Belichick on Meriweather...

[patsox23]

THE KEYS
1) Re-sign Gay
2) Use a Day One draft choice (or Oakland's #3) fo a corner
3) Sign a couple of servicable backups

===============

Oh yes, in addition, we will need to bring in a couple of ILB's.

I totally agree. I'll hate to see it, but I think it's the right choice - let Samuel walk. Re-sign Gay and go hard after a top CB in the draft, while signing a decent-ish, middle-tier FA CB.

 

[captain stone]

More on Meriweather from Pro Football Weekly. Ouch.

http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/Features/Rookie+of+the+Year+Meter/2007/rookie16.htm

 

[mgteich]

I like Andrews a lot. He has developed into a top special teamer and a serviceable dime back. In afact, he was never on the bubble even in his first year. He established himself on the roster as our top gunner.

Hopefully, we followed this up with another future contributer in Richardson. Certainly he started well in his first pre-season. As I indicated, I consider them to part of the team and its future as backups. If they develop into more, then that's gravy.

I knew you were being sarcastic with that remark. I just thought your sarcasm was aimed at the posters who were talking about Richardson and Andrews stepping up. I wanted to point out that I didn't think we were trying to say that would happen, or needed to happen (their taking over for Samuel and Gay).

 

[cstjohn17]

As of now, we are in serious trouble. A #4 will be available on the open market. We will bring in a Chad Scott or two to compete with Richardson for reps. Starting corners are extremely expensive in free agency, nickelbacks less so. I expect us to bring in at least SIX defensive backs to compete for the open spots, and perhaps to upgrade over Richardson or Andrews. I expect 2-3 draftees and 3-4 free agents. Hopefully, one of the free agents signed will be Gay. Another could be Chad Scott.

This is an interesting video from NFL.com, it has Jon Runyan describes the Patriots defense. They tend to rely on the bend but don't break approach, he does a nice job describing the process.
http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d8057fee0

As it relates to the cornerback position I think they will continue to focus on the front seven and fill in pieces in the secondary. Safety is in pretty good shape but cornerback is wide open.

I could see them getting a lot younger at CB, maybe something like this.

1) Hobbs
2) Chad Scott or similar JAG
3) 2nd round pick
5) Willie Andrews (he played some CB in college)
Emergency

5) 3rd round pick
6) Merriweather
7) Richardson (if he can play special teams, special bonus if he can play backup FS)

Throw the numbers in a hat and shake, take which ever order you like. The point is that if they can continue to get solid pressure from the front seven then the CB has a lot more protection. I will miss Samuel (so will the defense), but this is the NFL.

 

[mgteich]

This would be instantly our biggest weakness.

This is an interesting video from NFL.com, it has Jon Runyan describes the Patriots defense. They tend to rely on the bend but don't break approach, he does a nice job describing the process.
http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d8057fee0

As it relates to the cornerback position I think they will continue to focus on the front seven and fill in pieces in the secondary. Safety is in pretty good shape but cornerback is wide open.

I could see them getting a lot younger at CB, maybe something like this.

1) Hobbs
2) Chad Scott or similar JAG
3) 2nd round pick
5) Willie Andrews (he played some CB in college)
Emergency

5) 3rd round pick
6) Merriweather
7) Richardson (if he can play special teams, special bonus if he can play backup FS)

Throw the numbers in a hat and shake, take which ever order you like. The point is that if they can continue to get solid pressure from the front seven then the CB has a lot more protection. I will miss Samuel (so will the defense), but this is the NFL.

 

[spacecrime]

obviously, after reading this thread, we are totally doomed. I just hope we can squeek out another SB before the wheels come off.

Jeez, you guys, lighten up and stop[ pretending no one can replace the players we lost.

Which one of you after 2002 thought would would win the next two SBs?

Plenty of time for doom and gloom when we are in trouble without pretending it is already on us.

 

[sebman2112]

DB thoughts:

It wouldn't surprise if Tim Mixon (CB on the PS) has a better career than Mike Richardson.

Willie Andrews' ceiling is probably top STer, 1B/2A KR, and backup FS.

As for the Stomper, maybe he could try catching with his feet. I would still have drafted the Poz or, gulp, David Harris.

Geno Wilson is probably no longer a starting-caliber FS. His body just can't take it. He should have re-converted to CB after Rodney's return from suspension, if not much sooner.

