Best roster in the NFL? Heres your answer!

[Bruins29]

The clown show continues

 

[50-yard-line]

The Patriots' roster is a lot stronger than people give credit for, and it's not because of Brady (who's amazing, yes).

Jones and Nink are top-tier DEs. They don't get the sack numbers because the Pats scheme doesn't emphasize sacks. Add Sheard and that's a very, very good group (and here's hoping that Moore and Buchannon can flash a bit of that talent we saw in brief flashes to create good depth).

Siliga is a vastly underrated DT, Alan Branch is no slouch. They need one more, perhaps, and of course, we've got to expect Easley to step up. No reason not to expect that.

Hightower, Mayo and Collins...this trio reminds me of the SF corps from a couple of years ago. Can't think of who I'd trade that group for - maybe Carolina? Certainly not Buffalo. And the way the Patriots scheme/change/deceive, LB is their most important defensive level. Was in the early SB years, too.

McCourty is outstanding...Arrington is one of the best slot CBs in the league. Other than that, they need to find scheme and fit, but this is, right now, the weakness. Of course it is, with Revis gone and Browner out of place and so shipped out - you lose an HOF corner and a perfect, roughhouse complementary piece and you'll be weaker.

Offensively, Brady is tops. Gronk is tops. Chandler is an outstanding TE2 and both Hooman (vastly underrated here) and Wright provide wonderful depth.

Their OL is very good and in need of one or two more pieces, which should be attainable. Volmer is an outstanding RT. Solder is a legitimate LT, top half, and Cannon and Fleming provide great depth.

Their RBs will never get the AP, McCoy type spotlight because they don't play with a bell-cow. Blount is good, Gray might be...Cadet? I don't know. Same with White. But they'll be fine here.

Their receivers are very good, and again, vastly underrated. Eldemen is not CJ or Dez, of course, but he's a strong #1 at this point. LaFell is a perfectly capable #2, blocks very well and fits their scheme beautifully. Amendola is as good a #3 as you'll find, and also a tenacious blocker - count me in the camp that is thrilled he restructured and is sticking around. Dobson is a ?, but I haven't given up on the kid. Tyms and Boyce? Who knows at this point?

This is an extremely talented, extremely DEEP roster. They don't have the splash names, the Madden heroes...but a big part of that is because of the way they manage a game. They don't focus on sacks...they don't rely on one player, even Gronk...they change their schemes week to week.

What they do, however, is WIN.

What they also do, is manage the cap. Comparing cap/FA's next year between the Pats and Buffalo, and the Pats are in a much better position. And they're still the better team.

 

[convertedpatsfan]

Using Amendola as a notable player when speaking to how good our roster is, well that is sort of like noting your 2002 Kia Sorrento when talking about how rich you are, it is illogical. Especially when the same posters are leaving out Brandon LaFell who had nearly 5 times the production in his first season on the team.

Not trying to pick on you, but I think you're using some really terrible analogies. Lots of rich people drive ****ty cars. They drink cheap beer and eat cheap food. Some of them may not earn as much as many people, but they save a lot, and invest it. Judging a person's net worth by their car doesn't really say much.

Warren Buffet drives a 2006 Cadillac. Steve Ballmer drives a Ford Fusion. Jim Walton drives an old Dodge Dakota. Ingvar Kamprad, the creator of Ikea, drives a 15-year old Volvo and flies coach.

You should read "The Millionaire Next Door." It is a surprising look at who millionaires really are. It isn't about how much you earn, but rather how much you save. Athletes are a great example of this, as tons of them earn tens, if not hundreds of millions of dollars, yet many of them are dead broke within the first decade after their retirement. Meanwhile, many people who earn a fraction of that end up becoming millionaires who retire comfortably because they save up their money, partly by driving ****ty cars.

 

[Brady6]

Not trying to pick on you, but I think you're using some really terrible analogies. Lots of rich people drive ****ty cars. They drink cheap beer and eat cheap food. Some of them may not earn as much as many people, but they save a lot, and invest it. Judging a person's net worth by their car doesn't really say much.

Warren Buffet drives a 2006 Cadillac. Steve Ballmer drives a Ford Fusion. Jim Walton drives an old Dodge Dakota. Ingvar Kamprad, the creator of Ikea, drives a 15-year old Volvo and flies coach.

You should read "The Millionaire Next Door." It is a surprising look at who millionaires really are. It isn't about how much you earn, but rather how much you save. Athletes are a great example of this, as tons of them earn tens, if not hundreds of millions of dollars, yet many of them are dead broke within the first decade after their retirement. Meanwhile, many people who earn a fraction of that end up becoming millionaires who retire comfortably because they save up their money, partly by driving ****ty cars.

