Big name FA like Mario Williams, Cliff Avril, etc; are they worth the money?

[everlong]

The most recently that I remember was Peerless Price.

Beefalo tagged him ~ the "official" price was a 1st and 1st!! ~ and let the Market determine his Trade Value: They let him and his Agent work it out.

The Falconians broke off a 1st Rounder for'm, and all parties were happy.

Nice pulling Price out I had forgotten about him but Allen is more recent.

 

[Ring 6]

Re: Mario Williams\Cliff Avril, etc

The Vikings gave up a first and third for Jarad Allen who was franchised so not an RFA but the last one I can remember.

That's the reason there's not going to pay Williams. You pay him 15M and you pretty much need him to meet expectations each and every year of that contract.

Good point, the franchised tagged guys are probably the best comparison.

Re: Williams, I have always frowned on the 'savior' approach, and I think we have a lot of use for 3,4,5 mill cap slots which will do more to improve the team than one big players and a bunch of UDFAs.

If you look at it as 6 STARTER spots that you have 20mill for rather than looking at it as paying one guy 15mill and figure the rest out by the seat of your pants, it stands out.

 

[everlong]

The Patriots model is certainly built on spreading the wealth around those 6 positions. At the same time you understand why people get enamored with guys like Williams. If BB could plug him in and it was a reasonable price he would be an impact player on this defense. McGinist had that type of physical talent but he was also a top 5 pick.

 

[ay-yo]

I wouldn't pay Williams 15 a year but I would certainly call him up an see if he'd come here for 10 or 11.

 

[Deus Irae]

I wouldn't pay Williams 15 a year but I would certainly call him up an see if he'd come here for 10 or 11.

Why would he take millions less, per year, to play in New England?

 

[ay-yo]

Why would he take millions less, per year, to play in New England?

Better shot at winning.

 

[Deus Irae]

Better shot at winning.

Patriots haven't won since 2004. He could sign on to any number of contenders.

 

[ay-yo]

Patriots haven't won since 2004. He could sign on to any number of contenders.

No he couldn't.

AFC Contenders
Houston - at cap
Pitt - over cap
Balt - 10 under (not including Rice)

NFC Contenders
Giants - over cap
49ers - 30 under (need to sign Goldson and Rogers)
Saints - 20 under (need to resign Brees, Colston and Nicks)
Packers - close to cap

 

[Deus Irae]

No he couldn't.

AFC Contenders
Houston - at cap
Pitt - over cap
Balt - 10 under (not including Rice)

NFC Contenders
Giants - over cap
49ers - 30 under (need to sign Goldson and Rogers)
Saints - 20 under (need to resign Brees, Colston and Nicks)
Packers - close to cap

Yes, he could. Nobody's cap number is firm at this point, as you certainly know, Houston is looking at WR, Balt/SF/NO have money as you acknowledge, and you ignored other teams in contention (Bears/Eagles/Bengals/Falcons/Chargers/Team Manning goes to if he moves/etc...). A team like the Redskins could also be in play, just to point to a sugar daddy kind of team.

 

[Marqui]

Just give Williams his 15. What's really the difference between 11 million and 15 million. Either way you're sitting pretty if he comes here and is a big success or you're screwed if he turns out to be a huge bust.

 

[Ring 6]

Just give Williams his 15. What's really the difference between 11 million and 15 million. Either way you're sitting pretty if he comes here and is a big success or you're screwed if he turns out to be a huge bust.

I think 11 is just as risky as 15.

 

[DonBlackmon55]

No team has ever won a SB because of signing big money Free Agents, ever.There is a reason for that.
As much as everyone wants to fall in love with the big name player it is a fact of life that the NFL is a capped league, so the more you pay any one player, the worse your other 52 will be. It's an incontrovertible fact.

Secondly, adding a player that thrived in someone elses system does not guarantee they will be as good in yours. If you took a list of the 100 highest paid free agents to switch teams in the last 10 years, you would have a very hard time arguing that 20 of the 100 were better after changing teams than before.

Finally, the buying frenzy that happens when some teams start to consider these guys 'must have' despite the first 2 issues, drives their cost up, and you end up paying for what they were, when a majority of the Free Agents are at or past ther peak.

I am open to any examples of teams signing top dollar free agents that worked out that any one wants to give, but really, I see no evidence that this approach has worked since the 90s when SF and Dallas loaded up on guys chasing rings, and even then it wasn't big money guys.

Wrong, Back to back years infact

1995 SF 49ers Deion Sanders
1996 Dallas Cowboys Deion Sanders

Debunked.

EDIT : Add Simeon Rice also for Bucs early decade SB win

 

[patsfaninpa]

Wrong, Back to back years infact

1995 SF 49ers Deion Sanders
1996 Dallas Cowboys Deion Sanders

Debunked.

Wrong. SF won in 94 because Jerry Jones fired Jimmy Johnson. Deion had very little to do with it.

 

[DonBlackmon55]

Wrong. SF won in 94 because Jerry Jones fired Jimmy Johnson. Deion had very little to do with it.

1994 Reg Season, D. Sanders SF 49ers

Games : 14
GS : 12
INT : 6 (1 against Cowboys in their reg season game)
Yards : 303
TD : 3

1994-95: Post Season - 2 INTS. 1 against Cowboys in NFCCG and 1 against SD in SB

Try and lay off the drugs. EPIC FAIL

 

[patsfaninpa]

1994 Reg Season, D. Sanders SF 49ers

Games : 14
GS : 12
INT : 6 (1 against Cowboys in their reg season game)
Yards : 303
TD : 3

1994-95: Post Season - 2 INTS. 1 against Cowboys in NFCCG and 1 against SD in SB

Try and lay off the drugs. EPIC FAIL

One INT in NFCCG game more important than losing the best coach in the NFL. Steve Young league MVP 2nd most important reason other than Johnson being fired. SF made it to the NFCCG 5 of the previous 6 seasons. Please don't pretend Deion won jack for them. He was icing on the cake that is it. And, they still lose to Dallas if Jimmy Johnson is coaching them.

 

[Simple Jack's Brother]

Apparently Colston is only seeking $7 mil per year.....what?! GO GET HIM!


Live From the Combine: Friday News & Notes

 

[patsfaninpa]

Apparently Colston is only seeking $7 mil per year.....what?! GO GET HIM!


Live From the Combine: Friday News & Notes

That's prob good news for the Saints. They're gonna lose Carl Nicks. Sign Brees and Colston. I wouldn't be against inquiring about Robert Meachum. He's not your classic can do everything wr. But, he can fly. And, just enough to keep you thinking.

 

[Off The Grid]

What's really the difference between 11 million and 15 million.

4 Million.

Hey, I'm here to help.

 

[Ring 6]

Wrong, Back to back years infact

1995 SF 49ers Deion Sanders
1996 Dallas Cowboys Deion Sanders

Debunked.

EDIT : Add Simeon Rice also for Bucs early decade SB win

Those teams were loaded. Sanders was not the reason they won.

 

[Simple Jack's Brother]

That's prob good news for the Saints. They're gonna lose Carl Nicks. Sign Brees and Colston. I wouldn't be against inquiring about Robert Meachum. He's not your classic can do everything wr. But, he can fly. And, just enough to keep you thinking.

I forget where, but I was reading that a couple scouts around the league think meachem could have a bigger impact than colston in a system outside the saints...so i'd love to see either of them here.