Scary dream: "Now starting at CB for the Dolphins/Jets...Asante Samuel." Pay the man.

Mike Richardson has flashed some ability during the short time he's been here, so I'm not at all ready to say Tim Mixon is going to outshine him. Maybe the guy can develop, but he hasn't as yet shown me anything at the pro level.

Willie's ceiling may very well be top STer, but I think he could yet develop into a good backup. Also, the Patriots have been converting him to CB, so I don't know about his playing time coming at backup FS.

Just curious, do you generally call Brandon "The Stomper"?

David Harris seems to be developing into a very nice 3-4 LB, and the Patriots could have drafted him, if they had any interest. Remember, he was on the board at 28th overall, but NE didn't want him? So, it wasn't a choice of "Draft Meriweather or Harris", as the Patriots could have drafted both.

As for Poz, he doesn't fit the 3-4 defensive scheme, and would have been a horrid pick for NE at 24th overall.

You're at least somewhat correct about Wilson. He just can't seem to stay healthy, and when he's actually on the field he hasn't been as good.

Samuel's going to the Jets or the Dolphins wouldn't be among the happier moments of my life, but I don't think NE should just "pay the man" either. Yea, sure I'd like to see him in a Patriots uniform for the remainder of his playing career (or at least the remainder of his prime), but not at $10M per season, which is what he's going to get on the open market.

 

[sebman2112]

More on Meriweather from Pro Football Weekly. Ouch.

http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/Features/Rookie+of+the+Year+Meter/2007/rookie16.htm

The Part in bold is completely false:

3. Patriots S Brandon Meriweather (first round, 24th overall): The only 2007 Patriots draftee still on the roster, he’s not even a regular in DB-heavy sub packages.

Meriweather has seen increased playing time over the past few weeks, and has made positive plays while he's out their. The fact that he's even dropped three INT's points to his seeing more playing time, and their opinion ("He's not even a regular in DB-heavy sub packages.") being mostly false. I say mostly because earlier this season I would have agreed with that statement, but it's inaccurate at this point (the article was posted a few days ago).

 

[ALP]

if u watch on nfl.com, theres a video about the pats drafts....

a good point is made....the pats have not missed on a first round pick ever (with BB hear)

so ill take my chances on both, maroney and meriweather

 

[cstjohn17]

This would be instantly our biggest weakness.

The CB position will take a step backwards next year, that is what happens when you lose a pro bowl player and have no credible backups.

With the offense scoring 30+ per game the weakness can be managed if the front seven is stout.

 

[ATippett56]

More on Meriweather from Pro Football Weekly. Ouch.

http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/Features/Rookie+of+the+Year+Meter/2007/rookie16.htm

Meanwhile .........

4. Jets LB David Harris
Season stats (15 games): 116 tackles, four sacks, two forced fumbles, one fumble recovery
Week 16 stats: eight tackles, one sack, one forced fumble
Last week’s ranking: 5
Stock: Steady

Not only does he consistently put up impressive numbers, but Harris seemingly delivers at least one attention-grabbing highlight each game. On Sunday against the Titans, it was his backside pursuit and subsequent strip-sack of Vince Young. Once the Jets acquire a couple beefy D-linemen to tie up blockers, Harris will evolve from rookie standout to perennial Pro Bowler.

 

[mgteich]

No one has said we are doomed. It seems more appropriate to recognize our weakness than to make believe we have the answers in Richardson and Andrews, or that top aorner play is no big deal. It is a big deal, just as having top wide receivers is a big deal.

obviously, after reading this thread, we are totally doomed. I just hope we can squeek out another SB before the wheels come off.

Jeez, you guys, lighten up and stop[ pretending no one can replace the players we lost.

Which one of you after 2002 thought would would win the next two SBs?

Plenty of time for doom and gloom when we are in trouble without pretending it is already on us.

 

[bigdgp]

“He’s improved through the course of the year and there’s still a lot of things he needs to work on,” Belichick said, “but I think he gives us good depth at the position. I’d like to see him catch the ball a little better, but . . . he’s around it and I think he’s making progress.”

Meriweather was asked about his coach’s remarks.

“I have a lot to improve on. I’m still learning how to be a pro and do all the little things right,” he said. “I’m still not even close to where the program wants me to be or where I want to be as a player. For coach to say something like that I have to just take it in stride. I’m happy he feels like I’m improving, but I have a lot of work to do.”