They might drive cheap cars, eat cheap food, etc. but they don't use them as examples of their wealth.

Listen the fact that posters left out LaFell but included Amendola clearly have a flawed outlook on what matters when evaluating player significance. LaFell had more production as a WR in his first season on the team than Amendola had in his 2 seasons.

Reality is there is a reason Amendola took a salary of $1.25M and it's not because he is a really nice guy it is because nobody else would have paid him more. This is a player that 3 offseasons ago was valued at nearly $6M if that drastic reduction in value isn't an indication of his poor performance in not sure what else to say.

I don't care who you or any poster roots for, but let's be honest and sincere when explaining why you root for them. Production wise Amendola was one of the worst #3 WRs in the NFL so posters suggesting there is no better #3 are basing it on 3-4 games over the 37 games that Amendola has been a member of this team. Those 3-4 games are anomalies and should not be the body of work for which a player is evaluated.

This is why these posters who are bothered by what I have to say about Amendola have to resort to personalizing things with trash talk or disliking my posts. If they could discredit anything I have to say they would but they can't so they have to rely on weak tactics to maintain any position. I love watching these so called "football fans" real tough guys get all bent out of shape over what other posters opinions are of their favorite players.

 

[50-yard-line]

Listen the fact that posters left out LaFell but included Amendola clearly have a flawed outlook on what matters when evaluating player significance. LaFell had more production as a WR in his first season on the team than Amendola had in his 2 seasons.

Except of course that nobody did that.

Nobody did that.

One more time: nobody did that.

You used this thread to take one potshot at a single Pats' player: your whipping boy. I can only assume you came in here looking for some excitement or an internet fight, since the only Patriot you went after in your first post in a negative way was the one you knew would elicit a negative response. I mean, why else would you or anyone else go to the NUMBER 3 Wide Receiver to enter a debate on the quality of the Patriots' roster? So transparent.

And I don't agree with your assessment at all, of course, though I'm sure you'll give me a long list of better #3 WRs in the NFl.

 

[Brady6]

Except of course that nobody did that.

Nobody did that.

One more time: nobody did that.

Did you read the OP? I see our key offensive skill players listed and Danny 200 is there but not LaFell.

I don't really have to give you a list I can just tell you Jeremy Kerley had twice the receiving yards as Amendola in 2014.

 

[50-yard-line]

Did you read the OP? I see our key offensive skill players listed and Danny 200 is there but not LaFell.

I don't really have to give you a list I can just tell you Jeremy Kerley had twice the receiving yards as Amendola in 2014.

He listed four players with an etc. Seriously, that got in your craw?

Exact quote: "He'd take McCoy, Woods, Clay, Watkins etc as much as Gronk, Chandler, Edleman, Amendola etc." Big freaking deal - notice that he also listed Chandler, who's the TE2 and wasn't with the team last year. He was riffing off the top of his head, not driving a KIA to piss you off. He forgot Blount, too, and Brady...

As to your comparison, Kerley started half the games for the Jets and not as the #3 option (Harvin only played 8 games). He had 400 yards and 1 TD, which is about par for his career course.

The guy you love to hate had 3 TDs in the playoffs alone, 2 in a game decided by 3 points and the other in the 4-point Superbowl win. He also made the clutch catches and clutch plays (on ST) that beat Kerley's team both times last season in games decided by less than 3 points, iirc. He's also a MUCH BETTER blocking WR than Kerley, which BB values greatly.

If you'd take Kerley over DA, be my guest. I wouldn't - and it wouldn't be that close, especially now that DA and TFB seem to be on the same page again. If you had asked me in 2012, my answer might have been different, but Kerley's run sideways, at best, since then.

Harvin might be an interesting choice, depending on which Percy shows up (and if it's the good Percy, then Woods will be their number 3), but I can't think of another I'd prefer, especially given the wash-out rate WRs have with the Pats.

And of course, all of this is beside the point. You wanted to get into a brawl again, and so you did.

 

[mgteich]

I see a lot if pride, as all fans should have.

QUESTION 1
If Brady were the quarterback of the Bills, and we had an average quarterback, who here thinks that the patriots would be the better team? I don't.

QUESTION 2
If the Bills had an good NFL quarterback (or perhaps one out of the top 10), how close would the Bills be to the patriots as far as overall talent?

CONCLUSIONS
A) The patriots would be favored to win the division, even if the talent were equal. After all, we have better coaching, a better organization, and lots of experience in being a winning team.
B) We underestimate the value of Brady. It is not just that he is a top franchise quarterback. His influence and effect is much more than that. Brady makes every member of the offense better.

And yes, we (and the media) have discussed the WR issue for many years. Brady makes the WR's much, much better than we have any right to expect from their talent levels. Consider how effective Edelman, LaFell and Amendola would be for Seattle or another playoff team. With Brady, they are a star group of wide receivers.

