Brady AllTime QB Rating leader

[BradyBranch39]

Interesting to see 8 active QBs in the top 10. Goes to show how Bill Polian has changed the game.

Yep. Even Joe Effing Flacco is in the top 20:
Weekly Top 20

 

[shmessy]

Yep. Even Joe Effing Flacco is in the top 20:
Weekly Top 20

Now THAT truly galls me.

Flacco has no business being in the top 20 THIS YEAR.

He simply has an NBA Basketball Team to throw to.

How many times do we have to see that guy throw jump balls straight up in the air knowing full well his Amazon-WR's will come down with it?

Credit Ozzie Newsome, not that QB hack.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Now THAT truly galls me.

Flacco has no business being in the top 20 THIS YEAR.

He simply has an NBA Basketball Team to throw to.

How many times do we have to see that guy throw jump balls straight up in the air knowing full well his Amazon-WR's will come down with it?

Credit Ozzie Newsome, not that QB hack.

Hes not in the top 10 but Flacco is on a pace to throw 4k yards, 20TDs, complete 60% of his passes and led his team to a 9-2 record.

Which 12 or 13 QBs are better than that?

 

[bagwell368]

Maybe someone else mentioned it, but comparing QB's across eras, you better use Rate+, which is on football-reference along with QB Rating.

You'll see right away Brady isn't near #1. Also if you count QB's back to the 1930's no way Brady is the GOAT. He clearly belongs to the top tier - which I count as six players. Check out Otto Graham at a 127 Rate+ compared to Brady at 119 (100 is average player in their time). Then consider every year Graham played, he played for a Championship and won 7. He's the pre merger GOAT. Montana is still the post merger GOAT with a 123 Rate+ and that daunting 4-0 in the SB. Brady wins another ring and has two more prime years he could overtake JM but as of today? No.

 

[Ive_Killed_People]

Maybe someone else mentioned it, but comparing QB's across eras, you better use Rate+, which is on football-reference along with QB Rating.

You'll see right away Brady isn't near #1. Also if you count QB's back to the 1930's no way Brady is the GOAT. He clearly belongs to the top tier - which I count as six players. Check out Otto Graham at a 127 Rate+ compared to Brady at 119 (100 is average player in their time). Then consider every year Graham played, he played for a Championship and won 7. He's the pre merger GOAT. Montana is still the post merger GOAT with a 123 Rate+ and that daunting 4-0 in the SB. Brady wins another ring and has two more prime years he could overtake JM but as of today? No.

Wow Otto played for a championship almost every year! Impressive how many teams were there back then?... 6? Your DBag rating is a perfect 148 go back to Jersey troll.

 

[TheBostonStraggler]

QB rating in and of itself doesn't mean a whole lot, but it is another bullet in the G.O.A.T. gun.

• QB rating
• career touchdowns
• career passing yards
• TD/int ratio
• wins
• winning %
• playoff winning %
• championships

Most other great QB's show up on some of these lists, and not others. Brady's the only guy who, when all is said and done, will probably be at or near the top in all of them.

Exactly. One stat (with the arguable exception of winning) is rarely going to tell a story. Yet I disagree with those who say passer rating means nothing. While it is only a piece of the puzzle it arguably is as big a piece as any when looking at a QB's stats. The caveat, as pointed out very well by another poster, is the median of rating by year/era.

Of course the NFL now emphasizes/favors passing (by rule). When TFB started out he was not getting as much of the benefit he is getting now (the younger QBs are getting a great benefit from it). Montana never got much benefit (oh man! if Montana could have thrown over the middle and the defense couldn't mangle his receivers). Very arguably TFB is GOAT yet given the era and the rules not yet favoring passing, Montana has a very good argument at GOAT also (IMHO).

 

[DocHoliday]

Montana's weapons and overall team, I think, deter from his GOAT argument

 

[Ivan]

Montana's weapons and overall team, I think, deter from his GOAT argument

If you remove great teams from the equation you don't have much of a GOAT discussion on any level, especially football, where no one player can win a championship.

