Carlos Dunlap vs Jermaine Cunningham

[captain stone]

This is just crap.

Wilhite, Samuel and Chung were healthy in college (as were BMW and DMC).

Wheatley redshirted a year but was healthy his other four.

Dowling was healthy his first three years before having injury issues his fourth year.

You're right about the first 5 DBs. Lil' Terry & Glas-IR, however, were damaged goods
before they finally - due to their fragility - played a snap in the NFL.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

Doesn't sound like a guy who is in the doghouse.

Meanwhile, Dunlap has 1 start and 0 sacks. We'd be complaining about him right now too, since he wouldn't be getting any playing time over Carter, Ellis, or Anderson either. Cunningham at least has his lost training camp and the scheme switch to blame.

Let's think this through a bit. The reason Cunningham is not playing because he missed TC and we changed schemes.

So he can't beat out a guy that is old as dirst in Carter and is totally gassed by midway through the second quarter and he can;t beat out Anderson, who has one pass rush move and once he uses it, he is cooked for the rest of the game.

How about this instead: The new scheme calls for the DE's to get upfield in a hurry and Cunningham is sllloowwwww as grass growing and with all the suddenness of a statue.
At least in the 3-4 Cunningham could say the lack of suddenness and speed was because he was required to read and react first.

 

[Sciz]

Let's think this through a bit. The reason Cunningham is not playing because he missed TC and we changed schemes.

So he can't beat out a guy that is old as dirst in Carter and is totally gassed by midway through the second quarter and he can;t beat out Anderson, who has one pass rush move and once he uses it, he is cooked for the rest of the game.

How about this instead: The new scheme calls for the DE's to get upfield in a hurry and Cunningham is sllloowwwww as grass growing and with all the suddenness of a statue.
At least in the 3-4 Cunningham could say the lack of suddenness and speed was because he was required to read and react first.

Where are you getting this idea that Cunningham lacks suddenness and speed?

 

[SanAngeloState]

Ras-I hasn't been playing, period! I don't care how well he looks when gets out there if it's only one or two games in seven (including preseason). He was made of glass in highschool and college and sadly it seems he hasn't shaken that in the pros. Most people saw that coming well before he was picked.

Yep, it's a darn shame. I heard BB say that he didn't believe in "injury prone" that some guys are injured in college and not in pros and vice versa.

However, someone like Ras-IR, I mean I still have hopes for him but he is made of glass it seems.

 

[SanAngeloState]

Let's think this through a bit. The reason Cunningham is not playing because he missed TC and we changed schemes.

So he can't beat out a guy that is old as dirst in Carter and is totally gassed by midway through the second quarter and he can;t beat out Anderson, who has one pass rush move and once he uses it, he is cooked for the rest of the game.

How about this instead: The new scheme calls for the DE's to get upfield in a hurry and Cunningham is sllloowwwww as grass growing and with all the suddenness of a statue.
At least in the 3-4 Cunningham could say the lack of suddenness and speed was because he was required to read and react first.

Slow as molasses in wintertime. The suddenness of a snail.

I hope they can trade him but I fear not.

 

[Snake Eyes]

Yep, it's a darn shame. I heard BB say that he didn't believe in "injury prone" that some guys are injured in college and not in pros and vice versa.

However, someone like Ras-IR, I mean I still have hopes for him but he is made of glass it seems.

That's extremely disappoining if BB doesnt believe that.

 

[JackBauer]

Where are you getting this idea that Cunningham lacks suddenness and speed?

It's a common refrain he's been repeating ad nauseum since... well, forever. The guy has irrational hatred (?) for certain players that you just need to either take in stride or disregard, however you're so inclined.

 

[TheSolderKing]

For all the hate on Cunningham relative to Dunlap, remember that he did have more total pressures than Dunlap a year ago. Now, he had fewer sacks and more just "hurries," but he impacted the QB more than Dunlap did.

My new favorite stat, though, is 7. That would be the number of tackles on running plays that Dunlap had last season. Cunningham had 31. And I'd be willing to bet that Cunningham dropped into coverage around 10 times as much as Dunlap did last season.

good going Sciz

 

[TheSolderKing]

Where are you getting this idea that Cunningham lacks suddenness and speed?

I like JC, but Speed has always been a ? w/ him Sciz (too slow to be a pro OLB pass rusher). He is on the slower side, but I still like him. Let us see how he does in the 4-3


I liked your info of run stops

 

[Sciz]

I like JC, but Speed has always been a ? w/ him Sciz (too slow to be a pro OLB pass rusher). He is on the slower side, but I still like him. Let us see how he does in the 4-3

Slow is irrelevant though. I don't care if he runs a 6-second 40, as long as the first 10 yards are fast. And Cunningham's first 10 yards is better than just about any other DE conversion prospect over the past few years. He's going to lose some of his first step by standing up as opposed to coiling up and exploding, but that's going to happen to just about everybody. And is there a combine drill that translates to the actual game of football any better than the 10 yard split?