When did the light go on? When did he have his eureka moment?

“I wouldn’t say it was a eureka moment. I felt like it was something I should have been doing sooner, to be honest with you,” he said. “But it was me being young and not understanding how important certain things are. But thanks to the coaching staff we’ve got, I’m learning how to be a pro and how to be a player.”



Good to hear Meriweather acknowledge whatever maturity issues he's trying to overcome. If he can develop into a good, solid player - James Sanders redux+ - that'll go a long way toward stabilizing our secondary as the future comes. Wish to Hell he could show real flashes at CB, but he doesn't appear capable of starting at that position in the NFL.

I can't believe that we had 5 pages of thread about Meriweather and no one connected his maturation to the Sean Taylor murder. I would imagine that incident had a tremendous impact on him?

 

[onegameatatime]

More on Meriweather from Pro Football Weekly. Ouch.

http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/Features/Rookie+of+the+Year+Meter/2007/rookie16.htm

Anyone else notice that of the top 10, while a few are on teams could make the playoffs, not one is on a team that has clinched a playoff spot?

Of the next 10, only 3 are on current playoff teams.

Meanwhile, of the top 10 "duds," 5 are on playoff teams.

Hmmm ... maybe bad teams have more places to start people and good teams do not??

I would be worried about a first round WR who can't get on the field in New Orleans.

 

[patsox23]

Anyone else notice, EVER, that profootballweekly.com has been CONSISTENTLY wrong about crap for YEARS now? It's a RAG.

 

[sebman2112]

Anyone else notice, EVER, that profootballweekly.com has been CONSISTENTLY wrong about crap for YEARS now? It's a RAG.

Agreed. I've actually had a simular opinion of their mag/site for a while now, but I didn't bother pointing it out with my previous response.

 

[captain stone]

1) Mike Richardson has flashed some ability during the short time he's been here, so I'm not at all ready to say Tim Mixon is going to outshine him. Maybe the guy can develop, but he hasn't as yet shown me anything at the pro level.

2) Willie's ceiling may very well be top STer, but I think he could yet develop into a good backup. Also, the Patriots have been converting him to CB, so I don't know about his playing time coming at backup FS.

3) Just curious, do you generally call Brandon "The Stomper"?

4) David Harris seems to be developing into a very nice 3-4 LB, and the Patriots could have drafted him, if they had any interest. Remember, he was on the board at 28th overall, but NE didn't want him? So, it wasn't a choice of "Draft Meriweather or Harris", as the Patriots could have drafted both.

As for Poz, he doesn't fit the 3-4 defensive scheme, and would have been a horrid pick for NE at 24th overall.

5) You're at least somewhat correct about Wilson. He just can't seem to stay healthy, and when he's actually on the field he hasn't been as good.

6) Samuel's going to the Jets or the Dolphins wouldn't be among the happier moments of my life, but I don't think NE should just "pay the man" either. Yea, sure I'd like to see him in a Patriots uniform for the remainder of his playing career (or at least the remainder of his prime), but not at $10M per season, which is what he's going to get on the open market.

1) Mike Richardson was an undistinguished DB on a horrible ND defense. I'll be shocked if he becomes anything more than a ST JAG.

2) Andrews did play both CB and S at Baylor. If he could develop into a dime CB, that would be terrific. His may still be better-served facing the action.

3) Until he becomes known for things other than kicking opponents and dropping INTs, then he shall heretofore remain "The Stomper."

4) I felt then, and still do now, that the Poz could have been drafted as Bruschi's WILB replacement. Though not as stoutly-built as Tedy, Poz could have topped-out at 6'1 1/2", 245, with off-the-chart intangibles.

Our backup LBs are the worst in football, hands down. Backups, and eventually replacements, must be acquired via the draft, in addition to free agency.

5) Thanks. I'm glad that I'm at least somewhat correct about something.

6) The FO probably won't pay Samuel $10M/season, but it will have to spend at least half that amount to adequately replace him, through both a top-100 draft pick, and a solid mid-career FA.

 

[sebman2112]

1) Mike Richardson was an undistinguished DB on a horrible ND defense. I'll be shocked if he becomes anything more than a ST JAG.

2) Andrews did play both CB and S at Baylor. If he could develop into a dime CB, that would be terrific. His may still be better-served facing the action.

