BB on James Sanders

[DW Toys]

Sanders may not be an all-pro, but safety is not the Pats' highest priority. He and Meriweather are young, have upsides, and aren't liabilities.

Anyone who says Sanders sucks pretends to know more than BB. Credible? You make the call.

True, sometimes you just have to run with what you have and be darn proud of it. What makes you think Safety is not a high priority? I would suspect it actually is.
DW Toys

 

[mgteich]

To be clear, your position is that Vrabel was traded to be KC's defensive captain because Belichick has no faith whatever in the the OLB's on the team? I would suggest that it is more likely that Belichick believes that the current crew can play reasonably well in 2009. He probably has much more faith than posters in Woods, Banta-Cain, Crable and Redd.

Many posters want us to draft a prospect who would contribute a lot in 2010, the eventual replacement for Thomas. That would REQUIRE that the current crew be good enough to replace Vrabel's production in 2009.

Other posters are consistent with the idea of a current huge weakness at OLB and want to draft someone who can take lots of reps this year. I think that this is a reasonable position, but this position requires us to believe that either Vrabel is all washed up or that Belichick took a tremedous risk in trading him, rather than keeping him in the mix as we did with Bruschi.

But value is a function of need as well. Dropping Vrabel is a sign that the OLBs need improvement/youth. Signing two big name CBs is a sign that the CBs need improvement. Likewise drafting a safety on day 1 or an OLB on day 1 would be a sign that those positions need improvement. Sanders might be a solid backup player and knows the system but he can be improved upon. Not every player on the Pats is a franchise or very good player. BB tries to get stronger on EVERY position on the roster. He has said as much before.

 

[JackBauer]

True, sometimes you just have to run with what you have and be darn proud of it. What makes you think Safety is not a high priority? I would suspect it actually is.
DW Toys

Because we have much greater deficiencies elsewhere, like LB and OL.

 

[tedylb]

True, sometimes you just have to run with what you have and be darn proud of it. What makes you think Safety is not a high priority? I would suspect it actually is.
DW Toys

I said safety is not the team's highest priority. most wuld agree.

As for your "expertise", the Pats are anxiously awaiting your resume.

 

[Real World]

He's still just ok, and not anything special. At 25, he's still got time though. I'd expect him to play better with a better supporting cast in the defensive backfield.

 

[Mack Herron]

Anyone who says Sanders sucks pretends to know more than BB. Credible? You make the call.

Can we say that Deltha O'Neal sucks?

 

[VJCPatriot]

To be clear, your position is that Vrabel was traded to be KC's defensive captain because Belichick has no faith whatever in the the OLB's on the team? I would suggest that it is more likely that Belichick believes that the current crew can play reasonably well in 2009. He probably has much more faith than posters in Woods, Banta-Cain, Crable and Redd.

Many posters want us to draft a prospect who would contribute a lot in 2010, the eventual replacement for Thomas. That would REQUIRE that the current crew be good enough to replace Vrabel's production in 2009.

Other posters are consistent with the idea of a current huge weakness at OLB and want to draft someone who can take lots of reps this year. I think that this is a reasonable position, but this position requires us to believe that either Vrabel is all washed up or that Belichick took a tremedous risk in trading him, rather than keeping him in the mix as we did with Bruschi.

Isn't it more of a risk to stick with someone who you believe is washed up? See the departures of McGinest and Colvin. BB believes in getting rid of a player a year early rather than a year late. Sanders getting signed to a 3M per year contract is a bigger vote of confidence than Vrabel getting traded away as a throw in as part of the Cassel trade if you want to play that card.

I think Sanders is considered at least an adequate player if BB was willing to pay him 3M. But he's no Rodney Harrison. I've seen Rodney Harrison play in his prime. I'd like to see the Pats draft the next Harrison to groom behind Sanders and Meriweather and hopefully take over the starting spot in a couple of years.

