Belichick: Most Important Defensive Stat is Points Allowed

[fightingirish595]

I think a better way to look at it is that there are 100s of stats that underlie the one that truly matters how many points you allow (and to clarify its not just one because turnovers are close to equally important).
There are many different ways, many areas to be strong or weak, to get to the final result of how many points you allowed.
I do not buy the theory that one way is better than another (i.e. if your D allows fewer points than mine, but by 3rd down and red zone #s are better than means its a fluke). Its about getting the job done, and NFL history shows that getting the job done no matter how you have to do it is the hallmark of winning teams, not a certain means of getting the job done.

Of course, all of this is kind of bs anyway because football simply isn't a game that can be analyzed effectively with statistics. All that is needed is one statement to prove that correct: WHEN did the points get scored?(as in game situation..a TD when you are losing by 28 does not have the same value as one when you are down 6 or up 2, but statistically they are all the same)

I like the last point because this reminds me of the 2nd half of the Miami game where people were going crazy because we could not stop Miami. But it was obvious we were just trying to get out of there with a wn. Trading Yards for time. And i Like the poimt you made about the fluke. Turnovers will greatly knock down PPG. At the end of the day I let my eyes form my opinion. And use the stats to back up my argument.

 

[Tony2046]

I could be wrong, but I just got the feeling that some people here think yards/game mattered more. Obviously both yards and points are important but people here differ on which is more important.

Not really or at least not from the posts I read.

To paraphrase, you can say the Pats defense is the 2nd most successful defense in the league but not the second best defense in the league.

That is what I interpreted from the posts.

But I also agree with those that think this defense will continue to improve through continuous player and scheme adjustments. Probably will end up top 5 D when all is said in done which is significant when you consider they also have a, if not the, top rated offense.

 

[fightingirish595]

Ah, yes. They lost a game, therefore third-down D is more important than points. I'm sure the loss had nothing to do with Crumpler dropping an easy TD or Brady running for his life. Or the Jets playing out of their minds for a day.

The Jets pass rush wasnt the difference that day. No one could get open. for the pats-The lack of a pass rush is what held them back. They relied heavily on turnovers all year. Smoke and Mirrors. they simply werent that good.

 

[JMC00]

I don't know why the NFL ranks them in terms of yardage...so dumb.

I think the reason I heard was yards allowed only gets credited to the defense, where with points offense and special teams can allow them, Pick 6, fumble return, punt return TD, KO return TD, blocked/missed FG returned for TD, Safeties.

 

[fair catch fryar]

He's BB, so obviously no one else has the credentials to argue, but for me personally and a lot of posters here we just dream about someday having a defense that is as dominating as the offense and absolutely curb-stomping the life out of the rest of the league. I get wood just thinking about having an all-time/all-world dominating defense while Brady is still playing.

In the end, I'll be just as happy with winning the Superbowl.

 

[Ring 6]

BB's defensive philosophy defines the irony of winning football being frustrating to watch as a fan.

I don't think people around here are aware that since BB arrived in 2000, this has been a top 3 defense in the NFL.
From 2001-today The Patriots are 2nd in points allowed, and are half a point a game from being #1.
If you include 2000, they are 3.
They are also #1 in takeaways and #6 in sacks, by the way.

Anyone who questions BBs defensive philosophy just doesn't get it.

 

[Fixit]

No one could get open. The lack of a pass rush is what held them back. They relied heavily on turnovers all year. Smoke and Mirrors. they simply werent that good.

They were good over the span of 16 games, then not good for one. Also, I bolded something that was probably the main reason for the loss, and it wasn't the third-down D.

 

[Ring 6]

He's BB, so obviously no one else has the credentials to argue, but for me personally and lot of posters here we just dream about someday having a defense that is as dominating as the offense and absolutely curb-stomping the life out of the rest of the league.

In the end, I'll be just as happy with winning the Superbowl.

Is a 15 year run of being #2 in stopping the opponent from scoring, #1 in forcing turnovers, and #6 in sacks not dominating?
Whose defense would you rather have had?

 

[Fixit]

Enough fun. Time to play video games!

 

[fightingirish595]

They were good over the span of 16 games, then not good for one. Also, I bolded something that was probably the main reason for the loss, and it wasn't the third-down D.

Your proving my point, they gave up 28 points that day. When they played a good defense, they could not live up to their regular season numbers, You cant expect them too. Sure maybe the Pats go against the norm and will light up everyone and score 30 points and it wont matter. I think thats what some people are worried about. going up against a team with a very good defense, We get held to 20 points, and lose. (I am not suggesting this defense is bad or is going to give up 28 to a team like the 2010 Jets). I wanna see more of what I saw in the 2nd half against Cincy

 

[fair catch fryar]

Is a 15 year run of being #2 in stopping the opponent from scoring, #1 in forcing turnovers, and #6 in sacks not dominating?
Whose defense would you rather have had?