 

[ftghb]

Hey guys...this is one of my first times posting, but I found this event significant enough to me when I was watching the draft live. I figured most of you didnt watch the florida games that cunningham and dunlap played in, because if you watched, you would immediately notice that a significant portion of cunningham's sacks and production were a direct result of pressure created from dunlap's side. Cunningham and dunlap accumulated similar stats at FL despite the fact that cunningham started one more year than dunlap. Your staticians may read that dunlap has 0 sacks in 1 game started, but he leads the Bengals with 8 Qb pressures this year in only 125 snaps.

Btw, Jermaine Cunningham is slow footed, don't care about the 10 yard splits or whatever, he is just average when it comes to speed. Also doesn't possess the bulk or the strength to drive thru blocks. You need one or the other to be able to rush the qb, and he doesnt have either.

 

[Shelterdog]

You're right about the first 5 DBs. Lil' Terry & Glas-IR, however, were damaged goods
before they finally - due to their fragility - played a snap in the NFL.

What does this even mean? Do you mean they were damaged goods due to fragility before they played? If so, what's your evidence?

Just because Wheatley got hurt or Dowling has been hurt doesn't mean they were fragile or injury prone-do you have any support for this other than your say-so?

Wheatley was redshirted one year but played almost every game in four other season, and Dowling had almost perfect health his first three years in college. Neither had major surgeries (not like Gronk's back) and neither scream injury problems.

If you only draft people without injury histories you're going to miss out on a lot of talent-Gronk and Vollmer leap to mind.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

For all the hate on Cunningham relative to Dunlap, remember that he did have more total pressures than Dunlap a year ago. Now, he had fewer sacks and more just "hurries," but he impacted the QB more than Dunlap did.

My new favorite stat, though, is 7. That would be the number of tackles on running plays that Dunlap had last season. Cunningham had 31. And I'd be willing to bet that Cunningham dropped into coverage around 10 times as much as Dunlap did last season.

I think you are confusing hate with the fact that Cunningham is as sudden as grass growing. He is slow off the ball and slow in getting to top speed and slow in chasing QB's. Which explains why he has lots of pressures and little by way of sacks.

I for one do not hate Cunningham, but if he was more sudden and faster, then I could see him in the base defense. Maybe some extra time with Nash would help him a bit.

 

[captain stone]

What does this even mean? Do you mean they were damaged goods due to fragility before they played? If so, what's your evidence?

Just because Wheatley got hurt or Dowling has been hurt doesn't mean they were fragile or injury prone-do you have any support for this other than your say-so?

Wheatley was redshirted one year but played almost every game in four other season, and Dowling had almost perfect health his first three years in college. Neither had major surgeries (not like Gronk's back) and neither scream injury problems.

If you only draft people without injury histories you're going to miss out on a lot of talent-Gronk and Vollmer leap to mind.

Wheatley's wrist was already damaged goods before the draft. Guess what part of his body was injured during his first start in his rookie season and caused him to go on IR?

Besides a fractured ankle and hamstring & knee injuries in 2010/11, Glas-IR also suffered a broken hand & knee injury in high school.

I'm not saying that these 2 should not have been drafted at all; I am saying that because of their injuries, they should not have been drafted as high as they were, esp. Wheatley, whose value lay much closer to the spot where Wilhite was selected than to the spot where he was actually selected.

 

[NG Pats Fan]

Just curious,

What did BB see in Jermaine Cunningham he didn't see in Carlos Dunlap? Do you think Urban Meyer told him Cunningham would be the better NFL player?

 

[NinjaZX6R]

Just curious,

What did BB see in Jermaine Cunningham he didn't see in Carlos Dunlap? Do you think Urban Meyer told him Cunningham would be the better NFL player?

Ooohh I don't know...maybe the fact that we were running a 3-4 defense and Dunlaps solely fits well in a 4-3 defense and not as a 3-4. Also, between the two of them at Florida, only JC dropped back in coverage in zone blitzes.

Also, Dunlap was an irresponsible drunken idiot at Florida. He didn't have a hot and cold button like Dunlap did.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

Just curious,

What did BB see in Jermaine Cunningham he didn't see in Carlos Dunlap? Do you think Urban Meyer told him Cunningham would be the better NFL player?

No doubt in my mind that Meyer talked up Cunningham to BB, but I think the tape convinced BB that Cunningham could work well in our defense more than anything else.