Cap Update

[Frezo]

Miguel a question regarding the Jonathan Fanene cap hit..

From this article by Greg Bedard last year..

"But it's not the end of the world. The Patriots will take a $2.025 million cap hit this year, and another $1.925 million next."

When they appeal this.. is it possible they get the full amount back close to $4mill?

They are waiting for the findings of a merits hearing. They could recover as much as 2.5 million as far as I can tell.

Decision reached in Jonathan Fanene hearing - NFL.com

 

[eom]

It would depend on how you viewed their upcoming possibilities.

Vollmer would undoubtably be their most expensive signing, not just to date in the FA period, but possibly in the entire offseason. Long just signed for 8.5 aav and Cherilus signed for 7.1 aav. I'm assuming that Vollmer is anywhere from 5.5 to 6.5. Either way he'd be our most expensive signing.

That isn't even taking into account the WR dilemma, assuming that they add someone of E.Sanders stature or possibly even better, which will easily be another 4.5 to 5.5 million right there (for Sanders). More if someone better is being targeted.

Then there's the pass rusher. Some are speaking of Dumervil, who will bring in at least 5.5 to 6.5 million right there. Or Abraham/Freeny--who should come cheaper but still cost approx. 3--3.5 or so.

I can't see any way they could possibly sign ALL 3, or if they'd even want to. I just want to see WR and pass rusher addressed above all else.

I think they have around 14-15m at the moment.
vollmer ~5m
I think the name receivers are signed, so wr ~4m might even be generous
abraham ~3m

that's ~12m total with 14-15m space, but obviously this is a half-assed guess, and all the details will change this significantly.
my point is just that fitting the 3 guys under the cap is probably possible.

 

[Rob0729]

I would not be shocked if it's around 4mill for them combined as I don't think Koutevides counts agains the cap at this time.

Bedard posted something yesterday
https://twitter.com/GregABedard/status/313102666748289025

Kyle Arrington received a $6.5 million signing bonus. Should have $2.625 million cap number this year.

I'm banking on Wilson being under 1.4 too..

I said Arrington would have a $2-3 million cap hit. I think Jeff Howe rushed too fast to talk about the Pats' cap space will be eaten up. I think Wilson will be $2-3 million myself, but closer to $2 million than $3 million.

Assuming I am right, that means the Pats probably have $11.5-12.5 million in cap space right now.

 

[mgteich]

We have $16.4 of cap room left according to Miguel (although he thinks it might be $900K higher). Sporstrac has us a $16.4. Jason's numbers are not as recent, but there agreed with Miguel very closely last week.

These numbers do not include Arrington, Wilson and Koutouvides. I would think that we have a bit over $12.4M of cap space. We don't have more than $11M to spend, since we need some money for JAG's like Koutouvides who will be signed in the coming weeks. We also need to sign to occasional Svitek or Cole level player.

Is $11M enough for a pass-rusher, a wide reveiver and an OT. I guess it depends on who is signed. For example, I think that we might be able sign Abraham, Edelman or Lloyd, and Vollmer.

I think they have around 14-15m at the moment.
vollmer ~5m
I think the name receivers are signed, so wr ~4m might even be generous
abraham ~3m

that's ~12m total with 14-15m space, but obviously this is a half-assed guess, and all the details will change this significantly.
my point is just that fitting the 3 guys under the cap is probably possible.

 

[Rob0729]

They are waiting for the findings of a merits hearing. They could recover as much as 2.5 million as far as I can tell.

Decision reached in Jonathan Fanene hearing - NFL.com

Maybe more. That is just the dead money cap hit they have right now. The league could give them back the cap money lost from last year too.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Also remember that every FA they sign pushes a cap hit of $480K off the cap, so a $750K signing only costs about $270K in cap space.

 

[mgteich]

Also, we have the possibility of restructuring Mankins now and adding $3.75M. That would commit the team to a restructure of Wilfork and Gostkowski later this year, and almost force them to also work on Wilfork's extension this year or certainly in the next off-season.

 

[yopats]

Maybe more. That is just the dead money cap hit they have right now. The league could give them back the cap money lost from last year too.

Yup that's what I was thinking to.. that's close to $4mill if that's the case which doesn't sound to far fetched.

