Blog: News and Notes on Dwight, Vinatieri

[Murphys95]

I think it's far too early to speculate on Adam. Let him decide his own future. The only tell is that the Patriots have placed the franchise tag on him twice already - that right there says negotiations don't necessarily come easy with him. I could list off a myriad of guesses why AV hasn't signed yet, including pride, price, and perhaps maybe he doesn't want to face the expectations placed on him anymore - but that would be speculation only.

Free agency runs through the end of July. That means there is plenty of time, for both sides. IMHO, Vinatieri could even wait until the 2006 season starts and grab himself a high paying one year deal from a desperate team.

 

[shmessy]

If GB was significantly more, he would have signed when he was over there.

I dunno....if they're even, he would've re-signed here in a heartbeat. My guess is that GB's offer is enough over the NE offer that he is now weighing all the externals (i.e. media, endorsements, long-term lifestyle, etc).

OTOH, GB is closer to South Dakota.

 

[dryheat44]

I think it's far too early to speculate on Adam. Let him decide his own future. The only tell is that the Patriots have placed the franchise tag on him twice already - that right there says negotiations don't necessarily come easy with him. I could list off a myriad of guesses why AV hasn't signed yet, including pride, price, and perhaps maybe he doesn't want to face the expectations placed on him anymore - but that would be speculation only.

Free agency runs through the end of July. That means there is plenty of time, for both sides. IMHO, Vinatieri could even wait until the 2006 season starts and grab himself a high paying one year deal from a desperate team.

Good points all. But what happens when either NE, GB, or both get tired of the drama and sign other kickers for 2 million or so?

1) AV loses leverage and may well sign an offer for less than he's been offered already, or

2) AV doesn't play this year, as all jobs are taken. Of course, if that happened, a team would cut their kicker immediately and sign Adam, but then that reverts to the first point.

Unless Adam is comfortable not getting paid this year, it's a dangerous game if he's playing it like you suggest.

 

[Willie55]

GB is closer to South Dakota.

I've seen this mentioned here before. He lives in Florida now, near Orlando. I don't know how much of the SD thing comes into play in regards to his decision.

 

[Miguel]

I think it's far too early to speculate on Adam. Let him decide his own future. The only tell is that the Patriots have placed the franchise tag on him twice already - that right there says negotiations don't necessarily come easy with him. I could list off a myriad of guesses why AV hasn't signed yet, including pride, price, and perhaps maybe he doesn't want to face the expectations placed on him anymore - but that would be speculation only.

Free agency runs through the end of July. That means there is plenty of time, for both sides. IMHO, Vinatieri could even wait until the 2006 season starts and grab himself a high paying one year deal from a desperate team.

Excellent points. We as Patriots fans applaud the Patriots' slow and methodical approach to free agency. I do not understand why when a player shows the same characteristics he gets criticized. This could be the last big contract for Adam. If I were him, I would ensure that I had all the facts before I made such a momental decision. I would not rush my decision just to placate impatient fans.

 

[Fanfrom1960]

I think it's far too early to speculate on Adam. Let him decide his own future. The only tell is that the Patriots have placed the franchise tag on him twice already - that right there says negotiations don't necessarily come easy with him. I could list off a myriad of guesses why AV hasn't signed yet, including pride, price, and perhaps maybe he doesn't want to face the expectations placed on him anymore - but that would be speculation only.

Free agency runs through the end of July. That means there is plenty of time, for both sides. IMHO, Vinatieri could even wait until the 2006 season starts and grab himself a high paying one year deal from a desperate team.

Excellent post. I think what we're experiencing here is an "Internet message board frenzy". What IS the big rush on this? Plenty of pro sports heroes have even sat out parts of a season to get what they wanted. Joe DiMaggio did it for, want to say, $25K in 1939 or so. There was no free agency then, but the Yankees could have tried to trade Joe. Yeah, right.

 

[Ring 6]

The only thing I know is that if he does come back all of the negative comments about him will disappear, and you will never be able to find anyone who, when the love Adam threads reappear, will say they wanted him gone because he had a bad attitude.

His 'goodwill' will be back to normal the second he inks the deal, or at least the first time he kicks a FG.

 

[Miguel]

The only thing I know is that if he does come back all of the negative comments about him will disappear, and you will never be able to find anyone who, when the love Adam threads reappear, will say they wanted him gone because he had a bad attitude.

His 'goodwill' will be back to normal the second he inks the deal, or at least the first time he kicks a FG.

So true. LOL

 

[BelichickFan]

The only thing I know is that if he does come back all of the negative comments about him will disappear, and you will never be able to find anyone who, when the love Adam threads reappear, will say they wanted him gone because he had a bad attitude.

I doubt you'll find anyone who would be unhappy to have him back . . . but you will find a good number who'll be upset if we overpay him.

 

[PATSNUTme]

The only thing I know is that if he does come back all of the negative comments about him will disappear, and you will never be able to find anyone who, when the love Adam threads reappear, will say they wanted him gone because he had a bad attitude.

His 'goodwill' will be back to normal the second he inks the deal, or at least the first time he kicks a FG.