3) Until he becomes known for things other than kicking opponents and dropping INTs, then he shall heretofore remain "The Stomper."

4) I felt then, and still do now, that the Poz could have been drafted as Bruschi's WILB replacement. Though not as stoutly-built as Tedy, Poz could have topped-out at 6'1 1/2", 245, with off-the-chart intangibles.

Our backup LBs are the worst in football, hands down. Backups, and eventually replacements, must be acquired via the draft, in addition to free agency.

5) Thanks. I'm glad that I'm at least somewhat correct about something.

6) The FO probably won't pay Samuel $10M/season, but it will have to spend at least half that amount to adequately replace him, through both a top-100 draft pick, and a solid mid-career FA.

Yes, Notre Dame has struggled defensively, and Mike wasn't considered a top prospect coming out. That I will agree on, but I do think Mike has shown some flashes of talent/ability. First, let's look at his career stats at ND:

170 total tackles, 13 tackles for loss, 8 INT's, 12 PBU's, 5 forced fumbles, and 3 sacks.

Those numbers don't really jump out at you, but their good numbers, and his having an impact in multiple aspects of the game shows some potential versatility. He was also one of the few members of that team to come up with a big play in the Sugar Bowl against LSU (he recorded an INT).

Since becoming a Patriot Richardson continued to flash potential during the 2007 preseason. Yea, it was "Just the preseason", as some might say, but that's all we really have to go on right now. I'm not saying he's going to be a starting CB in the NFL, but he could be a nice Nickle.


Let me guess, you were among those arguing against Meriweather's selection? You're entitled to you're opinion, but I personally find it somewhat immature for you to consistently Refer to him as "The Stomper". I also think you'll be eating those words within the next few years, but that's just my opinion.

Poz doesn't fit NE's defensive scheme, as I said leading up to the draft. David Harris was a good fit, but as I just pointed out, NE could have drafted him at 28th overall if they truly had any interest.

I do agree the Patriots could use an upgrade at LB this offseason, but I think just about everyone on this board would agree with that. If one of their main upgrades comes from the draft I'd like it to be Rey Maualuga. Quentin Groves is an option at OLB, as are Gholston and Crable. The other ILB's I've had some interest in are Jon Goff (I like him a lot), Beau Bell, Gooden, Leman, and Larsen. In free agency I've been thinking Victor Hobson could be a decent sign, and he shouldn't cost top dollar. Karlos Dansby could be an option, but he'll be more expensive.

There's no doubt NE will have to spend some money on the secondary this offseason. Maybe that means bringing in one or two mid-level CB's along with a 3rd or 4th round CB, and a flyer at DB. Maybe that means drafting a CB in the first two rounds, while bringing in a vet to compete, and signing another DB in the 4th or 5th. In any case I'm not saying they shouldn't spend. I'm simply saying that I don't believe they'll match the top offer given to Samuel, and that I don't have any confidence in his giving them any discount.

Also, if NE happens to draft someone like Jenkins or Cason what's to say they can't turn into an even better corner than Samuel, with a cheaper initial pricetag?

Remember, Samuel was a 4th round pick, and had trouble holding onto the ball until working with the Nerf during the 2006 offseason. By saying that I'm not in any way trying to discount Samuel's current accomplishments. What I am saying is that NE has been able to develop their CB prospects, and it would be interesting to see what someone like Cason (who already returns INT's for TD's in college) would be able to do in NE's system.

 

[captain stone]

The preceding is exactly why I dig reading your posts, Seb.

Your college knowledge, faith in our FO/projects, and even-tempered rebuttals make a tasty dish of objective, rational homerism.

And I do hope that I am wrong about Meriweather. I, too, enjoy being served humble pie, esp. when downed with champagne.

 

[primetime]

1) Mike Richardson was an undistinguished DB on a horrible ND defense. I'll be shocked if he becomes anything more than a ST JAG.

I agree with this one. That ND secondary got turned into swiss cheese by pro style offenses all year. USC, LSU... they burned the hell out of them. Richardson might be an okay special teamer, and he didn't look bad in the preseason... but people who think he's going to turn into the next great corner are sorely mistaken.

I think Meriweather will turn out fine. I'd rather have Jon Beason (I think Belichick and Pioli would too), but that's neither here nor there. Pretty sure the Patriots wanted Beason, and when he was selected by the Panthers before they picked, they traded out of their second pick.