 

[Brady6]

He listed four players with an etc. Seriously, that got in your craw?

Exact quote: "He'd take McCoy, Woods, Clay, Watkins etc as much as Gronk, Chandler, Edleman, Amendola etc." Big freaking deal - notice that he also listed Chandler, who's the TE2 and wasn't with the team last year. He was riffing off the top of his head, not driving a KIA to piss you off. He forgot Blount, too, and Brady...

As to your comparison, Kerley started half the games for the Jets and not as the #3 option (Harvin only played 8 games). He had 400 yards and 1 TD, which is about par for his career course.

The guy you love to hate had 3 TDs in the playoffs alone, 2 in a game decided by 3 points and the other in the 4-point Superbowl win. He also made the clutch catches and clutch plays (on ST) that beat Kerley's team both times last season in games decided by less than 3 points, iirc. He's also a MUCH BETTER blocking WR than Kerley, which BB values greatly.

If you'd take Kerley over DA, be my guest. I wouldn't - and it wouldn't be that close, especially now that DA and TFB seem to be on the same page again. If you had asked me in 2012, my answer might have been different, but Kerley's run sideways, at best, since then.

Harvin might be an interesting choice, depending on which Percy shows up (and if it's the good Percy, then Woods will be their number 3), but I can't think of another I'd prefer, especially given the wash-out rate WRs have with the Pats.

And of course, all of this is beside the point. You wanted to get into a brawl again, and so you did.

At the end of the day you can like Amendola all you want I don't give a ****, but stop trying to portray him as something he isn't. He is a mediocre WR who has been productive in 3-4 games of a possible 37 that he has been with the Patriots for. I do not love to to hate him but I'm certainly not going to sit here and talk about a player who was making $6M a season and performed well in at best 10-15% of the games he played. I'm not sure why anyone who is a fan of the team would.

You know what makes Butlers interception so great is that he was an UDFA making minimum money who stepped up. People talk about Amendola like wow this guy really stepped up in the playoffs, he didn't step up, in 2 of the 3 playoff games he actually performed around the level that was expected of him when he was signed.

It is honestly hard for me when I see a Revis situation because I agree with Belichick not spending the money on him but then I see us wasting big money for 2 seasons on a player like Amendola. If Edelman wasn't here doing his thing you would feel the impact of Amendola's failures a lot more and most likely share a similar view of him as me. Edelman allows you to overlook Amendola's production and focus on him as a person and teammate and those 2 things make him very likable, but the production is a problem, or it was not so much anymore with the pay reduction.

 

[mgteich]

You know what makes Butlers interception so great is that he was an UDFA making minimum money who stepped up.

What makes Butler's interception so great is that he made it. If Lynch had scored on one of the last two plays of the game, folks would be pointing the blame on the defensive backs involved in allowing the long gain, and on the defense that couldn't finish.

Carroll made this defense a great one, and Butler a potential starter, by calling a pass at the end of the game.

 

[mgteich]

You know what makes Butlers interception so great is that he was an UDFA making minimum money who stepped up.

What makes Butler's interception so great is that he made it. If Lynch had scored on one of the last two plays of the game, folks would be pointing the blame on the defensive backs involved in allowing the long gain, and on the defense that couldn't finish.

Carroll made this defense a great one, and Butler a potential starter, by calling a pass at the end of the game. It also helped that Carroll wasted 30 seconds celebrating after the long catch.

 

[RobertWeathers]

I know I'm going to be called crazy but I wouldn't be surprised if Bills win 11 or more games this year.
I think the teams they will lose to are the Colts and PATS ( may even split with the PATS)
other difficult teams are Texans, Bengals, Eagles, Cowboys but three of those are home games.
This a team with lots of talent and they still have the draft. Rex's Defense is always good and
Greg Roman has the potential to bring a lot of innovation to that Bills offense which has a ton
of talent. Don't underestimate Greg Roman, from what I've read he's very smart, innovative and
his play calling is timely.

If Cassel has a 2008 or 2010 season, yes. The Bills are absolutely capable of 10-11 wins

If Cassel has every other typical year (he gets hurt), they are a 7-8 win team. Orton was up and down but overall was a functional QB last year

 

[ausbacker]

I think you ignore the Brady factor and that inflates the value of the other players in your mind, talent is very different from performance or production.

The Patriots have the best QB in the NFL, the overall roster though is not as strong as people want to believe.

The Patriots are every bit as talented as the best rosters in the NFL. They're also better coached meaning the depth players are willing, capable and able to perform the roles of the starters (where required). Sure, they don't perform as well as the starters but you wouldn't expect someone to replace Gronk.