Much as I want them to win another championship for my own pleasure my biggest reason for wanting to see it is that it would cement both and Brady as GOAT. Brady gets one more and there simply is no way around it, his numbers simply trump all those in the argument. Belichick is a tougher argument to sell but with 4 rings and his dominance in an era built to prevent domination ultimately win the day IMO. Lost in all the flak he has taken over "poor drafting," not being aggressive enough in spending, and not having won another championship since the 3-4 run of 2001-2004, is the fact that he has had 3 teams incredibly close to winning it all, and has somehow managed to completely overhaul a dynasty and never drop kout of contention, all while having to pay the players who made them successful or let them go, and draft at the back of the pack year after year, in terms of their slot, not their manueverings. If the Patriots win a Super Bowl with Brady at QB then it may well be the first time in NFL history that a coach has won a SB, replaced 52/53 players and won another.

I don't believe the Patriots are the best team in football right now or yet, but I really believe they are about to be and could be one if the 2 best teams in football for the next few years. If so then both these guys have a great shot at being GOAT.

 

[DocHoliday]

If you remove great teams from the equation you don't have much of a GOAT discussion on any level, especially football, where no one player can win a championship.

Much as I want them to win another championship for my own pleasure my biggest reason for wanting to see it is that it would cement both and Brady as GOAT. Brady gets one more and there simply is no way around it, his numbers simply trump all those in the argument. Belichick is a tougher argument to sell but with 4 rings and his dominance in an era built to prevent domination ultimately win the day IMO. Lost in all the flak he has taken over "poor drafting," not being aggressive enough in spending, and not having won another championship since the 3-4 run of 2001-2004, is the fact that he has had 3 teams incredibly close to winning it all, and has somehow managed to completely overhaul a dynasty and never drop kout of contention, all while having to pay the players who made them successful or let them go, and draft at the back of the pack year after year, in terms of their slot, not their manueverings. If the Patriots win a Super Bowl with Brady at QB then it may well be the first time in NFL history that a coach has won a SB, replaced 52/53 players and won another.

I don't believe the Patriots are the best team in football right now or yet, but I really believe they are about to be and could be one if the 2 best teams in football for the next few years. If so then both these guys have a great shot at being GOAT.

It's more the free agency and salary cap that is the difference between Brady and Montana

 

[patsfan13]

Maybe someone else mentioned it, but comparing QB's across eras, you better use Rate+, which is on football-reference along with QB Rating.

You'll see right away Brady isn't near #1. Also if you count QB's back to the 1930's no way Brady is the GOAT. He clearly belongs to the top tier - which I count as six players. Check out Otto Graham at a 127 Rate+ compared to Brady at 119 (100 is average player in their time). Then consider every year Graham played, he played for a Championship and won 7. He's the pre merger GOAT. Montana is still the post merger GOAT with a 123 Rate+ and that daunting 4-0 in the SB. Brady wins another ring and has two more prime years he could overtake JM but as of today? No.

Graham was the best pre 1960 QB, of course the modern game is far different than the game played in that era. Just look at the number of teams and dilution of talent for starters, not to mention the use of film and so on.


As to Montana, Brady may be better than him ALREADY, 4-0 in the SB is fine but of course Brady has a better winning % in the playoffs and has made it to more SB's and has a far higher winning % as a QB in the regular season.

When Brady wins his 4th ring and 6th conference championship there will be no question that Brady is the best modern era QB.

 

[1960Pats]

It's funny how this discussion about GOAT hasn't really included two of the biggest media favorites of all time, Favre and Manning. If they hadn't gagged away so many chances they could be in there too.

What's not so funny to me is that Johnny U has never even entered into the discussion at all. I'd put him right up there with the rest.

 

[Kontradiction]

Montana's weapons and overall team, I think, deter from his GOAT argument

Huh? You could make that same argument for Brady. He's either had top flight receiving weapons (Moss, Welker, Gronk, Hernandez, etc.) or a good to great running game with a good defense throughout his entire career. Brady didn't have Jerry Rice in his prime, but he had Moss when he was very close to his. I do agree with the impressive nature of the Patriots dynasty as compared to San Fran's, though. Not to diminish what they did as a team in the 80's, but the Patriots doing it in an era where it was not supposed to happen makes their accomplishments that much more noteworthy, IMO.

 

[Jangles]

It's funny how this discussion about GOAT hasn't really included two of the biggest media favorites of all time, Favre and Manning. If they hadn't gagged away so many chances they could be in there too.

What's not so funny to me is that Johnny U has never even entered into the discussion at all. I'd put him right up there with the rest.

Maybe if you only visit patsfans.com this might be true.