Personally, I don't feel any need what-so-ever to have defend my "fandom" and admiration of the Patriots to you because you always seem to be looking just for an argument for the sake of arguing. I am only fantasizing of seeing the Patriots having a defense similar to the great defenses of the past if not for one year. I know how extremely hard is to do that so I'm not finding fault...just dreaming...that's all.

 

[Ring 6]

Your proving my point, they gave up 28 points that day. When they played a good defense, they could not live up to their regular season numbers, You cant expect them too. Sure maybe the Pats go against the norm and will light up everyone and score 30 points and it wont matter. I think thats what some people are worried about. going up against a team with a very good defense, We get held to 20 points, and lose. (I am not suggesting this defense is bad or is going to give up 28 to a team like the 2010 Jets). I wanna see more of what I saw in the 2nd half against Cincy

You seem to not understand correlation and causation.
You simply cannot pick one football game and say it proves your point of what out of hundreds of factors in a football game are most important. If your argument were correct, then how did they beat the same team 45-3 6 weeks earlier? How did they win win 8 in a row to end the season, including both teams that would go to the SB, and 5 teams out of 8 were playoff teams? (By an average score of 36-18 btw)

 

[Ring 6]

Personally, I don't feel any need what-so-ever to have defend my "fandom" and admiration of the Patriots to you because you always seem to be looking just for an argument for the sake of arguing. I am only fantasizing of seeing the Patriots having a defense similar to the great defenses of the past if not for one year. I know how extremely hard is to do that so I'm not finding fault...just dreaming...that's all.

And I'm saying you have had a great defense for years, and don't know it.
No clue what you are talking about with defending your fandom.
The point of defense is to stop the other team from scoring, take the ball away, and win games, and you are witnessing a historic run of success at that, and wishing for something else.

 

[fightingirish595]

You seem to not understand correlation and causation.
You simply cannot pick one football game and say it proves your point of what out of hundreds of factors in a football game are most important. If your argument were correct, then how did they beat the same team 45-3 6 weeks earlier? How did they win win 8 in a row to end the season, including both teams that would go to the SB, and 5 teams out of 8 were playoff teams? (By an average score of 36-18 btw)

We can agree to disagree Andy. I get it. You can take everything that happens in the refular season and throw it out of your window. It doesnt matter. Defense. Wins. Championships. It always has. It always will. The teams problem from for a very long time was the lack of a pass rush. The Nfl is a constantly evolving game but you better be able to stop teams in the playoffs, That is the thing that has always remained constant

Edit:That being said the offense and defense has had shortcomings in the same game in nearly every playoff loss.

 

[deters]

Of course its the most important because you always want to have more points than the points you allowed, thus giving you a win... lol

 

[Adam Seward]

WE CANT GET SACKS, MCCOURTY IS OVERRATED, WHO TRADED JONES?

On a more serious note, Mike Lombardi loves the red zone 3rd down stat, or as he calls them, 4 point plays.

 

[ALP]

I don't think people around here are aware that since BB arrived in 2000, this has been a top 3 defense in the NFL.
From 2001-today The Patriots are 2nd in points allowed, and are half a point a game from being #1.
If you include 2000, they are 3.
They are also #1 in takeaways and #6 in sacks, by the way.

Anyone who questions BBs defensive philosophy just doesn't get it.

so other team has BBs and Pats consistency...not sure how much this talks to great defenses really

 

[TheFlyingWedge]

Did anyone say it wasn't? I believe the contention is that points allowed isn't the be-all, end-all measurement of a defense.

Usually when it comes to anointing the "Number One Defense" by the NFL's PR machine along with the mainstream media,"Yards Allowed" is the stat they look at. Not sure if anybody was arguing that point here though.

 

[patchick]

And in the article the coach names three: points, turnovers, 3rd down, and red zone (points per trip, I'd guess). Then McCourty confirms that thinking.

Yep, that seems like a hard list to argue with. (3rd-down efficiency is the one area that really concerns me about this defense.)

The key is that every item on the list is specifically about obtaining possession or keeping points off the board. Not yardage, not completion percentage, and NOT sacks or QB pressures.

 

[Ring 6]

We can agree to disagree Andy. I get it. You can take everything that happens in the refular season and throw it out of your window. It doesnt matter. Defense. Wins. Championships. It always has. It always will. The teams problem from for a very long time was the lack of a pass rush. The Nfl is a constantly evolving game but you better be able to stop teams in the playoffs, That is the thing that has always remained constant

Edit:That being said the offense and defense has had shortcomings in the same game in nearly every playoff loss.

This is probably the most successful run in NFL history.
This teams doesn't have any 'problem for a very long time'.
You seem to not understand that the average NFL team is completing 23 passes every game, and getting sacked less than 3 times, and suddenly expect the Patriots to have a pass rush that never allows the other team to complete a pass. You are looking at the pinnacle of success and complaining because you wish it was something that is totally unrealistic. Cliches like defense wins championships are not an argument, by the way.
Yeah, I guess we agree to disagree because I don't believe you will ever get it.