 

[JackBauer]

I think Sanders is considered at least an adequate player if BB was willing to pay him 3M. But he's no Rodney Harrison. I've seen Rodney Harrison play in his prime. I'd like to see the Pats draft the next Harrison to groom behind Sanders and Meriweather and hopefully take over the starting spot in a couple of years.

If only it were that simple.

You do realize that Rodney Harrison is a once-in-a-decade type of player, right?

Any replacement you draft is more likely to be another James Sanders than a Rodney Harrison.

 

[mgteich]

Everyone would like to draft another Harrison in his prime. We don't get that choice. If anyone in this draft were considered anywhere near that good, he'd be drafted in the top two or three picks. Perhaps I forget that we posters have sxecret game films and crystal balls which have Delmas as the next Polamalu while the rest of the league has him as a rather normal second round draft choice.

With regard to Vrabel, I don't understand the point of cutting a player with no replacement unless we think he can't play. Is Banta-Cain or Crable really as good a #3 OLB as Vrabel? Apparently so. BTW, this also means that our player personnel folks are questionable since their boss traded for Vrabel and doesn't think that he is washed up.

For the record, I do want to draft a strong safety, same as almost everyone here. However, I don't expect anyone in this draft to start anytime soon for us. That's fine. Our #3 safety will get lots of work if he is any good.

Also, I believe the linebackers we have will be fine for 2009. The biggest danger is that one of the ILB's will be injured or underperform.

Isn't it more of a risk to stick with someone who you believe is washed up? See the departures of McGinest and Colvin. BB believes in getting rid of a player a year early rather than a year late. Sanders getting signed to a 3M per year contract is a bigger vote of confidence than Vrabel getting traded away as a throw in as part of the Cassel trade if you want to play that card.

I think Sanders is considered at least an adequate player if BB was willing to pay him 3M. But he's no Rodney Harrison. I've seen Rodney Harrison play in his prime. I'd like to see the Pats draft the next Harrison to groom behind Sanders and Meriweather and hopefully take over the starting spot in a couple of years.

 

[DW Toys]

Because we have much greater deficiencies elsewhere, like LB and OL.

Not according to Reiss.OL is not as pressing. LB is important but less so than Safety?
If you think about our roster on the whole, even if you and your following have established that the staring SS is good to go and irreplaceable, we need a Safety or even two in the draft.

Let us observe:
ILB
Alexander, Eric
Guyton, Gary
Mayo, Jerod
Bruschi, Tedy

OLB
Crable, Shawn
Redd, Vince
Ruud, Bo
Thomas, Adalius
Banta-Cain, Tully
Woods, Pierre

S
Spann, Antwain
Sanders, James
Meriweather, Brandon
Williams, Tank


DW Toys

 

[DW Toys]

Isn't it more of a risk to stick with someone who you believe is washed up? See the departures of McGinest and Colvin. BB believes in getting rid of a player a year early rather than a year late. Sanders getting signed to a 3M per year contract is a bigger vote of confidence than Vrabel getting traded away as a throw in as part of the Cassel trade if you want to play that card.

I think Sanders is considered at least an adequate player if BB was willing to pay him 3M. But he's no Rodney Harrison. I've seen Rodney Harrison play in his prime. I'd like to see the Pats draft the next Harrison to groom behind Sanders and Meriweather and hopefully take over the starting spot in a couple of years.

How much does Jarvis Green make? Isn't he a back up? Doesn't he make more money than Wilfork right now? I am just asking.
DW Toys

 

[DW Toys]

Because we have much greater deficiencies elsewhere, like LB and OL.

Assessing team needs
Email|Link|Comments (0) Posted by Mike Reiss, Globe Staff April 4, 2009 12:35 PM

ANALYSIS

Pat Kirwan of NFL.com breaks down his view on the needs of each AFC East team entering the NFL Draft. This is a good exercise to follow through on when assessing which players teams might select on draft day.

In summary, Kirwan lists the Patriots' needs this way:

# OLB
# S
# ILB
# RB
# WR
# OT
# QB

Assessing needs requires a multi-layered view -- one that factors in the short-term as well as the long-term. With this in mind, I'd shuffle around the above list a bit by including the defensive line and offensive guard.