 

[RodThePat]

Maybe someone else mentioned it, but comparing QB's across eras, you better use Rate+, which is on football-reference along with QB Rating.

You'll see right away Brady isn't near #1. Also if you count QB's back to the 1930's no way Brady is the GOAT. He clearly belongs to the top tier - which I count as six players. Check out Otto Graham at a 127 Rate+ compared to Brady at 119 (100 is average player in their time). Then consider every year Graham played, he played for a Championship and won 7. He's the pre merger GOAT. Montana is still the post merger GOAT with a 123 Rate+ and that daunting 4-0 in the SB. Brady wins another ring and has two more prime years he could overtake JM but as of today? No.

Otto Graham played QB at a time where the position wasn't anywhere near as important as it became starting at the late 60's. Football was basically a completely different sport back then, and his 127 rating+ shows two things: he was a really good player; and there weren't many teams who threw the football well at the time, as the passing game was seldom used. If you play alongside other fantastic quarterbacks, the league average rating increases, and so does you passer rating+, but if you play in a league where most reams don't even throw the ball 35% of the time, your numbers will stand out if you are a great player. Honestly, I don't think any player that played the majority of his career pre-1960 should be considered the best ever at his position.

 

[RobertWeathers]

If you remove great teams from the equation you don't have much of a GOAT discussion on any level, especially football, where no one player can win a championship.

Much as I want them to win another championship for my own pleasure my biggest reason for wanting to see it is that it would cement both and Brady as GOAT. Brady gets one more and there simply is no way around it, his numbers simply trump all those in the argument. Belichick is a tougher argument to sell but with 4 rings and his dominance in an era built to prevent domination ultimately win the day IMO. Lost in all the flak he has taken over "poor drafting," not being aggressive enough in spending, and not having won another championship since the 3-4 run of 2001-2004, is the fact that he has had 3 teams incredibly close to winning it all, and has somehow managed to completely overhaul a dynasty and never drop kout of contention, all while having to pay the players who made them successful or let them go, and draft at the back of the pack year after year, in terms of their slot, not their manueverings. If the Patriots win a Super Bowl with Brady at QB then it may well be the first time in NFL history that a coach has won a SB, replaced 52/53 players and won another.

I don't believe the Patriots are the best team in football right now or yet, but I really believe they are about to be and could be one if the 2 best teams in football for the next few years. If so then both these guys have a great shot at being GOAT.

You are right but depending on the timeframe of the potential comparisons, Tom Landry needs to be in that discussion. If you compare 1982-1991, maybe even Joe Gibbs

For Landry, may want to check out the rosters of the 1971 Cowboys vs the 1977 Cowboys. Staubach, Harris and Pugh were the only common starters between the two championship teams. Renfro, Neely and Waters had major/minor roles in both teams.

Even though they didn't win a ton of SBs, the Cowboys in the 60s were in a couple title games, won 2 titles in the . Their problem was that they ran into all-time great times such as the Packers, Steelers and 49ers with 3 different QBs (Meredith, Morton and Staubach).

 

[TheBostonStraggler]

If you remove great teams from the equation you don't have much of a GOAT discussion on any level, especially football, where no one player can win a championship.

Much as I want them to win another championship for my own pleasure my biggest reason for wanting to see it is that it would cement both and Brady as GOAT. Brady gets one more and there simply is no way around it, his numbers simply trump all those in the argument. Belichick is a tougher argument to sell but with 4 rings and his dominance in an era built to prevent domination ultimately win the day IMO. Lost in all the flak he has taken over "poor drafting," not being aggressive enough in spending, and not having won another championship since the 3-4 run of 2001-2004, is the fact that he has had 3 teams incredibly close to winning it all, and has somehow managed to completely overhaul a dynasty and never drop kout of contention, all while having to pay the players who made them successful or let them go, and draft at the back of the pack year after year, in terms of their slot, not their manueverings. If the Patriots win a Super Bowl with Brady at QB then it may well be the first time in NFL history that a coach has won a SB, replaced 52/53 players and won another.

I don't believe the Patriots are the best team in football right now or yet, but I really believe they are about to be and could be one if the 2 best teams in football for the next few years. If so then both these guys have a great shot at being GOAT.

