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Barack Obama talks downright lucidly about religion and politics.

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by weswelker#83, Jun 14, 2008.

  1. weswelker#83

    weswelker#83 Rookie

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    Barack Obama talks downright lucidly about religion and politics. The Bible "suggests slavery is okay and that eating shellfish is abomination"

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jg8lCLumByw



    The right wing will iso this out of context and try to crucify him for this, but it is the most f...... lucid and intelligent thing I've ever heard from the mouth of a politician.
  2. otis p. driftwood

    otis p. driftwood Rookie

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    Did anyone else here have an odd moment seeing wes and "talks...lucidly" in the same sentence?
  3. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    The Bible, Far Left Wingers hate the Bible, Bill Clinton used the Bible as his own personal little "Sunday Prop" he hasn't been seen carrying a Bible since the day he and his awful wife walked out of the White House with all The Silverware.
  4. otis p. driftwood

    otis p. driftwood Rookie

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    You remember that giant one he carried that Easter Sunday he went home and ruined Monica's hair-do?
  5. BelichickFan

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    #24 Jersey

    Most of the country claims to believe in God, etc, I'd be careful where I walked if I were The Prince.
  6. otis p. driftwood

    otis p. driftwood Rookie

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    See, there you go, being all right wing and taking it out of context.
  7. weswelker#83

    weswelker#83 Rookie

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    I know plenty of reasonable religious folks who have been really tired of the extremists hijacking their Bible and religion and making them look like fools by association. This is excatly the sort of candidate they want.
  8. BelichickFan

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    #24 Jersey

    Honestly I didn't watch the clip. The Prince repulses me, I can't stomach watching him.
  9. Harry Boy

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    Does anybody in the Obama Suck A$s Media have the balls to ask this Jerk Obama if he plans on placing his right hand on The Holy Bible and saying "So help Me God" when he is sworn in.

    :bricks:
  10. otis p. driftwood

    otis p. driftwood Rookie

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    You do realize "reasonable" is an objective description, right? I mean, to certain people Hitler was "reasonable".
  11. weswelker#83

    weswelker#83 Rookie

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    I don't want my laws based on the Bible anymore than on the Koran or the Torah. I want them based on the Constitution. Is that really too much to ask?
  12. weswelker#83

    weswelker#83 Rookie

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    And to certain people Bush was "reasonable" ... ;)
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2008
  13. BelichickFan

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    #24 Jersey

    What did the Constitution originally say about Blacks and Slavery ? The Prince is going to have to tread lightly here, a LOT of middle of the road (R)s and (D)s are very religious.
  14. PatsFanInVa

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    I think he elucidated VERY clearly the crux of the "biblical"/"religious" dilemma in politics, when he said that whatever you believe or seek to put into legislation, you have to express it in terms open to argument.

    It's a red herring to say "reasonable" is a subjective term. It OBJECTIVE to say that one must be able to discuss without recourse to a private belief, instead translating that belief into something that can be discussed vis a vis our shared values.

    I don't always agree with Obama, but he does consistently see through the bs we've been caught in for a long time.

    I don't expect the fringe right wingers here to see the value in what he's doing. Harry and his 30 point type, for example - you can't penetrate that kind of thing with reason. But this is the kind of cool-headed, no nonsense description that made Hillary look like a shrill hag, and is going to make McCain look like a doddering old fool by November.
  15. otis p. driftwood

    otis p. driftwood Rookie

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    Um, that's why I said it was an objective term.

    :D
  16. scout

    scout Rookie

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    #15 Jersey

    Recently, Chris Mathews was interviewing two individuals who had major roles in the Christian right movement (one was in the Bush Administration), and they both stated that the Christian voters favored Obama over McCain. That Obama uses key words similar to what Bush had used in his speeches. They did say, that the Wright incident could come up again and change the landscape.
    I was a little surprised by this, but had at least figured the right wasn't going to come out in droves to vote for McCain.
  17. PatsFanInVa

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    Yeah you did actually. But then in context you clarified that "to certain people Hitler was reasonable," saying in two successive statements two absolutely contradictory things.

    Unless, of course, you believe that by an absolute, non-relativistic standard, Hitler was reasonable?
  18. PatsFanInVa

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    Don't get me wrong about my Obama enthusiasm, but the guy is smart. I mean, I prefer him to McCain, and I preferred him to Hillary, but I don't think he's the greatest thing since sliced bread.

    What he is doing, is recognizing that post-baby-boomers have completely different assumptions from boomers.

    Polls have shown for a couple years now that people who identify themselves as religious are now defining that by more than hot button pelvic issues like gay marriage and abortion.

    and I'm not talking about "wacky non christian religions" like my own. This is the data you get when you poll evangelicals too: that they are recognizing tenets like social justice and compassion are being ignored in the framework of the infusion of faith into politics.

    Obama's just the first Dem that can speak clearly and intelligently enough to create a way for that same person to vote Democratic. All the Dems tried, when they started dropping the "G" word, and talking about their churches and their values... he's the one that figured out it's meaningful to go past that immediate potemkin village stuff, and get to what the role of faith in a political context is.

    Maybe I'm non-representative. I think he treats his audience as adults moreso than other candidates. He doesn't badger you or try to instill fear. He tries to pursuade you. And I think it's about time.

    PFnV
  19. otis p. driftwood

    otis p. driftwood Rookie

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    To some people, Hitler was reasonable. That's an objective statement.

    In other words, objectively speaking, what's reasonable or lucid or sexy, varies from person to person.

    Wes said he knows many reasonable people who don't like extremists hijacking "their" bible, one then has to point out those so called extremists don't think of themselves as extreme, and wes' point then becomes simply 'he knows people who don't like religious extremists'--which is fine. But to throw in the "reasonable" part changes what he said, and paints his friends as the only *cough* reasonable Christians, and everyone else is just crazy and wrong.

    So I was trying to point that out to him.

    I myself know plenty of people who's views of the Bible and world scare me. I know people (myself included) who don't care. I don't know as any of us are any more 'reasonable' than any of the rest of us--since we're all looking at each other through our own lens.
  20. otis p. driftwood

    otis p. driftwood Rookie

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    There's nothing here I can really disagree with (minus the personal opinions of the candidates).

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