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Building your draft board position by position - week 3: OT

Discussion in 'Patriots Draft Talk' started by Box_O_Rocks, Mar 5, 2007.

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  1. Box_O_Rocks

    Box_O_Rocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    The wind is howling, the snow is fresh and swirling with more on the way, the plow/sander just rumbled past up the hill and will be headed back down in a moment, and the school bus just started bringing home the neighbor's kids an hour early. Given all that, it must be Monday and time for another exciting adventure in draft divination. Welcome to week three of draft board building where the schedule says it's not only time to talk Tackles, but you get to be Offensive too.

    For those coming in late, or folks wishing to admire the gritty thoughts of our participants, here's a look back to previous discussions:

    Week 1 OC/OG: http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/showthread.php?t=51105
    Week 2 DL: http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/showthread.php?t=51395

    For comparison's sake, here are the tackles currently carried on the Patriots' roster: http://www.patriots.com/team/index.cfm?ac=Rosters&Print=yes.

    #65 Wesley Britt 6-8 320
    #76 Sean Bubin 6-6 305
    #77 Nick Kaczur 6-4 315
    #72 Matt Light 6-4 305
    #70 Logan Mankins 6-4 310
    #68 Ryan O'Callaghan 6-7 330

    Those confused by Logan Mankins are reminded that (a) he was a college LT, and (b) he took LT reps in 2005's injury merry-go-round. O'Callaghan is the only college RT on the list, all the others played on their QB's blind side. BB's drafting of O'C last year caught one or two of us offguard with his acquisition of a roadgrader-type OL, the sneaky bastich. Anyway, there they are, the ballet dancers of the edge, wondering whom you might like to join their club.
     
  2. everlong

    everlong Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    He was considered a serious value that late most draft sites had him coming off in the 3rd or 4th rounds.
     
  3. SamBamsFan

    SamBamsFan Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    I had this in another thread, but it really belongs here:
    By the way, while doing some predraft work on lineman, I came across this comparison:

    From Scouts Inc 2005, pre-draft
    “Plays with excellent intensity and works hard to sustain blocks once in position. Has good mobility and speed. Shows good initial quickness and lateral movement. Has the speed and agility to reach the second level and hit the moving target if he takes the right angle. Gets set quickly in pass protection and doesn't allow defenders to shoot the inside gap. Gets adequate knee bend and shows good balance. Can mirror and slide versus double move. Keeps head up, shows good awareness and does a nice job of picking up the blitz.”

    http://insider.espn.go.com/nfldraft/...player?id=9041 sub. only

    From Scouts Inc 2007, predraft:
    “Shows a quick first step and can beat defenders to the point of attack. Plays with a mean streak and works to the whistle. Takes sound angles to blocks, generally plays under control in space and can get into position at the second level. Shows good range, can get around the corner when asked to pull and is big enough to engulf linebackers. Shows good lateral mobility when run blocking and can reach defenders lined up outside him. Gets into pass set quickly and can ride edge rushers past the pocket when he extends his arms”

    http://insider.espn.go.com/nfldraft/...layer?id=10478 sub. only

    The First is Logan Mankins. The Second is Allen Barbre. Both have been edited a bit to fit copyright stuff, but the comparisons continue. The above were in their strengths..
     
  4. AzPatsFan

    AzPatsFan Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    Frankly, I do not seee a need to draft any O-linemen. Britt is better than any possible draftees save Thomas and Brown and then only maybe Staley.

    The only one that will mamke it out of the first ten is Staley. He is likely to be gone too, long before the Pats draft. There might be a second day pick, that is a developmental pickup like a TE conversion destined to spend a year or three in Dante's school on the Practice Squad.
     
  5. SamBamsFan

    SamBamsFan Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    Everlong, I think the real surprise was in the selection, not the value of O'Callahan @ 5. He just didn't fit the profile that we expected, ie. lighter, more athletic OLineman. JMO.
     
  6. dryheat44

    dryheat44 Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    The Uncle Heatster rankings, as of 3/5:

    Day One
    1 Tony Ugoh OT Arkansas 6-5 301 5.06 1.71/2.9 - RB McFadden is considered the best back in NCAA heading into this season. Ugoh's quick feet and strength opened many holes for him last season.

    2 Joe Staley OT Central Michigan 6-6 306 4.75 - Great athlete. Typical concerns of competition faced, but Belichick grabbed another athletic dude out of the MAC a couple of years ago to play tackle.

    3 Marshall Yanda OT Iowa 6-4 307 5.12

    Day Two
    4 Allen Barbre OT Missouri Southern State 6-4 300 4.84 1.65/2.81 - His measurables are impressive. Could also move inside to guard.

    5 Herb Taylor OT TCU 6-4 296 5.19 - I like his quickness. I haven't read a negative thing about him yet.

    6 Gabe Hall OT Texas Tech 6'4" 313 4.91 - Was an outstanding pass blocker for the most pass-wacky team in NCAA. TE background speaks to agility.

    7 Mike Otto OT Purdue 6-6 308 5.25 1.78/2.96 - Not as sold as most experts, but he did come from a system that BB seems to value (Gorin, Light, Mruczkowski)
     
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2007
  7. cstjohn17

    cstjohn17 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    OT is interesting, in that the depth is pretty good so not an obvious need. However, our running game was so inconsistent I have to guess some of it was at the feet of the Oline.

    I would think that round 1 is appealing because of the 5 year contract. The question becomes are there any Tackles that are an upgrade over Kaczur or O'Callahan at the bottom of round 1?
    Possible names - Sears, Staley

    Other possibilities - Box mentioned Allen Barbre, he is very athletic and should be available in rounds 3-4. You can never have enough players who can contribute at guard or tackle.