 

[DarrylS]

Out driving around and listening to the mid day bombast show(Gresch and Zo) and they are basing their arguments on the "fact" that the Pats had 10 million left, and had to put aside 5 million for the rookies drafted.. leaving only 5 million to play with ultimately projecting that they would pick up one d lineman and one O lineman..

"Facts" to Gresch and Zo are deeply intertwined with hysteria..

 

[Joker]

"Facts" to Gresch and Zo are deeply intertwined with hysteria..

it's not "facts" to Gresh, Darryl...it's "fats" or "farts"....:heh:

 

[mgteich]

A mis-estimate of the contracts for Wilson, Arrington, and Koutouvides could get someone down to $12M, hardly hysteria.

With regard to the $5M of "rookie" money needed, the number is about right, the label is the not. We need to have about $5M for rookies, Player 51, Player 52, the Practice Squad, and to replace players put on IR during camp and during the season.

I have always thought that a Mankins (and perhaps Gostkowski restructure) would take care of this $5M need.

Of course, we could just count on the Fanena money from last year and this.

Out driving around and listening to the mid day bombast show(Gresch and Zo) and they are basing their arguments on the "fact" that the Pats had 10 million left, and had to put aside 5 million for the rookies drafted.. leaving only 5 million to play with ultimately projecting that they would pick up one d lineman and one O lineman..

"Facts" to Gresch and Zo are deeply intertwined with hysteria..

 

[BTTA]

Yup that's what I was thinking to.. that's close to $4mill if that's the case which doesn't sound to far fetched.

Sorry if this is repetitive, but does anyone know the timeline on the league's Fanene decisions?

 

[yopats]

Sorry if this is repetitive, but does anyone know the timeline on the league's Fanene decisions?

I don't but I would have to imagine that it will be here pretty soon..



Also.. looks like Adrian Wilson came a lot cheaper than most expected. (I had him slotted around $1.5mill)

https://twitter.com/cgasper/status/313795128764555264

@CGasper
Per a league source, Adrian Wilson signed a 3-year deal with the Patriots worth $5m. He got a $1m signing bonus. Has a $1m base in '13.

 

[patsfaninpa]

If we can keep Seabass and add Abraham and E. Sanders, that's a heckuva off-season. Only thing that screwed it up was White Wes's delusional agent.

 

[Marqui]

If we can keep Seabass and add Abraham and E. Sanders, that's a heckuva off-season.

Yup, and it would be nice if they could bring back Edelman too.

 

[JMC00]

So with the Arrington and Wilson cap hits now known, what does it bring the available cap space to?

 

[yopats]

So with the Arrington and Wilson cap hits now known, what does it bring the available cap space to?

Miguel has it $17.3Mill before Arrington and A. Wilson.. should be near $13mill now.

 

[Rob0729]

Miguel has it $17.3Mill before Arrington and A. Wilson.. should be near $13mill now.

Yeah, the only guy not accounted for is Koutuvides and he is likely to have singed for the veteran minimum of $630k. Although it might be closer to $14-15 million because Wilson, Arrington, and Koutuvides will knock three low level minimum players off the 51 man roster that counts towards the cap. That is an $1.44 million offset (three players at $480k) of the those three's numbers.

 

[mgteich]

Miguel says $14.1M. Allow $100K for Koutovides and we have $14M.

Remember that we need some money to sign JAGs throughout the rest off the offseason (andy once estimated $2M, which seems right) and $5M for later costs: Player 52, Player 53, Practice Squad, replacements for those placed on IR during camp, and for an in-season injury reserve.

So, unless we are counting on restructures (which I am) or Fanene money (which I am not, we have $7M spendable at the moment.

Yeah, the only guy not accounted for is Koutuvides and he is likely to have singed for the veteran minimum of $630k. Although it might be closer to $14-15 million because Wilson, Arrington, and Koutuvides will knock three low level minimum players off the 51 man roster that counts towards the cap. That is an $1.44 million offset (three players at $480k) of the those three's numbers.

 

[PatsFaninAZ]

Sanders seems a bit like a pipe dream at this point, at least without someone restructuring. An offer that the Steelers don't match will tie up too much cap space, won't it?