I agree. Another SB win for Brady and it makes the scales tip decidedly toward TFB as GOAT. However, it also speaks to how arbitrary the argument for GOAT is. If Eli is called in the grasp? If WW pulls down the pass? TFB is GOAT. Yet two plays -- one of which had nothing to do with TFB -- shouldn't determine GOAT. Ultimately the argument has quite a bit of subjectivity. What I think can be said factually is TFB and Joe Montana are the greatest of all time with a couple of others marginally close to that duo. An amazing and exclusive group to be a member of. And if TFB wins two more SBs before he rides off into the sunset, he is an individual that sets the standard for greatness for the next 100 years.

BB? He also, just as obviously, belongs in the discussion of GOAT with a couple of others. Yet, just like with TFB, two plays would have sealed the deal for BB. IMHO, if the Patriots win just the 07 SB, he clearly has the strongest argument for GOAT. Further, considering the difficulty parody causes a team to remain on top, it makes the argument greater for BB over say Walsh or Lombardi.
Us Patriot fans have truly been blessed having TFB and BB occupying the two most important positions on a football team. I'd bet my mortgage payment that we will not see in our lifetime another tandem that can be compared to these two.

 

[Ivan]

Maybe if you only visit patsfans.com this might be true.

Why, does Manning's career playoff record get better if you go to other sites?


Oops, now that I think of it Brady goes 9-10 and Manning has 3 rings if you go to Borges official HOF voting qualification site.

My mistake carry on in your effort to talk some sense into those Patriot homers who for some reason are convinced they root for the best team of this era.

 

[1960Pats]

It's funny how this discussion about GOAT hasn't really included two of the biggest media favorites of all time, Favre and Manning. If they hadn't gagged away so many chances they could be in there too.

What's not so funny to me is that Johnny U has never even entered into the discussion at all. I'd put him right up there with the rest.

Maybe if you only visit patsfans.com this might be true.

My comment was about this thread, here on PatsFans.com. What exactly is your point?

 

[1960Pats]

Why, does Manning's career playoff record get better if you go to other sites?


Oops, now that I think of it Brady goes 9-10 and Manning has 3 rings if you go to Borges official HOF voting qualification site.

My mistake carry on in your effort to talk some sense into those Patriot homers who for some reason are convinced they root for the best team of this era.

Silly us huh?

My comment was directed more at the fact that Johnny U isn't in the GOAT discussion here, and still isn't. I guess I should get used to the fact that most people haven't seen him play.

Btw, if you look at "Most clutch QBs of all time" lists you won't even find the name Favre or Manning, although Eli has moved onto them now, as he should have. Most of the lists start with Montana, Elway, Brady, Unitas, Staubach and then include names like Eli, Marino, Starr, Aikman, Stabler and Graham. But no Favre or Peyton Manning.

So, what would we rather have? A QB that's the 3rd most clutch QB of all time or one that has a great QB rating and a so-so playoff record. I think we all know the answer to that one

 

[Finnishfan]

I try to avoid these "Brady is GOAT" or "Brady vs Manning" types of discussions, because it's too easy to get stuck in them and they are hardly relevant topics before all is said and done. But not so long ago, I realized one thing that made me change my mind about not discussing these things before Brady hangs in his cleats.

It's not the early parts of Bradys career that make him the frontrunner in the GOAT -race, it's not the superbowl rings, it's not his overall record or playoff record nor is it his passing numbers. It's what he has done in the post-Moss era that has really solidified this for me.

We have had one of the worst defenses in the NFL for the past 3 years. Nevertheless we have been contenders each and every year. Nevermind the stats, records and numbers during those 3 years, just look at the games and ask, who is making the plays and winning the games?

It's #12.

People always say that the defense and Vinatieri won those early 2000's championships, and they are right. Brady wasn't the clutch in those teams, instead he was just a gear.

But just the fact that Brady hasn't been able to win a championship singlehandedly doesn't mean that he hasn't been damn close. Even 2007 was more scheme related and the defense was still good. But 2011, when we came so close, that was all on #12.

Name another player who has taken a team to the SB basically all through the virtue of his own performances? Single players can produce a winning performance in individual games, but not one player I can think of has lead the team throughout the regular season and the playoffs the way Brady did last year.

And this year he looks even better, even though he SHOULD BE well past his prime.

Trust me on this: #12 will win at least 1 more SB, possibly as soon as this year. And by doing that he will become the player who deserves more credit for a single superbowl win than any player in the history of the sports.

That will make him GOAT.