The reason I'd include defensive line is that Jarvis Green, Richard Seymour, Le Kevin Smith and Vince Wilfork all have contracts that expire after the 2009 season. At offensive guard, starters Logan Mankins and Stephen Neal, as well as top reserves Russ Hochstein and Billy Yates, have contracts that expire after the 2009 season.

So while the Patriots appear well stocked at those positions heading into the draft, the team's decision-makers must look ahead to the future as well.

 

[DW Toys]

i said safety is not the team's highest priority. Most wuld agree.

As for your "expertise", the pats are anxiously awaiting your resume.

see the reiss comment on the jb reply

 

[Deus Irae]

see the reiss comment on the jb reply

Safety: James Sanders was re-signed and former first-round draft pick Brandon Meriweather is developing, but both are more comfortable in the box and gave up too many big plays in coverage last season. Even if Rodney Harrison returns, he'll be a liability in deep coverage. The Patriots need a player with some range in the secondary.

I'm not sure how this is supposed to be a particular knock on Sanders....

 

[JackBauer]

Not according to Reiss.OL is not as pressing. LB is important but less so than Safety?
If you think about our roster on the whole, even if you and your following have established that the staring SS is good to go and irreplaceable, we need a Safety or even two in the draft.

Let us observe:
ILB
Alexander, Eric
Guyton, Gary
Mayo, Jerod
Bruschi, Tedy

OLB
Crable, Shawn
Redd, Vince
Ruud, Bo
Thomas, Adalius
Banta-Cain, Tully
Woods, Pierre

S
Spann, Antwain
Sanders, James
Meriweather, Brandon
Williams, Tank


DW Toys

If Mayo goes down, we're royally screwed.

If Sanders or Meriweather go down, it's a hit, sure, but we could make do.

OL is pressing, IMO, because we'd be upgrading two positions at once.

 

[JackBauer]

I'm not sure how this is supposed to be a particular knock on Sanders....

I like Reiss and all, but Meriweather doesn't have range?

 

[DW Toys]

I'm not sure how this is supposed to be a particular knock on Sanders....

Didn't say it was. We were talking needs and priorities.
DW Toys

 

[DW Toys]

If Mayo goes down, we're royally screwed.

If Sanders or Meriweather go down, it's a hit, sure, but we could make do.

OL is pressing, IMO, because we'd be upgrading two positions at once.

Great point on Mayo. We agree. Reiss seems to think we need a OG first. I am thinking the Bears need a pick or two and last years Bears #1 choice Chris Williams could be up for trade. He is recovered from his injury. They just got Pace and wanted Williams to move to the right side but it is not a natural position for him. He is a LT. How about #47?
It might solve a lot. Light to RT, Kaczur shares time at RG with Neal to prepare for 2010 and Williams gets his feet wet at LT.
Then the Bears trade up for a WR.
Thoughts.
DW Toys

 

[DW Toys]

I like Reiss and all, but Meriweather doesn't have range?

I think it was the other guy Kirwan who said Merriweather had no range, not Reiss. He has range I believe.
DW Toys

 

[mgteich]

IMHO, we would lose the #47 pick and be weaker at LT, weaker at RG and just about the same at RT.

If you want to improve the OL, just draft a RT better than Kaczur or trade for one.

And of you want to reduce the risk at RG and backup center, then draft a C/OG.

Great point on Mayo. We agree. Reiss seems to think we need a OG first. I am thinking the Bears need a pick or two and last years Bears #1 choice Chris Williams could be up for trade. He is recovered from his injury. They just got Pace and wanted Williams to move to the right side but it is not a natural position for him. He is a LT. How about #47?
It might solve a lot. Light to RT, Kaczur shares time at RG with Neal to prepare for 2010 and Williams gets his feet wet at LT.
Then the Bears trade up for a WR.
Thoughts.
DW Toys