    The other interesting part mentioned is that Mankins was a LT in college, this seems to be the trend. Only very good guards get drafted because tackles who can't cut it on the edge are pushed inside.
     
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2007
  8. Box_O_Rocks

    Box_O_Rocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Uncle Heatster captured a number of my targets, I like Ugoh a little better than Staley based on his run blocking production and an athleticism that the Scarnecchia Academy for Big Uglies Boys (SABUB, pronunciation 'say-buhb') should have little trouble developing into a fine blind side shield. Staley is already reported to be handy at pass protection, but needs work on his functional strength. So like Uncle Heat, Ugoh and Staley make 1 & 2 on my board.

    Yanda is a nice enough prospect, but I think he's better working inside and probably should be on my OG/OC board.

    Doug Free (Northern Illinois) is an athletic and svelte 6'6" 324 who could benefit from SABUB and the Woicik and Nash Institute for Strength and Conditioning (WANISAC, pronounced 'wah-nih-sack'). He's got some aggressiveness that can be refined.

    Adam Koets (Oregon State) is another athletic 6'5" 298 fellow who is not ready for prime time, but good fodder for SABUB and WANISAC. I remember looking him up after seeing him in a couple drills at the Combine, he moved well.

    Mike Otto looks like another Light when I've seen him. His write-up sounds more like Mankins in terms of finishing a block on the field, which should encourage Zach Thomas. As a second day prospect who will benefit from some time at WANISAC, he would be a good addition.

    Allan Barbre has been talked about plenty, obviously level of competition is a concern. There is also a note that he isn't the fastest at taking a play from the white board to the field. An intriguing play-thing for SABUB anyway.

    Brandon Frye (Virginia Tech) another 6'4" 301 lb. TE converted to OT. He's got the athleticism, but very limited starting experience winning the LT job his senior year and missing a couple games at the end of the season with injuries. More fodder for SABUB and WANISAC.

    Herb Taylor and Gabe Hall were mentioned above, both athletic RTs from pass happy programs. Taylor is described as someone who might be better inside as a Pro and probably will move to my OG/OC board. Hall reads more like a RT ready to graduate to LT with some SABUB and WANISAC, so I like him a lot better.

    Chase Johnson (Wyoming) is a diminutive 6'9" 330 lb lurch. I watched him at the Combine and he moves awkwardly, his write-up reports he did very well in his All-Star game and has 47 straight starts at LT, but needs work and to acquire that nasty streak that makes DL cringe. In the Fox ranking used for PATSNUTMe's draft game, Johnson is likely to go undrafted. After watching him use his wing span at the Combine, I think the kid is worth a flyer as a camp invite or UDFA signing.

    Ed McCarthy (Yale) is a 4 year starter at 6'5" 305 who played LG as a frosh, C as soph, and LT his last two years starting 39 games.

    Cory Niblock (Florida State) 6'4" 308 started RG as a soph, LT his junior year, tore his ACL to end the season, but recovered enough to win the LG slot as a senior. If his recovery is going well he may have regained enough agility to play some OT again. He's expected to be undrafted and seems worth a look (he's already on my OG/OC board, but like I said, may be recovered enough to work for a OT slot).
     
  9. Mike the Brit

    Mike the Brit Minuteman Target PatsFans.com Supporter

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    As usual, I am in awe of your knowledge of the game and insight into the subtleties of the position.

    But I respectfully submit that no one has yet addressed the following essential question: which of these gentlemen has red hair? Isn't it abundantly clear that the Patriots are out to field the NFL's only all-redhead (and, if Mr Light has his way, red beard) offensive line. ;)
     
  10. dryheat44

    dryheat44 Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    I was reading a scout's E-WSG practice notebook yesterday, and he says Otto was the best OT on the field during the week.
     
  11. Box_O_Rocks

    Box_O_Rocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I think it was Brady who noted Dan Koppen wasn't a natural redhead, but Billy Yates was. Curious if true.
     
  12. Box_O_Rocks

    Box_O_Rocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I recall reading something similar somewhere around the net, I already had a good impression from cat-napping in front of the odd Purdue game.
     
  13. chunkypony

    chunkypony Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    Bump for the draft board construction
     
  14. Seneschal2

    Seneschal2 In the Starting Line-Up

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    Maybe just a worthless and useless tidbit but, Ugoh helped open holes for ex-Pat Cedric Cobbs back in '03 -- so we've obviously seen him on film for a while now.
     
  15. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    As long as we get the help at DB, I am fine with drafting an OT. I would expect a Day One OT to be immediately part of the roster and replace an injured player or Britt on the final 53. I would expect that a Day Two OT would be behind Britt and compete for his spot, but more likely end up on the PS, and perhaps even be cut (see Stevenson in 2006).

    In the end, my comfort level in drafting an OT depends our ability to fill three more spots through free agency (ILB, ILB and WR). Unless we do this, I don't even want to consider anyone unless they play DB, LB or WR. However, if the three players are signed, we have much more flexibility, being able to draft 3-4 defensive backs and still have room to upgrade at other positions.
     
  16. gomezcat

    gomezcat It's SIR Moderator to you Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    From the write ups, Staley seems to be a possible high pick. He is very athletic, has lots of aggression and has a good work ethic; 11% body fat suggests a lot of hard work from a 305lb guy.

    http://www.nfl.com/draft/profiles/2007/staley_joe

    Disclaimer: I don't get to watch any college Football, so I'm extrapolating to the nth degree.
     
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