Exactly. And if he should sign with GB or another team, he will be demonized.

It will be said that we are better off without him and that he is not the best clutch kicker in football anymore. That's already taken place in some degree on this board.

 

[hwc]

If GB was significantly more, he would have signed when he was over there.

Bingo. We have bingo.

If the Pats' offer wasn't competitive with a very easily determined market price, he would be gone.

If both the Pats' and the Packers' offers were not competitive with a very easily determined market price, Adam would be getting offers from other teams and he would be gone.

Instead, he's sitting there, firing his agent, and jerkin' both the Pats and the Packers around. Generally, when an NFL team makes an offer to a player, or asks for parameters of a deal from his agent during free agency period, it probably means they would like the process to move forwards towards a conclusion.

 

[arrellbee]

People here choose to continue to ignore the fact that if we offered him a deal that keeps him the highest paid with no guarantees or signing bonus, we essentially offered him ZERO. It's more fun to bash the greedy ingrate player. That's a deal most any franchise can top. Including us by simply adding in the requesite signing bonus. If Adam leaves because we don't, then PR spin aside he will have been forced out. NO KICKER WORTH HAVING TAKES THAT DEAL. Because all it really is is a series of one year highest salary non guaranteed deals the team can opt out of with no cap consequence beginning as soon as the day after he signs the deal. Remember in the NFL nothing is guaranteed save the signing bonus.

I think you have made the important point, Mo. Green Bay money might, in effect, be even more 'guaranteed', since with a team that is not being very competitive, if his percentages go down, they would be less likely to cut him than would the Patriots, which makes it 'more likely' that he would see all of the salary money of the deal without having to shop for a team sooner (and maybe with diminished performance and value).

 

[dryheat44]

I think you have made the important point, Mo. Green Bay money might, in effect, be even more 'guaranteed', since with a team that is not being very competitive, if his percentages go down, they would be less likely to cut him than would the Patriots, which makes it 'more likely' that he would see all of the salary money of the deal without having to shop for a team sooner (and maybe with diminished performance and value).

Remember also that Adam's has been kicking under guaranteed contracts for years. I don't know if the same can be said of the Pats latest offer, but I think it's possible, if not probable. Which makes that point irrelevant.

 

[hwc]

This could be the last big contract for Adam. If I were him, I would ensure that I had all the facts before I made such a momental decision. I would not rush my decision just to placate impatient fans.

But, here's the thing...it's really not a "monumental" decision. There are only two teams interested. Both have acknowledged the "parameters" of a deal, i.e. Vinatieri expects to be the highest paid kicker in the league. The market price dollars are simply not that hard to pin down, given the nearly identical Longwell and Akers deals within the last 120 days.

The benefits to Vinatieri's staying with New England are obvious:

a) it is a competitive, well-coached football team. Vinatieri is more likely to make it to Pro Bowls, Super Bowls, and potentially even the Hall of Fame kicking for the Patriots than he is for the average NFL team.

b) Vinatieri has extensive non-football endorsement deals in New England

c) Vinatieri has very good prospects for post-football employment in the New England market.

Now, the counter-argument would be speculation that the Pats have low-balled him. We have nothing to suggest that is the case, but if it were true, then teams should be coming out of the woodwork to throw "market-price" deals at him and significantly outbid the Pats. We are not seeing that. It took a week for the guy to even get one visit and the team's GM was a no show.

 

[Fanfrom1960]

The only thing I know is that if he does come back all of the negative comments about him will disappear, and you will never be able to find anyone who, when the love Adam threads reappear, will say they wanted him gone because he had a bad attitude.

His 'goodwill' will be back to normal the second he inks the deal, or at least the first time he kicks a FG.

Exactimunde, just like Jason Varitek of the Red Sox. Now, if he leaves, he'll be Johnny Damon with horns.

 

[dryheat44]

But, here's the thing...it's really not a "monumental" decision. There are only two teams interested. Both have acknowledged the "parameters" of a deal, i.e. Vinatieri expects to be the highest paid kicker in the league. The market price dollars are simply not that hard to pin down, given the nearly identical Longwell and Akers deals within the last 120 days.

And I think that the fact that ONLY two teams are serious players is very telling. Nick Saban needs a kicker. Bill Parcells needs a kicker. Tony Dungy needs a kicker.John Gruden could use an upgrade. The fact that none of these guys is very interested tells me that Adam has passed the point that even insane owners/GMs are interested in paying for a kicker.

 

[hwc]

I think the problem Vinatieri is having attracting free agent interest is two-fold:

a) the teams around the league perceive his contract demands to be unreasonable

b) the teams around the league perceive that he is just jerking them around to bid up his price in New England.

Both of these perceptions are evident in the nature of the comments coming from his only suitor, the Packers. Their comments to the media suggest that their meeting with Vinatieri started with exploring whether or not they even had a legitimate chance to sign him away from New England. The perceptions were also implicit in Bill Parcells' statement to the media that Vinatieri would be nuts to sign anywhere but New England, where his endorsement and post-football career opportunites are off-the-charts for a kicker. I believe Parcells compared Vinatieri to Yaztremski or Orr in New England.