I'm at ease building around a core unit of Solder, Vollmer, Stork, Edelman, LaFell Gronkowski, Hightower, Collins, McCourty etc. The strength of a team is your middle class. Strong middle class, strong team. Outside of Brady, the Patriots have very good role players that combine to form an excellent team. That's a credit to BB and his team.

 

[IllegalContact]

Where do you get the trophy for the best roster?

You could argue that in 15 years, the pats had the best roster maybe once

 

[IllegalContact]

The pats roster is constituted of bargains......value

And oh yeah, winners

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

Who led a talented roster to an 11-5 record in 2008 and another talented roster to a 10-5 record in 2010. Cassell is a capable QB, he isn't an elite QB but when surrounded with good players he can play in the 12-18 range of starting QBs.

Cassel is in the bottom half of starting QBs..not top half

 

[patsbrasilpatriotas]

I see a lot if pride, as all fans should have.

QUESTION 1
If Brady were the quarterback of the Bills, and we had an average quarterback, who here thinks that the patriots would be the better team? I don't.

QUESTION 2
If the Bills had an good NFL quarterback (or perhaps one out of the top 10), how close would the Bills be to the patriots as far as overall talent?

CONCLUSIONS
A) The patriots would be favored to win the division, even if the talent were equal. After all, we have better coaching, a better organization, and lots of experience in being a winning team.
B) We underestimate the value of Brady. It is not just that he is a top franchise quarterback. His influence and effect is much more than that. Brady makes every member of the offense better.

And yes, we (and the media) have discussed the WR issue for many years. Brady makes the WR's much, much better than we have any right to expect from their talent levels. Consider how effective Edelman, LaFell and Amendola would be for Seattle or another playoff team. With Brady, they are a star group of wide receivers.

QUESTION 1

If Rodgers were the quarterback of the Bills, and we had Brady as ourquarterback, who here thinks that the patriots would be the better team?

Answer: I think. Patriots, IMO. They have plenty of pieces beacuse they dont have to pay a good QB. And yet I think many of their complementary parts despite good have a paycheck far above their talent as Mario Williams and Charles Clay. To pay for the 20m Rodgers, they would have to cut several players.

QUESTION 2

Again Top 10 QB talent costs a lot. They have to sacrifice talent. Revis is an example. The Patriots has a roster as talented as the Bills (more,IMO) and almost TRIPLE space for use in FA in relation to them next year and only two key players to extend.

CONCLUSIONS

Brady is the GOAT, IMO. But, Edelman is a GREAT WR regardless of where he play. I think it's mutual. Brady makes them better, but they also transform him into a more complete player.

If it were an absolute truth what you said, that only the talent of Brady transform all WR in fantastic players, Boyce, Tyms, Dobson would be stars in the league.

 

[mgteich]

QUESTION 1

If Rodgers were the quarterback of the Bills, and we had Brady as ourquarterback, who here thinks that the patriots would be the better team?

Answer: I think. Patriots, IMO. They have plenty of pieces beacuse they dont have to pay a good QB. And yet I think many of their complementary parts despite good have a paycheck far above their talent as Mario Williams and Charles Clay. To pay for the 20m Rodgers, they would have to cut several players.

QUESTION 2

Again Top 10 QB talent costs a lot. They have to sacrifice talent. Revis is an example. The Patriots has a roster as talented as the Bills (more,IMO) and almost TRIPLE space for use in FA in relation to them next year and only two key players to extend.

CONCLUSIONS

Brady is the GOAT, IMO. But, Edelman is a GREAT WR regardless of where he play. I think it's mutual. Brady makes them better, but they also transform him into a more complete player.

If it were an absolute truth what you said, that only the talent of Brady transform all WR in fantastic players, Boyce, Tyms, Dobson would be stars in the league.

So, we have a better roster than the Bills as long as Brady is willing to pay at 1/2 price.

 

[patsbrasilpatriotas]

So, we have a better roster than the Bills as long as Brady is willing to pay at 1/2 price.

Brady is playing for 1/2 price.

In a hypothetical situation in which they find a great QB by 20m a year, who they would yield in exchange, or what ? And how many players they would cut ? With these hypothetical answers , we could reach an imaginary conclusion of who would be better. If they could have Brady or Rodgers with this roster without losing any player , maybe they were favorites because they have the best player in the league with them . But I think for you to pay a top QB you need to get rid of some players .

Hypothetical situation:

They get Aaron Rodgers and his $18,250,000 for ONE first round pick.
They are under $6,924,045 in cap space.
So they have to cut this guys: ( they can cut olther players but they wont save almost nothing)

Mario Williams
Matt Cassel
Nigel Bradham
Cordy Glenn
Richie Incognito
Jarius Wynn

Now they are 1m under the cap to sign all draft picks and and all season mishaps.