Aliens since the SB and with a Defense that puts him behind the eight ball too often. sure he could get rid of the ball faster, but it's still his first five games...and yes, he did suck on first and goal...but this isn't all his fault...

 

[Lifer]

He has trouble with: throwing deep, intermediate and screens. Yet opposing defenses still allow him to complete a high percentage of short passes. Luckily every other team in the NFL are full of incompetent morons!

hmmm. exactly what was said about Brady in 2001. Hes just a dink and dunk passer.

 

[Patjew]

Well this certainly proves one thing: Joe Kapp sucked.

 

[Batman]

What is the average any player needs for it to be enough? 3.3(recurring for those who want to be pedantic) pass or rush every 3 plays you will get a first down on average.

What is Cassel's average? 6.4. Thats a first down on average every other passing play completed or not.

His average yard per completed pass is 9.9 which is almost enough to get a first down every time we are in sec and 9.

The problem is that the sack and running plays that loose the yards. They mean that we have further to go and less to do it and that mean the that 6.4 becomes a not enough. If we can reduce the sacks and get less runs for negative yardage we should be able to move the sticks.

 

[NYCPatsFan]

... You people are too determined to be the smartest pessimist in the room.

LOL! Made my day! Thanks!

 

[GuyClinch]

QB rating and percent completed are overrated statistics - that's the problem with the OP. People act like statistics mean something in an of themselves. They are instead supposed to reflect something about the game - they don't really in this case.

If their was a QB that only completed 20% of his passes but every single on of those passes completed was a touchdown he would be great. You could have a guy that completed 95% of his passes but if they are all for under a yard he would suck.

QB rating has similar failings. All you have to do is watch the games. Bledsoe was alot better then Cassell. So was Grogan - so was Flutie. Statistics need to pass the laugh test. Statistics that make Cassell better then Elway suck. Elway had completion percentages in the 50s.

Pete

 

[Ryan]

Like others have said, comparing Cassel's stats to QBs of the 60's, 70's and 80's isn't the best idea. The game, especially the passing game, has changed a lot since then. In terms of making a variety of throws, making good decisions on a consistent basis, and leading the Patriots to points, I can't say he's anywhere near as good as the two Patriots quarterbacks I've had the pleasure of watching during my time as Pats fan; Tom Brady and Drew Bledsoe.

Personally, I don't think Cassel has been horrendous, but he also hasn't been all that impressive. Some point to his good completion percentage, but he's been throwing short passes and failing to lead the Patriots to points on most drives. He's getting sacked a lot, and most of the time, it isn't the O-line's fault; it's his for holding on to the ball too long and not making a quick decision. He's also shown very little ability to throw the ball down the field.

Matt also has quite a few things going against him. Obviously the fact that he's an inexperienced backup is the #1 thing, but the lack of a consistent running game is also a big problem for him. You can't expect him to go out and throw constantly to win games. If the Patriots had a legitimate #1 running back right now, Cassel would be having a much easier time.

All in all, I think he's done a decent job so far, but he's going to need to start developing his downfield passing game very soon or the offense is going to continue to sputter. The defense also needs to step up and stop getting torched, putting Matt in the position where he has to pass so much to bring them back.

I'm hoping he has a big game against Denver. It could do wonders for his confidence and his comfort as starting QB.

 

[tombonneau]

Cassel has played well enough that had the defense shown up vs. Miami & SD the team could have won in spite of his play.

Unfortunately, in order to win in the playoffs, the team is eventually going to have to win BECAUSE of Cassel's play. Hopefully, by December this will be happening.

The expectations foisted upon a guy who will be making only his 5th start since high school continue to be mystifying.

 

[Sivy]

yea, when you only throw 5 yards, you % is gonna be high.

 

[Sivy]

Actually my point wasn't to compare MC to TB. My point was to compare MC to every other QB that has played for the NEP not named Tom Brady. And if you do that he comes out pretty decent.

I would rather have the Cassel than Eason or Grogan or Bledsoe or plenty of other QB that have started for my team.

MC's biggest problem is he followed Brady. In many ways the same problem Rodgers has over in GB.

Bledso now or when he was actually playing? Cuz if you're talking about whe he was playing, Id have to say you're crazy.

 

[mmasterkillah]

These stats show how valuable it is to WATCH and analyze football using your BRAIN.

Matt isn't entirely incapable of playing, he has all the physical tools that are necessary, but he panics in the pocket and makes everything overly difficult for himself. If he can learn to relax in the pocket and make his reads, he has a chance to succeed. As of now, I don't care what the stats say BECAUSE OF HOW MANY OPPORTUNITIES HE IS LEAVING ON THE FIELD.

To say you would rather have him over Eason, fine... over someone like Grogan... no way.

Many of the plays we have run have been called where coaches have basically dictated the #1 target. These screens and such have dramatically altered his stats. During last weeks game (in which Cassel played pretty miserably by all reasonable accounts) I remember seeing his statline during the game and saying "MISLEADING". Not only does he make mental errors, but we have little threat to do something called the forward pass at this point.

I think he can, and will improve throughout the season... but to use these statistics to say he has done well is just not accurate IMO.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

These stats show how valuable it is to WATCH and analyze football using your BRAIN.

Oddly enough, these stats were posted due to one or a dozen hyperactive 'disengage brain, activate tunnel vision' posters ranting non-stop about Cassel as if he played in a vacuum.
- Are the sack statistics a factor in why Matt "panics," or is his 'panic' solely a function of his mental state?
- Are there legitimate questions about the pass protection, or do we ascribe to the theory that all protection breakdowns are again solely a question of Cassel's 'indecisiveness?'
- When he does pull the ball down and run, is he "panicing" or is he just making the decision to take what little positive yardage appears available?

I believe a case can be made:
- that the O-line is not protecting to past year's standards.
- that teams do not fear the running game and are teeing off to rush the passer.
- that pressure up the middle is collapsing the pocket almost before Cassel has set up.
- that all of the above are factor's impacting Matt's confidence in the pocket and his "play" clock.
- that Tom "effing" Brady or Peyton "effing" Manning would be hard pressed to achieve much with the speed at which the pass protection is dissolving in Cassel's face.

None of this claims Cassel is flawless, but an inexperienced QB needs his team mates to step up their own play to minimize the individual burden he carries - I'm looking for others on the team to take that step and free Cassel up to execute his job with a little less pressure in his face.

 

[VJCPatriot]

I would be happy if Cassel could transform himself into Trent Dilfer. Just manage the game and keep the team in it to win. His YPA is 6.4. So it could be better but it's not the worst. Cassel has his work cut out for him against Denver. The Pats will need to score lots of points to keep up with Cutler. Is Cassel up to the challenge of a shootout?

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Is Cassel up to the challenge of a shootout?

Is the NE defense?

 

[VJCPatriot]

Is the NE defense?

Way to tip me over the the side of pessmism! LOL.